Mister Moon wrote:Who decides on such things and who obeys ?
Sony corporate makes all final decisions, and those working below do as requested. This is one reason the new release did not appear two or three years ago, as originally planned. Corporate changed plans.
Thanks, drjohn. This answers perfectly one of my questions. Anybody can answer the others ?
Mister Moon wrote:So, what is the official explanation / justification for this ?
Was it ok to listen to / release this bit 30, 20, 10, 5 years ago, but it is not right now ?
Who decides on such things and who obeys ?
Are we going onwards or backwards ?
drjohncarpenter wrote:If said :20 is no longer on the disc, it is still available on Elvis: A Golden Celebration (1984/1998), The Complete Sun Sessions (1987), Sunrise (1999) and A Boy From Tupelo (2012). I'll wager you own at least one of these collections.
Of course, as with the Axton interview, it's not about the availability of the stuff.
It's about the set being deliberately incomplete.
But, as we can see in this message board, few of the self-appointed "hardcore fans" seem to complain, or even be bothered, by such ludicrous decisions.
A real shame.
Your discontent probably represents less than 1% of the people who will buy the 2017 release.
. Dr. John Carpenter, M.D. Stop, look and listen, baby <<--->> that's my philosophy!
chop983 wrote:So has there been work done other than disc 3.
Well they certainly removed a small bit of dialogue from Disc 2 so work must have been done there.
I have the set and it is high class all the way. And, I also have the original FTD set.
Mike, did they remove the "N" part of the dialog? If so, I certainly understand the decision.
No, they removed the whole dialogue before the slow outtake of 'Blue Moon Of Kentucky' - there's nothing at all there now
Keith
Thanks for the info, Keith. I guess I'll have to break out my copy of the FTD set and listen for myself. I am curious about this dialog segment now. Seems like an odd call to leave out these seconds.
chop983 wrote:So has there been work done other than disc 3.
Well they certainly removed a small bit of dialogue from Disc 2 so work must have been done there.
I have the set and it is high class all the way. And, I also have the original FTD set.
Mike, did they remove the "N" part of the dialog? If so, I certainly understand the decision.
No, they removed the whole dialogue before the slow outtake of 'Blue Moon Of Kentucky' - there's nothing at all there now
Keith
Thanks for the info, Keith. I guess I'll have to break out my copy of the FTD set and listen for myself. I am curious about this dialog segment now. Seems like an odd call to leave out these seconds.
The language in question is highly inflammatory and controversial in the U.S. In addition, there has been the misguided stigma over the years that Elvis was a racist, charges that are sadly still asserted by persons/artists in the entertainment industry to this day. So it is not a surprise that a release shepherded by Sony's music corporate division in the U.S. would omit the language in question for a mainstream release (how it made it on the '87 Complete Sun release and '99 Sunrise release is still a bit surprising, but perhaps there was not the same need for political correctness then as corporate may believe is necessary now).
Last edited by midnightx on Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mister Moon wrote:Who decides on such things and who obeys ?
Sony corporate makes all final decisions, and those working below do as requested. This is one reason the new release did not appear two or three years ago, as originally planned. Corporate changed plans.
Thanks, drjohn. This answers perfectly one of my questions. Anybody can answer the others ?
Mister Moon wrote:So, what is the official explanation / justification for this ?
Was it ok to listen to / release this bit 30, 20, 10, 5 years ago, but it is not right now ?
Who decides on such things and who obeys ?
Are we going onwards or backwards ?
drjohncarpenter wrote:If said :20 is no longer on the disc, it is still available on Elvis: A Golden Celebration (1984/1998), The Complete Sun Sessions (1987), Sunrise (1999) and A Boy From Tupelo (2012). I'll wager you own at least one of these collections.
Of course, as with the Axton interview, it's not about the availability of the stuff.
It's about the set being deliberately incomplete.
But, as we can see in this message board, few of the self-appointed "hardcore fans" seem to complain, or even be bothered, by such ludicrous decisions.
A real shame.
Your discontent probably represents less than 1% of the people who will buy the 2017 release.
I know that, drjohn and Keith, and I can assure you it doesn't represent a problem for me. Furthermore, I have always had a great respect for the minorities.
Still, nobody is able to give an explanation on why that bit of dialogue was ok for the previous official Sun releases, but it is censored right now.
Maybe we are indeed going backwards in more ways than we can imagine.
G-Hubb wrote:I don't know why you are not content as you've spent nothing and got nothing.
As an enthusiast of the music that's included in the set, I feel it's a disgrace that such blatant subjectivity can distort what should be the definitive presentation of this work.
That's put as succinctly as I can put it.
Can you understand it now ?
Not only now, but also then, as I said:
G-Hubb wrote:Look, I understand your frustration(s).
So don't buy it.
Oh, you haven't.
Problem solved.
I could have been disappointed that a DVD of all known Sun era footage wasn't included and moaned to say I think it should for the sake of completeness.
But the product is what it is and if it fell short of my expectations then its down to me to just not buy it.
I hope for you that in a few years there is a release that does meet with your approval - if so, please buy it.
I quite like that it's not quite complete, it almost teases us with an excuse to release an update in 10 years time with maybe another song, live...... or maybe otherwise. As for the price - how could we really complain????
G-Hubb wrote:I don't know why you are not content as you've spent nothing and got nothing.
As an enthusiast of the music that's included in the set, I feel it's a disgrace that such blatant subjectivity can distort what should be the definitive presentation of this work.
That's put as succinctly as I can put it.
Can you understand it now ?
Not only now, but also then, as I said:
G-Hubb wrote:Look, I understand your frustration(s).
So don't buy it.
Oh, you haven't.
Problem solved.
I could have been disappointed that a DVD of all known Sun era footage wasn't included and moaned to say I think it should for the sake of completeness.
But the product is what it is and if it fell short of my expectations then its down to me to just not buy it.
I hope for you that in a few years there is a release that does meet with your approval - if so, please buy it.
I quite like that it's not quite complete, it almost teases us with an excuse to release an update in 10 years time with maybe another song, live...... or maybe otherwise. As for the price - how could we really complain????
Mister Moon wrote:
Still, nobody is able to give an explanation on why that bit of dialogue was ok for the previous official Sun releases, but it is censored right now.
The present social/political climate in the U.S. suggests corporate may be more sensitive about producing a mainstream audio project with the language in question. If taken out of context, it will potentially add unwanted and unnecessary scrutiny and accusations about Elvis and erroneous charges of racism. We have entered an age of hypersensitivity, excessive political correctness, and a media forum where damaging accusations are made without consequence. Perhaps Sony simply does not want to subject Elvis to the nonsense, particularly with a project where the focus should be on the pioneering and historic recordings.
midnightx wrote:The present social/political climate in the U.S. suggests corporate may be more sensitive about producing a mainstream audio project with the language in question. If taken out of context, it will potentially add unwanted and unnecessary scrutiny and accusations about Elvis and erroneous charges of racism. We have entered an age of hypersensitivity, excessive political correctness, and a media forum where damaging accusations are made without consequence. Perhaps Sony simply does not want to subject Elvis to the nonsense, particularly with a project where the focus should be on the pioneering and historic recordings.
this explanation sounds good enough for me...and makes the most sense!!
laservampire wrote:So after some quick comparisons, here's the lowdown:
- Sound quality is identical to the 2012 set (thankfully)
- Some index points have been changed, and excess silence trimmed from the end of a couple of tracks
- The Mae Axton interview and "Too much Vaseline!..." dialogue have been omitted. (The latter is quite a disappointing bit of whitewashing IMHO)
- The new live "I Forgot To Remember" sounds great!
If you own the 2012 set and are able to purchase the new live track from Qobuz in lossless, there's really no reason to buy the new set.
Well, except perhaps to let Sony know that historical releases of music made over sixty years ago has value in the 21st century retail market.
As for the :20 of dialogue removed from Disc 2, it was apparently done at the very last minute.
. Dr. John Carpenter, M.D. Stop, look and listen, baby <<--->> that's my philosophy!
laservampire wrote:So after some quick comparisons, here's the lowdown:
- Sound quality is identical to the 2012 set (thankfully)
- Some index points have been changed, and excess silence trimmed from the end of a couple of tracks
- The Mae Axton interview and "Too much Vaseline!..." dialogue have been omitted. (The latter is quite a disappointing bit of whitewashing IMHO)
- The new live "I Forgot To Remember" sounds great!
If you own the 2012 set and are able to purchase the new live track from Qobuz in lossless, there's really no reason to buy the new set.
Well, except perhaps to let Sony know that historical releases of music made over sixty years ago has value in the 21st century retail market.
As for the :20 of dialogue removed from Disc 2, it was apparently done at the very last minute.
Source?. If not just pure speculation.... . Bye for now .
Maestro. Mike Windgren. Torero!!!!!!!!.
Always Trying To Make Peace <<--->> On FECC
Not The Best, Just The Coolest Guy Around!..
Viva el vino, viva el dinero, viva, viva el amor!!.
drjohncarpenter wrote:Well, except perhaps to let Sony know that historical releases of music made over sixty years ago has value in the 21st century retail market.
As for the :20 of dialogue removed from Disc 2, it was apparently done at the very last minute.
Source?. If not just pure speculation....
No source is required to understand that if an Elvis Legacy title of the quality of A Boy From Tupelo does not sell to expectations, the record company will not likely be interested in approving anything similar in the future. The information on the timing of the excision comes from someone on the project.
. Dr. John Carpenter, M.D. Stop, look and listen, baby <<--->> that's my philosophy!
drjohncarpenter wrote:Well, except perhaps to let Sony know that historical releases of music made over sixty years ago has value in the 21st century retail market.
As for the :20 of dialogue removed from Disc 2, it was apparently done at the very last minute.
Source?. If not just pure speculation....
No source is required to understand that if an Elvis Legacy title of the quality of A Boy From Tupelo does not sell to expectations, the record company will not likely be interested in approving anything similar in the future. The information on the timing of the excision comes from someone on the project.
Thanks! . Bye for now .
Maestro. Mike Windgren. Torero!!!!!!!!.
Always Trying To Make Peace <<--->> On FECC
Not The Best, Just The Coolest Guy Around!..
Viva el vino, viva el dinero, viva, viva el amor!!.
I've spent this evening enjoying this release all over again. This is without question the ultimate package on Elvis' early years. The booklet (with pictures that seem 'new' to this release's incarnation), the audio, etc. are stellar. I just have to give Ernst a well-deserved THANK YOU for this package. It really doesn't get any better than this. Great to finally have the Oct. recording of I Forgot To Remember To Forget.
Shop Graceland sells "A Boy From Tupelo" with a "free Elvis 45." The "free Elvis 45" is a gold standard single of "Suspicious Minds b/w You'll Think of Me." It comes in a plain white sleeve. I think these are for sale in the shops for 98 cents. Considering Walmart and Amazon are selling the CD set for around $26, paying $44 at Shop Graceland to get a "stock" single seems a little (a lot) pricey.
No source is required to understand that if an Elvis Legacy title of the quality of A Boy From Tupelo does not sell to expectations, the record company will not likely be interested in approving anything similar in the future. The information on the timing of the excision comes from someone on the project.
are you able to ask your contact on the project why the dialogue was cut?
that would put the issue to rest.
I know this has been mentioned before but does anyone know the story behind how the Eagles' Hall live recordings were located? I thought read on here that they were found in the 1970s at an old radio station and that several of the reels were damaged. Is that right?
Thanks,
Mike C
"You go to school. I'm going out to make a buck!"
Elvis as Danny Fisher
. Bye for now 
.
. Bye for now 
