First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by MaryAnn »

Elvis’s musical sensibilities and his creative processes are absolutely fascinating to me. It always seems to me that the truer he was to his instincts, the better the outcome.




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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by fn2drive »

Juan Luis on Sun May 06, 2018 10:35 pm wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 8:21 pm wrote:
Juan Luis on Sun May 06, 2018 7:38 pm wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 11:29 am wrote:
jetblack on Sun May 06, 2018 7:54 am wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 3:37 am wrote:Given that Elvis conceived of this as a duet, does anyone know why with all the reimaginings that have been tried why an effort to produce a bonafide of this song hasn’t been tried. IIRC this is the only non movie track that Elvis thought worthy of a duet.
Elvis put a LOT of work into this song.

March 15, 1971 was when he duetted with backup vocalist Ginger Holladay

On May 21, 1971 he tried again with Temple Riser.

It made it's official LP debut when it appeared on 'Elvis In Demand'' (Feb 1977). The LP reached number #26 in the UK album chart. After Elvis death in September 1977 it peaked at #12.

..

Andy
This is one of my favorite post 1970 tracks despite it being a little over the top on the power vocals and post production. But Elvis’s sings with real emotion and Jerry Carrigan’s drumming is fantastic here-in some ways it makes the song.

You’re points are why I asked-so much effort applied. Neither of the duet attempts with those singers worked well. It just seems that it would be worth trying to find a voice that works to complete Elvis’ vision.

Was Elvis inspired to cut this after hearing Roberta Flack’s rendition which was released around the time he entered the studio?

As a PS. The December 76 versions are wonderful as well. Indeed more delicate and nuanced at a time where that was hard for Elvis to muster. Perhaps it’s not possible to find a bad version of this song.
No they aren't. Surprised about your take. Goes to show you are obsessed with exceptions that YOU like. Funny, that.
Look I’m not saying any 1976 Elvis was good. Just that all things considered those late December renditions are something I enjoy. They are subtle and Elvis attempts to imbibe them with genuine emotion. He pulls it off as well as he can given where he was. That is what makes them wonderful for me.
And a bit out of breath and pitchy. But you degrade other live song performances others enjoy for the same reasons you enjoy this one.
Doc captures precisely why I like the late December performance. But you should feel free to criticize the track any way you like. It was 1976 so any insult you hurl at it is likely true. I still enjoy it because it is a rare performance for the time in which Elvis attempts to channel his inner soul. In your continuing zeal to defend all things Elvis, you always miss my point. You can like and enjoy whatever you want. But just because one may like it doesn’t make it good.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Juan Luis »

fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 11:18 pm wrote:
Juan Luis on Sun May 06, 2018 10:35 pm wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 8:21 pm wrote:
Juan Luis on Sun May 06, 2018 7:38 pm wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 11:29 am wrote:
jetblack on Sun May 06, 2018 7:54 am wrote:
fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 3:37 am wrote:Given that Elvis conceived of this as a duet, does anyone know why with all the reimaginings that have been tried why an effort to produce a bonafide of this song hasn’t been tried. IIRC this is the only non movie track that Elvis thought worthy of a duet.
Elvis put a LOT of work into this song.

March 15, 1971 was when he duetted with backup vocalist Ginger Holladay

On May 21, 1971 he tried again with Temple Riser.

It made it's official LP debut when it appeared on 'Elvis In Demand'' (Feb 1977). The LP reached number #26 in the UK album chart. After Elvis death in September 1977 it peaked at #12.

..

Andy
This is one of my favorite post 1970 tracks despite it being a little over the top on the power vocals and post production. But Elvis’s sings with real emotion and Jerry Carrigan’s drumming is fantastic here-in some ways it makes the song.

You’re points are why I asked-so much effort applied. Neither of the duet attempts with those singers worked well. It just seems that it would be worth trying to find a voice that works to complete Elvis’ vision.

Was Elvis inspired to cut this after hearing Roberta Flack’s rendition which was released around the time he entered the studio?

As a PS. The December 76 versions are wonderful as well. Indeed more delicate and nuanced at a time where that was hard for Elvis to muster. Perhaps it’s not possible to find a bad version of this song.
No they aren't. Surprised about your take. Goes to show you are obsessed with exceptions that YOU like. Funny, that.
Look I’m not saying any 1976 Elvis was good. Just that all things considered those late December renditions are something I enjoy. They are subtle and Elvis attempts to imbibe them with genuine emotion. He pulls it off as well as he can given where he was. That is what makes them wonderful for me.
And a bit out of breath and pitchy. But you degrade other live song performances others enjoy for the same reasons you enjoy this one.
Doc captures precisely why I like the late December performance. But you should feel free to criticize the track any way you like. It was 1976 so any insult you hurl at it is likely true. I still enjoy it because it is a rare performance for the time in which Elvis attempts to channel his inner soul. In your continuing zeal to defend all things Elvis, you always miss my point. You can like and enjoy whatever you want. But just because one may like it doesn’t make it good.
And that is where you are mistaken. For the rest of it, it is the same excuse you do not allow in others.



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by MaryAnn »

Juan, I’d be very interested in hearing your thoughts about “The First Time Ever I Saw Your Face.”



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by SteamrollerBlues »

MaryAnn on Sun May 06, 2018 8:36 pm wrote:The definitive performance of the song IMO...

..
I saw Paul live a few years back (he performed at our 'Music in the Library' series, headed by my mother). I don't recall if he did this song, but this is a beautiful version.



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by MaryAnn »

When.it came to ballads and love songs, Elvis’s unembellished voice combined with a song he truly believed in was all that was needed.

I’m forever grateful for “Danny Boy,”. Shame about “White Christmas”



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by drjohncarpenter »

fn2drive on Sun May 06, 2018 5:49 pm wrote: Thanks Doc for taking my innocent question and filling in all the details around this track. I forgot about the Joyce Bova connections and the reminiscences of the 2 female duet partners are great.

I believe you are about a duet. He may well have struck gold if he either worked it harder or found the perfect voice to complement his. Even if the track doesn’t have 2018 hit potential, I would welcome a perfect voice to complete Elvis vision.

One of the striking things about Ginger Holladay's memory of her duet session in March 1971 was how she was shocked at the material being considered. And in her teen-age naiveté (she did not turn twenty until April 28th), she simply asked why Presley was considering demos that were "different" (i.e. bad) from what she knew he did in Memphis just two years earlier.

During one of the RCA sessions in 1971, Elvis was listening to demos of songs to possibly pick to record for that evening’s session. All the musicians, backup singers and Memphis Mafia were sitting around listening along with him. I was curious about the material he was listening to because it was so different from the songs he had recorded on the “From Elvis in Memphis” album, which had put him back at number one [sic] on the Billboard charts.

After about the sixth song that we heard, none of which Elvis seemed to like, I got up my nerve to go over and ask him why he didn’t consider recording more songs like he had recorded in Memphis. I did not understand the politics of the publishing world and was naïve about how all that worked. He and Charlie Hodge, musician and confidant, were sitting together and they kind of brushed off my innocent question by making a joke and laughing.

Any way you cut it, that's kind of a sad moment.
Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by drjohncarpenter »

MaryAnn on Sun May 06, 2018 6:37 pm wrote:“The First Time Ever I Saw Your Face” is a perfect example of a song that spoke to Elvis. He could hear himself singing it. I’m not sure why Elvis envisioned it as a duet. The title and subject matter suggest a solo singer as it is written in the 1st person — (I saw your face). The melody does cry out for harmony, but background singers could have handled those duties.

The perfect voice for this track was his — and his alone. A missed opportunity. A committed, focused Elvis would have owned this song.
One might argue that Elvis envisioned the song as a duet because he imagined both individuals feeling the same magic upon meeting each other, or what some call kismet, and wanted to convey that in his recording. And although the released master in 1972 is disappointing, I don't think you can call his work uncommitted or unfocused.

MaryAnn on Sun May 06, 2018 10:02 pm wrote:When.it came to ballads and love songs, Elvis’s unembellished voice combined with a song he truly believed in was all that was needed.

I’m forever grateful for “Danny Boy,”. Shame about “White Christmas”
I'm not sure why "White Christmas" deserves any shame. Elvis' 1957 recording is a delight from start to finish, not only borrowing the Drifters arrangement that nearly topped r&b charts in 1955, but also taking time to emulate Clyde McPhatter's beautiful lead tenor in the first half of the classic single.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Samain on Mon May 07, 2018 12:49 am wrote:Although I heard Elvis's version of this song long before I heard the original by Roberta Flack, I like both versions. I think Elvis should be credited though for not just copying Roberta's, and singing it as he wanted to do it. The duets (or are they just harmony vocals?) are nice too.
Of course Roberta Flack's recording isn't the original, just perhaps the best known. There've been scores of recordings, starting with the songwriter's muse, Peggy Seeger, although I cannot determine exactly when she might have released her version. In 1962 many folk acts picked up on the song, like the Kingston Trio, and it grew from there.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Fabbe »

Beside the duet versions. The are 2 released versions out there of this song: one where Elvis sings alone and another with Elvis singing with the choir and different overdubs. Does anyone know how this come about?


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by henryneill »

Very interesting discussion here.

The 1971 sessions were always fascinating for me, as Elvis recorded some songs where he really sounds fully committed and I think he tried something very different with some of these: The First Time..., I'm Leavin', It's Only Love, I'll Be Home On Christmas Day, Holly Leaves And Christmas Trees, Early Morning Rain, the Ivory Joe Hunter songs, the jams of Merry Christmas Baby and Dylan's Don't Think Twice It's All Right. I must confess I also like the much bashed studio version of My Way. I can see why Elvis' wasn't happy with it and why it wasn't released at the time, but I think it's a very interesting take on the song.
Samain on Mon May 07, 2018 10:54 am wrote:One thing that puzzles me though, if Ginger's "duet" only used one mike, how could they remove her vocals (per Keith Flynn's website)?
As I understand it, Elvis' and Ginger's vocals from March were both removed, only the backing track was used for the re-recordings in May.

@Fabbe
There are different mixes of the single version. I think the 70's Box is a remix, the other is the original mix.



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by r&b »

I first heard this song in 1965 on Ligthfoot's debut album. It remains my favorite version. The simple arrangement and Gordon's unbelievable voice are something to treasure here. Elvis should have adopted a similar arrangement when he was going thru his folk phase in 1971, but his voice wasnt this strong at the time.





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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Juan Luis »

MaryAnn on Sun May 06, 2018 11:41 pm wrote:Juan, I’d be very interested in hearing your thoughts about “The First Time Ever I Saw Your Face.”
It's a favorite for years now. The 70's boxset mix without background vocals is my go to version. I wish Elvis had approached it in a softer, understated fashion. And no, the overdubs did not detract, for the most part. One only has to listen to the drumming to tell Elvis was looking for a big sound right from the start.
Since the duet version with Mary Holladay is just singing in harmony with Elvis throughout, a mix with her voice much lower would have sounded really nice, in my opinion.




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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by poppii »

I love both the Elvis version and Roberta Flack's . Both pretty powerful but Elvis' version sounds like a love song to a current love whereas Roberta's sounds a bit more as if she has lost that love . Hers is more depressing in that sense.

Its the same with Blueberry Hill for me....Elvis and Fats Domino....both very very good but with Elvis singing the same song.....he sounds fresher, younger more intense.

Not keen on Elvis doing a duet with anybody apart from how Lisa Marie did and just the one off.




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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by rickeap »

The studio original is a major misfire to my ears, but I really like the December 76 live version



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Fabbe »

henryneill on Mon May 07, 2018 1:23 pm wrote:
@Fabbe
There are different mixes of the single version. I think the 70's Box is a remix, the other is the original mix.
Thanks. So on the single the mix s the one with the choir?


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by elvis-fan »

The mix with the two ladies just doesn't sound right... their voices don't mesh well with Elvis' IMO. Like Juan mentioned, it may have been better if their voices weren't quiet as prominent in the mix. Anyway, they're not really duets with Elvis singing lead and the female vocalist simply singing harmony throughout without solos by either performer. I don't mind the released version but I rarely listen to it anymore as it's not one of my favorites... along the lines of Until It's Time For You To Go. I first heard FTEISYF on the EAP box set back in 1980.



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Dan_T »

According to the daughter of the author of the song, Kirsty MacColl, her Dad, Ewan MacColl, despised Elvis's version...playing it at home to wind him up ! he said, according to Kirsty, it sounded like Elvis was singing at the bottom of the "Post Office Tower"
in other words, he was singing too loudly.

I much prefer his live versions from '76.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Dan_T on Mon May 07, 2018 5:45 pm wrote:According to the daughter of the author of the song, Kirsty MacColl, her Dad, Ewan MacColl, despised Elvis's version...playing it at home to wind him up ! he said, according to Kirsty, it sounded like Elvis was singing at the bottom of the "Post Office Tower"
in other words, he was singing too loudly.

I much prefer his live versions from '76.
Actually, Ewan MacColl is on record as hating all the cover versions, save the one by apple of his eye, Peggy Seeger. Not sure where you get your story from, but it's not a memory from Kirsty MacColl, but daughter-in-law, Justine Picardie.
MacColl made no secret of the fact that he disliked all of the cover versions of the song. His daughter-in-law wrote: "He hated all of them. He had a special section in his record collection for them, entitled 'The Chamber of Horrors'. He said that the Elvis version was like Romeo at the bottom of the Post Office Tower singing up to Juliet. And the other versions, he thought, were travesties: bludgeoning, histrionic, and lacking in grace."

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Her father-ln-law's problem with Elvis' version is that he finds it is way over the top. And he's right, it is.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Fabbe »

Is this the version that was released as single?

..


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by Steve Morse »

Fabbe on Tue May 08, 2018 8:21 am wrote:Is this the version that was released as single?

..
Not sure, Juan, but I like it !


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by henryneill »

Fabbe on Tue May 08, 2018 9:21 am wrote:Is this the version that was released as single?

..
I'd say yes, but I never owned the original single.



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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by DayVee Bee »

No this sounds like the 1995 remix from '70s box to me :)
The 45 had more prominent backing vocals IIRC
Last edited by DayVee Bee on Tue May 08, 2018 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by drjohncarpenter »

Fabbe on Tue May 08, 2018 12:21 am wrote:Is this the version that was released as single?

..
This appears to be the same audio as the one I posted on page one, taken from the 1995 '70s box. The title of your video does include the words "NEW EDIT" ...

This might be the 1972 single version, RCA 74-0672 :


..


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Re: First Time Ever I Saw Your Face

Post by MRM »

The last known live performance by Elvis is remarkable for being off-the-cuff, and totally sincere.


"Everybody lay out here except David Briggs."


..

Elvis Presley "The First Time Ever I Saw Your Face" (Birmingham, AL - Wednesday, December 29, 1976)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0EM8YdFDYo&t=34m09s
... here, the unique Presley magic weaves a spell over the listener, making it seem incandescent by comparison. And this song is the key to the entire concert, for it is here that one realizes that the entire show must've been inspired by his affection for new girlfriend Ginger Alden! He begins "First Time" by saying "we'll do this for you, sweetheart" and during certain parts of the song he says "listen". That wasn't for the 18,000 paying customers. For the final "ever I lay with you" verse (which he never recorded in a studio) he orders an on-the-spot arrangement of voice and electric piano ("Everybody lay out here except David Briggs") which results in a spine-tingling moment that is the essence of Elvis Presley, vocalist supreme and great American artist.

http://www.elvis-collectors.com/birmingham.html


Man, in hindsight, this is quite a number in the 1970s Presley catalog, given that virtually no one today associates it with him.[/quote]


He's also quite lucid for a 1976 show, which is why I can listen to the December 1976 live recordings more than any others from that year. I thought I read, here or elsewhere, that Dr. Nick has weaned him off his usual meds without his knowing for most of the month?