"Such A Night" - Did Elvis "influence" McPhatter ?

[Mister Moon]

Well, not really.

McPhatter was a fully-formed singer and stylist by the time Elvis came along. It was, as everybody knows, the other way around : Clyde was one of Elvis’ strongest musical influences. No need to go through the whole story once again, I'm sure.

But here’s a small example of Elvis “influencing” Clyde.

“Such A Night”, a Lincoln Chase composition, was first recorded by Clyde McPhatter & The Drifters in November 1953, for Atlantic Records. It was a hugely successful record on the charts, and it was covered by many artists, from many different backgrounds : Johnnie Ray, Bunny Paul, The Four Lovers, Tommy Sands, Dinah Washington, The Joe Sawyer Trio, and others.

Then, in April 1960, Elvis cut the song in Nashville, at his first sessions after the Army period. The song was included as track 2 / side 2 of the legendary “Elvis Is Back !” album. In 1964, it was re-released as a single, backed with “Never Ending”.

And here’s where the story gets interesting. In early (March / April) 1962, Clyde McPhatter, already a solo act since the mid 50s, did a series of sessions for the Mercury label in Nashville, under the production of Shelby Singleton. Three of the songs scheduled to record were remakes of titles he had already done for Federal or Atlantic : “Sixty Minute Man”, “Money Honey”, and “Such A Night”.

Here’s the impressive list of musicians and backing vocalists used during those sessions (highlighted in bold red are the names also present on Elvis’ version) :

--Guitar : Jerry Kennedy, Kelso Herston, Harold Bradley, Ray Edenton.
--Bass : Bob Moore.
--Drums : Willie Ackerman, Buddy Harman.
--Harmonica : Charlie McCoy.
--Piano : Hargus Robbins.
--Trumpet : Bill Justis.
--Tenor Sax : Boots Randolph.
--Backing Vocals : The Merry Melody Singers (Margie Singleton, Millie Kirkham, Neal Matthews, Gordon Stoker, Ray Walker).

And here’s Clyde’s 1962 re-recording of “Such A Night” :

..

As you can hear, this track bears more than a passing resemblance to Elvis’ 1960 version. The sax riff played by Randolph as the intro is virtually the same. And the whole arrangement is very similar. However, note that at mid-song Clyde does the same beautiful modulation he had done nine years before, and which is absent from Elvis’ reading.

All in all, it’s not strange that this version may sound similar to Elvis’, having been recorded in Nashville with some of the same musicians and vocalists who had backed Elvis in his version only two years earlier.

And, make no mistake, it’s also a superb version by McPhatter, a consummate master, although his own 1953 original is probably unbeatable.

Anyway, I’ve always been a big fan of Elvis’ version, the first one I knew. I heard it for the first time on the album “A Legendary Performer Vol. 2”, and I was stunned. Later, I got to hear it in the correct context, “Elvis Is Back !”. I think it’s an absolute masterpiece, too. Elvis is in total, effortless, command, and clearly enjoying himself. Just fabulous.

------------------

By the way, here are the links to a couple of threads I recently started on FECC about the Elvis / Clyde matter, that may have been a bit "lost" in the "Classic Artists" section, particularly the first one listed. Thanks !!

**On "When The Swallows Come Back To Capistrano" : http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=78437

**On "Harbor Lights" : http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=78217

[drjohncarpenter]

Well, not really.

McPhatter was a fully-formed singer and stylist by the time Elvis came along. It was, as everybody knows, the other way around : Clyde was one of Elvis’ strongest musical influences. No need to go through the whole story once again, I'm sure.

But here’s a small example of Elvis “influencing” Clyde.

“Such A Night”, a Lincoln Chase composition, was first recorded by Clyde McPhatter & The Drifters in November 1953, for Atlantic Records. It was a hugely successful record on the charts, and it was covered by many artists, from many different backgrounds : Johnnie Ray, Bunny Paul, The Four Lovers, Tommy Sands, Dinah Washington, The Joe Sawyer Trio, and others.

Then, in April 1960, Elvis cut the song in Nashville, at his first sessions after the Army period. The song was included as track 2 / side 2 of the legendary “Elvis Is Back !” album. In 1964, it was re-released as a single, backed with “Never Ending”.

And here’s where the story gets interesting. In early (March / April) 1962, Clyde McPhatter, already a solo act since the mid 50s, did a series of sessions for the Mercury label in Nashville, under the production of Shelby Singleton. Three of the songs scheduled to record were remakes of titles he had already done for Federal or Atlantic : “Sixty Minute Man”, “Money Honey”, and “Such A Night”.

Here’s the impressive list of musicians and backing vocalists used during those sessions (highlighted in bold red are the names also present on Elvis’ version) :

--Guitar : Jerry Kennedy, Kelso Herston, Harold Bradley, Ray Edenton.
--Bass : Bob Moore.
--Drums : Willie Ackerman, Buddy Harman.
--Harmonica : Charlie McCoy.
--Piano : Hargus Robbins.
--Trumpet : Bill Justis.
--Tenor Sax : Boots Randolph.
--Backing Vocals : The Merry Melody Singers (Margie Singleton, Millie Kirkham, Neal Matthews, Gordon Stoker, Ray Walker).

And here’s Clyde’s 1962 re-recording of “Such A Night” :

..

As you can hear, this track bears more than a passing resemblance to Elvis’ 1960 version. The sax riff played by Randolph as the intro is virtually the same. And the whole arrangement is very similar. However, note that at mid-song Clyde does the same beautiful modulation he had done nine years before, and which is absent from Elvis’ reading.

All in all, it’s not strange that this version may sound similar to Elvis’, having been recorded in Nashville with some of the same musicians and vocalists who had backed Elvis in his version only two years earlier.

And, make no mistake, it’s also a superb version by McPhatter, a consumate master, although his own 1953 original is probably unbeatable.

Anyway, I’ve always been a big fan of Elvis’ version, the first one I knew. I heard it for the first time on the album “A Legendary Performer Vol. 2”, and I was stunned. Later, I got to hear it in the correct context, “Elvis Is Back !”. I think it’s an absolute masterpiece, too. Elvis is in total, effortless, command, and clearly enjoying himself. Just fabulous.

Elvis' 1960 performance is sinfully good -- his singing is almost pornographic, as someone else once said. It's not a surprise Clyde heard and emulated it.

If the elusive take 4 of "Such A Night" from the Presley session is finally released to the fans, we'll likely hear a very telling lyric change, one which probably informed the finished master.

Very nice post!!

[jonesELfan]

Elvis' 1960 performance is sinfully good -- his singing is almost pornographic, as someone else once said. It's not a surprise Clyde heard and emulated it.

If the elusive take 4 of "Such A Night" from the Presley session is finally released to the fans, we'll likely hear a very telling lyric change, one which probably informed the finished master.

Very nice post!!

Is the version credited on the legendary performer not really the forth take? Can you elaborate at all about the lyric change?

[Mike Windgren]

Hi there!! .

It looks like take 4 has never been released in ful form . Take a look on this cool website: http://www.keithflynn.com/recording-sessions/600403.html, you might find the answer over there . Bye for now .

[drjohncarpenter]

Elvis' 1960 performance is sinfully good -- his singing is almost pornographic, as someone else once said. It's not a surprise Clyde heard and emulated it.

If the elusive take 4 of "Such A Night" from the Presley session is finally released to the fans, we'll likely hear a very telling lyric change, one which probably informed the finished master.

Very nice post!!

Is the version credited on the legendary performer not really the forth take? Can you elaborate at all about the lyric change?

On 1976's Elvis: A Legendary Performer Volume 2, Joan Deary used takes 2 and 3 (both false starts) and just the introduction to take 4.

The playful lyric change apparently involves what Elvis remembers about his night ...

[jonesELfan]

Elvis' 1960 performance is sinfully good -- his singing is almost pornographic, as someone else once said. It's not a surprise Clyde heard and emulated it.

If the elusive take 4 of "Such A Night" from the Presley session is finally released to the fans, we'll likely hear a very telling lyric change, one which probably informed the finished master.

Very nice post!!

Is the version credited on the legendary performer not really the forth take? Can you elaborate at all about the lyric change?

On 1976's Elvis: A Legendary Performer Volume 2, Joan Deary used takes 2 and 3 (both false starts) and just the introduction to take 4.

The playful lyric change apparently involves what Elvis remembers about his night ...

Elvis: A Legendary Performer vol 2 was the first album I ever bought for myself (I was ten and it cost approximately four lawns). I had listened to my mom's collection of lps and singles but this started my own collection. Sadly, his death was just around the corner. Thanks for giving me the new insight into the album.

[drjohncarpenter]

Elvis' 1960 performance is sinfully good -- his singing is almost pornographic, as someone else once said. It's not a surprise Clyde heard and emulated it.

If the elusive take 4 of "Such A Night" from the Presley session is finally released to the fans, we'll likely hear a very telling lyric change, one which probably informed the finished master.

Very nice post!!

Is the version credited on the legendary performer not really the forth take? Can you elaborate at all about the lyric change?

On 1976's Elvis: A Legendary Performer Volume 2, Joan Deary used takes 2 and 3 (both false starts) and just the introduction to take 4.

The playful lyric change apparently involves what Elvis remembers about his night ...

Elvis: A Legendary Performer vol 2 was the first album I ever bought for myself (I was ten and it cost approximately four lawns). I had listened to my mom's collection of lps and singles but this started my own collection. Sadly, his death was just around the corner. Thanks for giving me the new insight into the album.

It was one of my very first LPs as well, and I just loved both Volume 1 and Volume 2, the booklets, the interviews, the masters, the outtakes, what a delight!

[jonesELfan]

[quote="drjohncarpenter"

It was one of my very first LPs as well, and I just loved both Volume 1 and Volume 2, the booklets, the interviews, the masters, the outtakes, what a delight![/quote]

Volumes 3 and 4 were a bit disappointing in comparison. Volume 2 set the bar pretty high with the glimpses of the man behind the music, etc. Just hearing his laughter elevated tracks like "Cane and a High starch Collar" to real entertaining gems. Of course, since I was 10 going on 11, I found that song hilarious!

Back on topic a bit, Such a night as always been a favorite, even when I was too you to really get the song. The energy, whimsy and intensity Elvis brings to the tune is amazing. I have always wanted an Elvis uncensored album. Not one filled with just raunchy jokes but actual solid performances that just gave that peak into his humor and more adult side. (One night of Sin vs One Night with You for instance).

[ekenee]

"Such a Night" just happens to be in my own personal top 10.

I first heard it on the radio and I was stunned on how great Elvis' vocals were.

No one can touch it, not even Elvis.

It is Elvis at his coolest, smoothest, and is as fresh today as when I first heard it.

He obviously loved the song, using it in Hawaii in 1961, again messed around with it during the reheasals in July 1970,

and finally in 1976 of all years, he gave it a couple of pretty decent live run thru's in december.

[drjohncarpenter]

"Such a Night" just happens to be in my own personal top 10.

I first heard it on the radio and I was stunned on how great Elvis' vocals were.

No one can touch it, not even Elvis.

It is Elvis at his coolest, smoothest, and is as fresh today as when I first heard it.

He obviously loved the song, using it in Hawaii in 1961, again messed around with it during the reheasals in July 1970,

and finally in 1976 of all years, he gave it a couple of pretty decent live run thru's in december.

Three live performances in 16 years, two of which were unrehearsed, doesn't seem like a whole lotta love.

[ekenee]

"Such a Night" just happens to be in my own personal top 10.

I first heard it on the radio and I was stunned on how great Elvis' vocals were.

No one can touch it, not even Elvis.

It is Elvis at his coolest, smoothest, and is as fresh today as when I first heard it.

He obviously loved the song, using it in Hawaii in 1961, again messed around with it during the reheasals in July 1970,

and finally in 1976 of all years, he gave it a couple of pretty decent live run thru's in december.

Three live performances in 16 years, two of which were unrehearsed, doesn't seem like a whole lotta love.

On the surface it doesn't, but for him to at least keep in touch with the song for that long shows that he
didn't totally forget about it like many more of his other early efforts.

And it's a difficult song to pull off, and that is what I meant when I said no one can touch it, not even Elvis, because I think
he knew he couldn't do it justice by the 70's. That studio version is a master-piece.

[drjohncarpenter]

It's only difficult if one doesn't make an effort. Every great song in the Presley catalog could have sounded just as awesome in concert. If Elvis had wanted it that way.

[ekenee]

It's only difficult if one doesn't make an effort. Every great song in the Presley catalog could have sounded just as awesome in concert. If Elvis had wanted it that way.

I love Elvis and I wish that were true but I don't think so.

Here's why. THe band was different. The voices were different.

The stamps or imperials sounded nothing like the Jordanaires.

The most important thing is, Elvis' constantly changing voice.

In 1960 he didn't sound like 1956, and in 1968 he didn't sound like 1960, and 1975 he didn't sound like 1968. See the pattern?

He wasn't like Johnny Mathis or even Johnny Cash for that matter, where their voices didn't dramatically change alot.

So even if he had the jords, and his original band, his concert takes on his old songs were never going to sound the same.

Those 1950's early 60's records are priceless. I don't think they could have ever been fully recreated. Perhaps to some degree if he worked on them more,
but not to he degree you are saying.

[drjohncarpenter]

None of those other things matter if you don't rehearse.

[Deke Rivers II]

Sometimes things are not what them "Seem"......I think that was used in "Twin Peaks"........

[mysterytrainrideson]

Don't know how i missed this thread. Never heard the 1962 re-make by Clyde, thanks for posting that, Mister Moon and nice bits of info too. Love Clyde's work for Atlantic Records and the stuff he did with the Dominoes, all classics!

[ekenee]

None of those other things matter if you don't rehearse.

I don't think that is the issue because when Elvis did rehearse such as in spring of 1972, he rehearsed

his early songs, rushed, just as he played them in concert.

He wasn't trying to recreate his records.

He played them just as he rehearsed them, twice as fast as they should have been.

[drjohncarpenter]

None of those other things matter if you don't rehearse.

I don't think that is the issue ...

You are wrong.

Professional musicians rehearse the songs they are going to perform for an audience. Even the Sex Pistols rehearsed.

And we are not generally speaking of rehearsed, complete, but poorly-arranged, songs from the Presley catalog but of his weak, sloppy and unrehearsed one-offs of "Such A Night" in 1976.

You need to stay on point if you are going to engage in a credible discussion. Maybe someday.

[ekenee]

None of those other things matter if you don't rehearse.

I don't think that is the issue ...

You are wrong.

Professional musicians rehearse the songs they are going to perform for an audience. Even the Sex Pistols rehearsed.

And we are not generally speaking of rehearsed, complete, but poorly-arranged, songs from the Presley catalog but of his weak, sloppy and unrehearsed one-offs of "Such A Night" in 1976.

You need to stay on point if you are going to engage in a credible discussion. Maybe someday.

I'm on point. I think you were off the mark about the rehearsal issue.


My perfectly on point reply was that even if Elvis rehearsed "Such a night", it may not have mattered much anyway,
since he had a pattern of rushing his oldies.


But I will give you this, you are more "on-point" when you talk about the poorly arranged songs from his catalog.

He needed better arrangements and correct tempos, and then, rehearse them that way.

But..........even then, his voice in 1976, was not his voice in 1960, so how great would a rehearsed version of "Such a night" be in 1976?

So, bottomline, isn't this all a moot point?

[docfreem]

Quite funny to see Clyde state "You stole all my moves" at the end of T.T.W.I.I. Special edition party sequence

[rjm]

Wonderful topic!

One thing, I may have to read it again, but, Doc, are you holding back something about what Elvis "remembered" about "that night"? On take 4?

Because that's quite a tease. Sounds like fun!

Again, Mr. Moon, terrific topic!

rjm

Sent From My Phabulous Galaxy Note II Phablet Using Tapatalk 4

[drjohncarpenter]

Wonderful topic!

One thing, I may have to read it again, but, Doc, are you holding back something about what Elvis "remembered" about "that night"? On take 4?

Because that's quite a tease. Sounds like fun!

Maybe someday we'll all know better.

[mike edwards66]

.

[Mister Moon]

Aaron Neville was/is a fan of both Elvis and Clyde McPhatter. He does a nice version.

Although he references Clyde, to me this is more Elvis.

Beautiful version, too !

The arrangement is more Elvis, but a few nuances ("I know I'll never forget..") are pure Clyde.

Thanks, mike edwards66 !

[mike edwards66]

.