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The "TTWII" film: 1970 vs. 2001 versions

Fri Jan 13, 2006 10:33 pm

Not to be the unsigned booster of Likethebike reviews, but I also want to direct your attention to the terrific comparison of the original 1970 version of "That's the Way It is" and the 2001 "do-over" version, courtesy of the "Review" section. Check out the link:

"'That's the Way It Is'- The Recut'" by Likethebike

http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/v ... highlight=

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Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:55 am

Without getting too complicated or analytical That's The Way It Is should have retained in the SE version a little more of the original performances IMO. The whole point was to make the film better. The outtakes should add not subtract from the original. Suspicious Minds original cut with better sound should have remained intact plus Can't Help Falling In Love and leaving the I Just Can't Help ...in the new cut. Great that they removed the geeks and the stupid cat. Great review by likethebike Imo.

Sat Jan 14, 2006 1:15 am

I've watched some outtakes tonight and the shoulder roll ending on "Suspicious Minds" from August 12 DS is just unbelievable. And it must have been a spontaneous thing. Ronnie Tutt bangs his drums forever while Elvis is down on his knees. To me it seems like he's thinking: "What the hell am I supposed to do now?" Then he's smiling and all of a sudden he's doing those AMAZING shoulder movements and gets up and punches his hand in the air while Tutt is going bonkers on the drums. I laugh every time I see that, it's so deleted - see guidelines #2 cool!!

Keith Richards, Jr.

Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:08 am

Spot on Keef! I really wish they'd left that in. It's one of the highlights on the King's career from a performance point of view. Up there with the Gold Lame stuff from Canada in 57. A totally outstanding piece of showmanship!

Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:10 am

quote:

geeks and the stupid cat.

************************

The owner of the cat said he was a good fan. So he can't be that stupid.

such is life!

Sat Jan 14, 2006 4:12 pm

I love the SE but I really miss 'Bridge', 'Caroline', 'Lost You' and especially 'Believin' which is presented in sound only during the menu, boy is that just rubbing it in :twisted:

Sat Jan 14, 2006 4:22 pm

Overall the special edition is a much better film than the original because it focuses on Elvis and his music.

However, performances like “Bridge” and “I Just Can’t Help Believin’” should have been included in the special edition.

It makes no sense to see Elvis worrying about forgetting the words to “Believin’” back stage when the song has been edited out of the performance footage. I’m wondering whether the dreaded publishing issues were to blame for this?

It’s always nice to see new footage, but the original performance of “Suspicious Minds” is outstanding and really should have remained in the new edition of the film.

Had the extra features been included on the disc, the new version of “Suspicious Minds” would have been a worthy extra.

Sat Jan 14, 2006 4:46 pm

But the hour that was cut at the last minute wasn't someting the producers wanted to do, so we can't really compare with the intended release and the original because we got what was admittedly an inferior product to the one they wanted us to have.

I still don't think that hour included "Believin'" though, so that does still grate a bit.

As for the shoulder roll from the 11th DS, it wasn't spontaneous in that it wasn't unique. Elvis performs that in other show(s) from the engagement - but I won't say it wasn't spontaneous every time :lol:

Sat Jan 14, 2006 6:42 pm

I too think they should've kept the August 12 version of Suspicious Minds. It's such a tour de force of a performance. Had they kept this, as well as Bridge Over Troubled Water; I Just Can't Help Believin'; I've Lost You; and Sweet Caroline they would have preserved the 'structural integrity' of the original film's performances while at the same time enhancing them with the additional performances.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 3:35 pm

Not to be the unsigned booster of Likethebike reviews, but I also want to direct your attention to the terrific comparison of the original 1970 version of "That's the Way It is" and the 2001 "do-over" version

I'm with Greg Nolan - and the article is now on EIN as well! (with added photos).

Plus, this week I rediscovered our EIN interview with Rick SchmidlinProducer of the TTWII Recut.

I can't believe that he mentioned the possibility of him recutting 'Elvis On Tour' as a subsequent project. (I had forgotten that he said it at the time, it seemed so inevitable back in 2000!)

Cheers
Piers

Sun Jan 15, 2006 3:54 pm

PiersEIN wrote:
Not to be the unsigned booster of Likethebike reviews, but I also want to direct your attention to the terrific comparison of the original 1970 version of "That's the Way It is" and the 2001 "do-over" version

I'm with Greg Nolan - and the article is now on EIN as well! (with added photos).

Plus, this week I rediscovered our EIN interview with Rick SchmidlinProducer of the TTWII Recut.

I can't believe that he mentioned the possibility of him recutting 'Elvis On Tour' as a subsequent project. (I had forgotten that he said it at the time, it seemed so inevitable back in 2000!)

Cheers
Piers




And what a joke that turned out to be. Thanks Rick hyping EOT for the fans, then letting us down.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 3:58 pm

How is it hype when he said it was only a possibility ?

It was accurate, and still is to a degree. The only way it would be hype is if we ignored the "possibility" but then that would be our fault and we would be the ones hyping it to ourselves.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:44 pm

Rebel it can't be publishing issues as the song plays on the menus for the DVD.

Schmidlin probably had every intention of doing a revamp of EOT but sales of "That's the Way it Is" were disappointing as everyone admits. The disc showed up on some best seller lists but the amount of work that went out into it including finding and restoring the film (look at the difference in picture quality in both versions) and in re-editing the piece was probably very expensive. Perhaps mega sales were needed to cover the bottom line.

I found the Schmidlin interview fascinating. I don't understand the suits cutting the extra footage before the DVD went on the market. You would think that it would help boost sales of an item that was just on TV not long before. You give people something new to see and buy.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:25 pm

Ah! I didn't realise that that was or might have been part of the set up.

The pre screening on TV of the release was the same as what ended up being released, but was it supposed to be an editted version of what was in store on the hour long extra DVD ?

Were the sales damaged because there was nothing more on the DVD than everyone had just taped off the TV ?

I ask only in the regard of the US market. The film wasn't shown in the UK on TV and sales in the UK were very good.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:32 pm

Steve that was why I waited a long time to buy it especially since it deleted such an outstanding performance as "I Just Can't Help Believing". I felt as if as not only was I not getting something new but was somehow being short-changed.

Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:59 pm

The feeling of being short changed is nothing new to us Elvis fans, though I do feel we are too hard on the suppliers normally. In the case of TTWII-SE I think we are justified to feel short changed.

Amazingly, it did cost a fair bit to restore and upgrade, so that makes it worse for them to have spent that money on doing it for another hours worth of footage only to leave it off.

Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:00 pm

I like the SE of TTWII much better than the original movie, but they should have included the "old film" for historic reasons.

Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:05 am

I don't think any extras had to be restored Steve. I think fans would have taken them as is. I mean we accepted original TTWII in that quality all that time.

Tue Jan 17, 2006 1:10 am

It was restored, it must have been.

The release with the extra hour on it was done and dusted. It was only then that they had to pull and hour of it to give us the release as we now know it.

That hour would have had the same restoration work done on it as the rest of the movie did otherwise why have a movie with part enhanced and part still poorer original.

Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:45 am

Hi Gang,
So did it just come down to the Turner marketing department guessing that . . .
a) The same number of Elvis fans would buy it with or without the extras.
(I think they would be right when considering all FECC & EIN members. I don't know anyone who didn't buy it 'cos of the lack of extras)

b) The extra cost of licensing the 'bonus' songs for DVD wouldn't be worth their profit margin.

Perhaps it possibly came down to the 'Are You Lonesome Tonight' owner causing so much trouble over that one song for the original film credits. As he caused so much trouble (& asked for far too much money for DVD re-licensing) maybe Turner gave up on the prospect of trying with all of the rest of the songs for the bonus DVD.

If that was the case it is very very sad.

Cheers
Piers

Wed Jan 18, 2006 1:27 am

Thanks for the links, Piers.
This portion caught my eye:

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EIN: We would love you to clarify something for fans. We have read about your frustration in not being able to get the rights for "Are You Lonesome Tonight" for the film - which surprisingly was OK'd for "Elvis The Concert". EIN would have thought that MGM/Turner would have the rights to the film footage and surely the rights to song itself has been OK'd 1000 times before for every Elvis release? How can they say "no" to you using the footage for the video? After all isn't it just more money in their pocket for the same song ?

Rick Schmidilin: The owner of that song is not Elvis -friendly, film rights are different than "The Concert"


I wonder if he the AYLT publishers had dollars in their eyes only, or somehow thought the new TTWII was going to be some kind of blockbuster. Or just had ill-feelings about E's infamous '77 version from CBS-TV and "This Is Elvis"?

The copyright and publishing laws are absurd. I read this weekend that Martin Luther King's famous "I Have A Dream" speech (from 1963) amazingly is not public domain yet but owned by the family. So many schools are forced to use just edits and snatches. Unbelievable.

TTWII

Wed Jan 18, 2006 5:16 am

I imagine some fans have already burned their own DVD's incorparating the missing songs into the revised TTWII. I guess we should just be thankful we have both versions, but it is hard to see how Believin' could have been left out. Wish we had a revised Elvis on Tour, although I find the fan bits in it a little more interesting, like the old man at the elevator, and the airport greeting. Wonder if there were more songs recorded at the jam with the Stamps? They used those few songs over and over in He Touched Me, got monotonous after awhile!

Thu Jan 19, 2006 1:12 am

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Either that or we line each DVD up to each other. Unfortunately, the older DVD is harder to find and I think many will find it hard short of the import market.

I'm still amazed how much of TTWII footage finally came out this year on the import scene.


The '70 Elvis is so outrageously "on" (save perhaps occasionally too much humor) that I really hope someone does a '68 Comeback-style 3-DVD set someday.