Which tracks are you referring to? And by clipping, do you mean digital overs or clipped intros?elvissessions wrote:
If I may inject just a bit more personal opinion, as I'm doing so, I am absolutely baffled as to where a couple of these Lene Reidel transfers stem from. There is clipping on a couple of tracks that I haven't matched up to other versions.
Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Moderators: FECC-Moderator, Moderator5, Moderator3, Site Mechanic
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
This is going to be a recurring problem ...
I'm trying to be careful to use "clipping" only when I mean the waveform distortion of an excessive signal.
I am still trying to find a good alternative term for missing musical openings/closings.
[EDIT: for the moment, I'm not able to confirm my impression from last week that some of the Lene-credited material sounds unlike previous releases (not necessarily for the better), with the exception of I'm a Roustabout. So I'm retracting that statement for the time being.]
I'm trying to be careful to use "clipping" only when I mean the waveform distortion of an excessive signal.
I am still trying to find a good alternative term for missing musical openings/closings.
[EDIT: for the moment, I'm not able to confirm my impression from last week that some of the Lene-credited material sounds unlike previous releases (not necessarily for the better), with the exception of I'm a Roustabout. So I'm retracting that statement for the time being.]
Last edited by elvissessions on Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- Posts: 1360
- Registered for: 16 years 10 months
- Has thanked: 23 times
- Been thanked: 111 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
I seem to rememeber it being so on the vinyl. I get my set tomorrow, I will make a comparison for you.Claus wrote:Honky Tonk Angel IS clipped but it sounded the same way on the non-remixed BMG cd. I don't have the album on vinyl.
"Growing old is mandatory...........growing up is optional "
-
- Posts: 8818
- Registered for: 21 years 5 months
- Location: Roanoke, Virginia
- Has thanked: 4848 times
- Been thanked: 1826 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
I just listened to my copy of the Franklin Mint, "Songs of the Seventies" disc and I was appalled at how bad "Promised Land" sounded.
Not to mention the clip at the beginning is atrocious.
Not to mention the clip at the beginning is atrocious.
I don't care what Ed Van Halen says about me--all's I know is that Howard Stern and Mr. Rogers like me just the way I friendly am! - David Lee Roth
-
- Posts: 8818
- Registered for: 21 years 5 months
- Location: Roanoke, Virginia
- Has thanked: 4848 times
- Been thanked: 1826 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
I just listened to my copy of the Franklin Mint, "Songs of the Seventies" disc and I was appalled at how bad "Promised Land" sounded.
Not to mention the clip at the beginning is atrocious.
Not to mention the clip at the beginning is atrocious.
I don't care what Ed Van Halen says about me--all's I know is that Howard Stern and Mr. Rogers like me just the way I friendly am! - David Lee Roth
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Thanks!elvissessions wrote:This is going to be a recurring problem ...
I'm trying to be careful to use "clipping" only when I mean the waveform distortion of an excessive signal.
I am still trying to find a good alternative term for missing musical openings/closings.
As to your question, lemme do a quick double-check on one track in particular I have in mind ... I'll get back to you as quick as I can.
I did a comparison between the Elvis Today FTD and the same tracks on the FM set and some of the tracks from FM are actually clipped, while the ftd isn't.
-
- Posts: 5755
- Registered for: 19 years 8 months
- Location: BCN, Spain
- Has thanked: 98 times
- Been thanked: 1863 times
- Age: 48
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Overall, my USA Promised Land vinyl sounds generally worse than the USA Good Times... And about Honky, it's that way on the vinyl.
Today masters sound very good on the FTD. The bad thing was that each group of songs (masters, platinum, sunset, TT&F and New ones) all sounded different from each other, even at different volumes.
Thanks God I use realgain. Indeed I couldn't live without it, as there's nothing more annoying for me than listening to different songs at different volumes. Tom Jones 24 hours was mastered at around 97 db, while some elvis cds from the 80's sound in the low 80's. The difference in sound actually awoke my child in the car one day.
Today masters sound very good on the FTD. The bad thing was that each group of songs (masters, platinum, sunset, TT&F and New ones) all sounded different from each other, even at different volumes.
Thanks God I use realgain. Indeed I couldn't live without it, as there's nothing more annoying for me than listening to different songs at different volumes. Tom Jones 24 hours was mastered at around 97 db, while some elvis cds from the 80's sound in the low 80's. The difference in sound actually awoke my child in the car one day.
Iván
La voz del Rey
La voz del Rey
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
for the moment, I'm not able to confirm my impression from last week that some of the Lene-credited material sounds unlike previous releases (not necessarily for the better), with the obvious exception of I'm a Roustabout. So I'm retracting that statement for the time being.
-
- Posts: 3450
- Registered for: 14 years 1 month
- Has thanked: 34 times
- Been thanked: 129 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Some people get worked up over minor issues.
"You go to school, I'm going out to make a buck"
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
I did not find the sound to be unaccetable overall, by any means.I just listened to my copy of the Franklin Mint, "Songs of the Seventies" disc and I was appalled at how bad "Promised Land" sounded.
Saying that the error is unaccetable to me is a bit different than saying it's atrocious, in my mind.Not to mention the clip at the beginning is atrocious.
Certainly I'll be swapping in the Elvis 75 version, no doubt about it, but the track is hardly rendered unlistenable because of this defect:
Elvis 75's intro followed by Franklin Mint's
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Certainly would be a major concern for me as this is one of the best recordings from that decade and a personal favourite overall. I'm with Walken on this one - it needs more cowbell!elvissessions wrote:Certainly I'll be swapping in the Elvis 75 version, no doubt about it, but the track is hardly rendered unlistenable because of this defect:
Elvis 75's intro followed by Franklin Mint's
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Some people do -- and sometimes I do.Some people get worked up over minor issues.
But the point of this thread is to note for posterity, as best we can, those anomalies that exist on this set for those interested in a historical and archival record.
All indications are that taken collectively these are THE Elvis masters for the foreseeable future.
If there are errors or discrepancies, I believe we should keep track of those.
Some are very difficult to discuss objectively, and some things cannot be determined with 100 percent certainty.
But I am trying to maintain a list of observations that may provide a useful reference point for the future.
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
We lack a definitive benchmark right now to judge the opening of "She's Not You," but here are three versions:
Complete Masters
From Nashville to Memphis
Potluck (Follow That Dream)
There's less lead-in, but contrary to an assertion earlier, I hear the aspirate sound of the "h" on the Complete Masters.
Thoughts?
Complete Masters
From Nashville to Memphis
Potluck (Follow That Dream)
There's less lead-in, but contrary to an assertion earlier, I hear the aspirate sound of the "h" on the Complete Masters.
Thoughts?
Last edited by elvissessions on Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Sounds fine to me.elvissessions wrote:We lack a definitive benchmark to judge the opening of She's Not You, but here are three versions:
Complete Masters
From Nashville to Memphis
Potluck (Follow That Dream)
There's less lead-in, but contrary to an assertion earlier, I hear the aspirate sound of the "h" on the Complete Masters.
Thoughts?
-
- Posts: 9176
- Registered for: 14 years 4 months
- Location: Germany, pretty close to Bad Nauheim
- Has thanked: 1855 times
- Been thanked: 1183 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
They probably wanted to get rid of the drop-out right at the beginning and therefore edited it. That would explain the lesser lead-in.
Somebody said it's complete on the Elvis75 Box.
I'll stick to that then, as it's the same mastering.
Have to compare it though.
Somebody said it's complete on the Elvis75 Box.
I'll stick to that then, as it's the same mastering.
Have to compare it though.
When the evening shadows fall
And you're wondering who to call
For a little company
There's always me
And you're wondering who to call
For a little company
There's always me
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Here is confirmation that "Spring Fever" has consistently been released with a clipped opening.
Complete Masters
Original FTD pressing
Double Features
CMG budget release
Right now, I do not have an original vinyl reference, but the consistency with which this has been released suggests it will match.
Similar to "Scratch Your Back," it is inappropriate at this time to list this as an error, as it appears this does match the original master. I will, however, add it to the notes section of the original post.
[Poste edited to amend clip from the Double Features disc.]
Complete Masters
Original FTD pressing
Double Features
CMG budget release
Right now, I do not have an original vinyl reference, but the consistency with which this has been released suggests it will match.
Similar to "Scratch Your Back," it is inappropriate at this time to list this as an error, as it appears this does match the original master. I will, however, add it to the notes section of the original post.
[Poste edited to amend clip from the Double Features disc.]
Last edited by elvissessions on Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
ES: Has the correct version of Black Star finally been released officially on cd?
The acetate of Black Star, as released on the 'Black Star' EP by Bilko, is the original Composite Master with repaired ending (Spliced from Take 13 & Insert #1 Take 5). The "Master" of Black Star on 'Double Features - Flaming Star / Wild In The Country / Follow That Dream' and 'Collectors Gold' is just Take 13 without the repaired ending (Insert #1 Take 5).
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Then I can conclude that My Happiness from the Elvis 75 box is also mastered by Reidel because the waveform looks identical to the one that Licky posted from the Complete set.elvissessions wrote: These credits suggest that Doncha Think It's Time (LP master), I'm Yours, Lover Doll (LP master) and Tomorrow Night (overdubbed version) on the Franklin Mint set are drawn from Lene Reidel's mastering.
No official information has been released that contradicts these credits as of Nov. 14, 2010.
-
- Posts: 10104
- Registered for: 21 years 6 months
- Location: New Jersey
- Has thanked: 4130 times
- Been thanked: 2253 times
- Age: 47
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
IIRC, the intro to "Spring Fever" on the 1993 Double Features release actually starts on the 1 second countdown mark to the track. I think it was a CD mastering error and meant you couldn't easily skip to this track to hear it in full.elvissessions wrote:Here is confirmation that "Spring Fever" has consistently been released with a clipped opening.
Complete Masters
Original FTD pressing
Double Features
CMG budget release
Right now, I do not have an original vinyl reference, but the consistency with which this has been released suggests it will match.
Similar to "Scratch Your Back," it is inappropriate at this time to list this as an error, as it appears this does match the original master. I will, however, add it to the notes section of the original post.
Last edited by Mike C on Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"You go to school. I'm going out to make a buck!"
Elvis as Danny Fisher
Elvis as Danny Fisher
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Good catch ... However, in fact, even if you roll it back to the start of the track, it is still clipped. ... I will repost a sample ASAP.
-
- Posts: 10104
- Registered for: 21 years 6 months
- Location: New Jersey
- Has thanked: 4130 times
- Been thanked: 2253 times
- Age: 47
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Thanks! Yeah, it is an error that had always stood out in my mind.elvissessions wrote:Good catch ... However, in fact, even if you roll it back to the start of the track, it is still clipped. ... I will repost a sample ASAP.
"You go to school. I'm going out to make a buck!"
Elvis as Danny Fisher
Elvis as Danny Fisher
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
That might be a bit of a jump. I have to wonder if it derives from any restorative work Kevan has done for the Sun project.Claus wrote:Then I can conclude that My Happiness from the Elvis 75 box is also mastered by Reidel because the waveform looks identical to the one that Licky posted from the Complete set.
One thing I've learned over the years is that mixing and mastering credits are inconsistent. If anything it wouldn't surprise me if "My Happiness" comes from the same late 80s digital transfer of the acetate - which I understand is not physically owned by or in the possession of Sony. So digital similarities can be expected.
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
Here is the replacement segment from the Double Features version of "Spring Fever," which is miscued on the end of the track "Girl Happy." As I say, the "S" is still missing.
http://www.da-ol-pu.com/uploads/df2_12-Girl_Happy-Spring_Fever_intro.mp3
I will revise my earlier posts to include this clip.
http://www.da-ol-pu.com/uploads/df2_12-Girl_Happy-Spring_Fever_intro.mp3
I will revise my earlier posts to include this clip.
Last edited by elvissessions on Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
Topic author - Posts: 2554
- Registered for: 20 years 8 months
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
[EDIT: Speculation on "There's a Honky Tonk Angel (Who Will Take Me Back In)" deleted for now.]
We'll need an original vinyl pressing of this to be sure, and I do not have one.
We'll need an original vinyl pressing of this to be sure, and I do not have one.
Last edited by elvissessions on Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Complete Masters compared/contrasted with Franklin Mint
When was that remastered disc released?elvissessions wrote:I can confirm that the opening of "There's a Honky Tonk Angel (Who Will Take Me Back In)" is missing a moment of sound at the start, compared with the remastered Promised Land disc.