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Elvis' January 1954 Sun Acetate - Secrets Revealed!

Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:38 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:Note that super collector Sean O'Neal confirmed in an interview that "Casual Love Affair" does indeed exist. Let's hope it finds a home on BMG, along with the flip side.

Really? On acetate or tape? Was it part of the 3rd acetate? What happened to it?

I think it's very likely that Elvis did a 3rd private recording on June, 1954... just a few weeks before Sam Phillips called him for an "audition"...
I don't think Sam would think of Elvis (nor Marion) on June to try the song "Without You" if his last visit to the Memphis Recording Service was half-a-year ago (January 4th, 1954)...
It makes more sense to think Elvis thought: "Oh, well, third time's a charm" and went to cut a third acetate on June 5th, to get attention from Sam... Elvis all alone, strumming his acoustic guitar, and dreaming of success... and then the rest is history.

(But I wouldn't be 100% sure that 3rd acetate has survived or we'd have heard of it after 56 years... or maybe it's in private hands... only time will tell.)
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Last edited by JimmyCool on Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:58 am, edited 2 times in total.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun Acetate - Secrets Revealed!

Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:31 am

JimmyCool wrote:I think it's very likely that Elvis did a 3rd private recording on June, 1956...

If he did, it was done while on tour.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:56 am

LOL, I meant 1954... that was a typo :D
I've corrected it now, thanks

What happened to "Casual Love Affair"?

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:10 am

JimmyCool wrote:LOL, I meant 1954... that was a typo :D
I've corrected it now, thanks

What happened to "Casual Love Affair"?

That's what I want to know!

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:47 am

And, if a third acetate was recorded, what might the flip side be? Could "Tiger Man" be a possibility? Perhaps the upcoming Sun project may tell us more...

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 6:03 am

Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:And, if a third acetate was recorded, what might the flip side be? Could "Tiger Man" be a possibility? Perhaps the upcoming Sun project may tell us more...

I don't think it was "Tiger Man"... Elvis was much more into ballads kinda stuff... IMHO.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:28 am

JimmyCool wrote:
Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:And, if a third acetate was recorded, what might the flip side be? Could "Tiger Man" be a possibility? Perhaps the upcoming Sun project may tell us more...

I don't think it was "Tiger Man"... Elvis was much more into ballads kinda stuff... IMHO.



I agree. The third acetate implies that this was done pre-first session.

The June 1954 time period is the most likely.

And besides Elvis indicated that "Tiger man" was to be his second record, so that implies he was already with
Sun records for awhile and that it was a professional session.

And like jimmycool says, Elvis was really into ballads to show off his skills.

My gut feeling is that the flip side is "Cold cold icey fingers".

Elvis' January 1954 Sun Acetate -- Secrets Revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:09 pm

ekenee wrote:My gut feeling is that the flip side is "Cold cold icey fingers".

Could be a good choice, since he sang "Keep Them Icy Fingers Off Of Me" (or "Cold, Cold Icey Fingers") at The Annual Minstrel Show at Humes High School, the year before...
Story goes that he was called back for an encore, so maybe he tried to repeat that "success" and decided to record that lucky song to see if could impress Sam Phillips and finally get his attention (as the other two previous times clearly didn't work.)

I also think the fact that the late Marion Keisker was quoted several times saying that Elvis' second acetate was "I'll Never Stand In Your Way" backed with "Casual Love Affair" is because he DID record "Casual Love Affair" as a private acetate, only it was his third... and she just mixed up the song titles of the second and third visit, and named the songs she remembered him recording...
After all he was a John Doe paying to make a dub of his own voice, so she just remembered parts of how the things happened... with some embellishment as the years went by (same as Sam.)
Still, the fact that she remembered him may has something to do with the way he looked, his style (strange style for a white guy back then)... if not for that, she probably wouldn't remember very much about him and his first visits at MRS.
...all IMHO :wink:

Image

EDIT: I found a quote by ColinB, wh says pretty much the same:
ColinB wrote:The origin for the titles of the acetates was simply how Sun's Marion Keisker recalled them.
Remember, this was an unknown kid wandering in wanting to pay to cut personal discs.

Nobody took detailed notes !

Years later, Marion attempted to put the titles into chronological order.
She may have mistakenly telescoped three acetates into two !

(...)

The Doc has suggested the song might be Careless Love, but surely Marion would have been familiar with that one?
It is a fascinating part of the Elvis story about which we know very little !

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:50 pm

ekenee wrote:I agree. The third acetate implies that this was done pre-first session.

The June 1954 time period is the most likely.

And besides Elvis indicated that "Tiger man" was to be his second record, so that implies he was already with
Sun records for awhile and that it was a professional session.

And like jimmycool says, Elvis was really into ballads to show off his skills.

My gut feeling is that the flip side is "Cold cold icey fingers".


Interesting thought, ekenee, re "Cold Cold Icey Fingers"

All of the preceding acetates showed Elvis' love of ballads. Perhaps the other song could be the much-discussed "Without You". The clips of the demo that have appeared over the years show that Elvis could have successfully recorded the song. The June timeframe fits with Elvis' attempts at the song. Perhaps he obtained an acetate of his performance in order to continue working on the song.

However...if Elvis was really trying to get noticed, maybe he would have recorded an uptempo number to get Marion and Sam's attention. So maybe an acetate version of something like "Tiger Man" would have been a good choice.

I wonder if Elvis counted his acetate recordings as a "record"?

One could easily imagine an 18-year old kid proudly holding his one and only copy of "My Happiness/That's Where Your Heartaches Begin" and calling it his first record. Maybe an acetate of "Tiger Man" was recorded next (as his "second record") and was either worn out, lost, given away, or broken, leading Elvis to say that not many people got to hear it.

Just a thought...

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 6:01 pm

Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:
ekenee wrote:I agree. The third acetate implies that this was done pre-first session.

The June 1954 time period is the most likely.

And besides Elvis indicated that "Tiger man" was to be his second record, so that implies he was already with
Sun records for awhile and that it was a professional session.

And like jimmycool says, Elvis was really into ballads to show off his skills.

My gut feeling is that the flip side is "Cold cold icey fingers".


Interesting thought, ekenee, re "Cold Cold Icey Fingers"

All of the preceding acetates showed Elvis' love of ballads. Perhaps the other song could be the much-discussed "Without You". The clips of the demo that have appeared over the years show that Elvis could have successfully recorded the song. The June timeframe fits with Elvis' attempts at the song. Perhaps he obtained an acetate of his performance in order to continue working on the song.

However...if Elvis was really trying to get noticed, maybe he would have recorded an uptempo number to get Marion and Sam's attention. So maybe an acetate version of something like "Tiger Man" would have been a good choice.

I wonder if Elvis counted his acetate recordings as a "record"?

One could easily imagine an 18-year old kid proudly holding his one and only copy of "My Happiness/That's Where Your Heartaches Begin" and calling it his first record. Maybe an acetate of "Tiger Man" was recorded next (as his "second record") and was either worn out, lost, given away, or broken, leading Elvis to say that not many people got to hear it.

Just a thought...



Or another long shot theory is this.

Remember Elvis stated in an early interview that he went in and made a personal record and about year later the guy put the record out.

Just what if....that third acetate was a guitar strumming version of "That's all right".

Technically not the record, but the song itself.

That surely would have gotten him noticed.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:14 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj2Jg0sQ ... re=related

This is a far superior source to tweedlee Dee by the way....

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:59 pm

Rtn 2 Sndr wrote:...One could easily imagine an 18-year old kid proudly holding his one and only copy of "My Happiness/That's Where Your Heartaches Begin" and calling it his first record.
Maybe an acetate of "Tiger Man" was recorded next (as his "second record") and was either worn out, lost, given away, or broken, leading Elvis to say that not many people got to hear it.
Just a thought...


IIRC, he said Tiger Man 'nearly became my 2nd record'.

Maybe Marion [or Sam] said "What are you going to sing ?" and he sang a bit of it to them & they said:

"Oh, an uptempo song doesn't sound right without a band, don't you know any slow songs ?"

So he did I'll Never Stand In Your Way/[It Wouldn't Be The Same] Without You instead with just his guitar.

Hence "Tiger Man was nearly my second record, but not many got to hear it !"

Or:

At Sun, when trying to find a follow-up to his first single, they ran through Tiger Man but Sam wasn't happy with the playback, & they went on to something else.

Elvis' comment would fit both versions !

Now why didn't someone ask him what he meant at the time ?

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:37 pm

ColinB wrote:
IIRC, he said Tiger Man 'nearly became my 2nd record'.


He mentioned it as his second record in at least a few shows from 1970... Example: august 19 MS "the second record that I recorded was called Tiger Man".

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Wed Aug 25, 2010 2:29 am

billyblues wrote:
ColinB wrote:
IIRC, he said Tiger Man 'nearly became my 2nd record'.


He mentioned it as his second record in at least a few shows from 1970... Example: august 19 MS "the second record that I recorded was called Tiger Man".

I feel inspiration coming on. Look for a new topic ASAP.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Wed Aug 17, 2011 10:19 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
billyblues wrote:
ColinB wrote:
IIRC, he said Tiger Man 'nearly became my 2nd record'.


He mentioned it as his second record in at least a few shows from 1970... Example: august 19 MS "the second record that I recorded was called Tiger Man".

I feel inspiration coming on. Look for a new topic ASAP.

My inspired topic is here:

Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=55284

Enjoy the magic!

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:27 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
billyblues wrote:
ColinB wrote:
IIRC, he said Tiger Man 'nearly became my 2nd record'.


He mentioned it as his second record in at least a few shows from 1970... Example: august 19 MS "the second record that I recorded was called Tiger Man".

I feel inspiration coming on. Look for a new topic ASAP.

My inspired topic is here:

Elvis Recorded "Tiger Man" At Sun --> Mystery Solved ?
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=55284

Enjoy the magic!


David Copperfield has nothing on you!

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:56 am

This is the second time today you have revived one of your old posts for no real reason.

Missing your name in lights :D

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Thu Aug 18, 2011 11:46 am

Give me a 1953 unplugged version of Tiger Man an I'm good to go fro a while! :mrgreen:

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:32 pm

KiwiAlan wrote:This is the second time today you have revived one of your old posts for no real reason.

Missing your name in lights :D


Maby it's because...Image

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:28 am

promiseland wrote:
KiwiAlan wrote:This is the second time today you have revived one of your old posts for no real reason.

Missing your name in lights :D


Maby it's because...Image

Yes!

Or perhaps it's because he never creates topics of his own, and he's jealous at the extremely high quality of mine.

Re:

Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:06 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:The peerless Master & Session Web site has now posted both Sun acetate receipts. Presley shelled out at least $16.50, a large sum for a teenager in 1954. Perhaps he wanted to be noticed ...

January 4, 1954 visit:

Image

June 5, 1954 visit:

Image

Note that super collector Sean O'Neal confirmed in an interview that "Casual Love Affair" does indeed exist. Let's hope it finds a home on BMG, along with the flip side.

Are there more Sun acetates? Perhaps. Although no receipt may exist -- Sam Phillips would've paid for any rehearsal acetates he made specifically with Elvis.

It turns out, according to Ger Rijff himself, that the receipt printed in his book "The Rock'n'Roll Years-My Wish Came True" turns out to be a fake. The one thing that doesn't quite add up is the amount paid $8.25. The "Boy From Tupelo" says it cost $3.98 including tax. I don't know if that $3.98 is for one or two songs?? If it's for one song, than to do a B-side you would have to pay another $3.98, add that up and it comes to $7.96. So that $8.25 that's written on the receipt don't make sense.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:56 pm

What happened to the first acetate? Does Ed Leek still have it? I say this because at the time Ed first discovered it in his house, RCA said they weren't interested in buying the disc, but only interested in making a tape copy of it.

Re: Re:

Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:47 pm

mysterytrainrideson wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:The peerless Master & Session Web site has now posted both Sun acetate receipts. Presley shelled out at least $16.50, a large sum for a teenager in 1954. Perhaps he wanted to be noticed ...

January 4, 1954 visit:

Image

June 5, 1954 visit:

Image

Note that super collector Sean O'Neal confirmed in an interview that "Casual Love Affair" does indeed exist. Let's hope it finds a home on BMG, along with the flip side.

Are there more Sun acetates? Perhaps. Although no receipt may exist -- Sam Phillips would've paid for any rehearsal acetates he made specifically with Elvis.

It turns out, according to Ger Rijff himself, that the receipt printed in his book "The Rock'n'Roll Years-My Wish Came True" turns out to be a fake. The one thing that doesn't quite add up is the amount paid $8.25. The "Boy From Tupelo" says it cost $3.98 including tax. I don't know if that $3.98 is for one or two songs?? If it's for one song, than to do a B-side you would have to pay another $3.98, add that up and it comes to $7.96. So that $8.25 that's written on the receipt don't make sense.


Man, those sure look legit to me.

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:57 pm

mysterytrainrideson wrote:What happened to the first acetate?

I thought the first acetate was My Happiness/That's When Your Heartaches Begin from July '53... and I'll Never Stand in Your Way/It Wouldn't Be the Same (Without You) from January '54... with the final unknown being from June '54???

Re: Elvis' January 1954 Sun acetate -- secrets revealed

Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:18 pm

mysterytrainrideson wrote:It turns out, according to Ger Rijff himself, that the receipt printed in his book "The Rock'n'Roll Years-My Wish Came True" turns out to be a fake.


Never read this -- where does Rijff state it is a forgery?

mysterytrainrideson wrote:What happened to the first acetate? Does Ed Leek still have it? I say this because at the time Ed first discovered it in his house, RCA said they weren't interested in buying the disc, but only interested in making a tape copy of it.


Elvis' Humes High friend, Ed Leek, the pal who encouraged Presley to make that July 1953 visit to 706 Union for the private recording -- and fronted him the money -- passed away in June 2010. The original disc, which Elvis left at Ed's home in 1954, was licensed for release by RCA back in the late 1980s, and some cassette dubs slipped out elsewhere. Years later Leek made it known he wanted to sell the original 12" acetate, as he wanted to use the money for his retirement years. Where it ended up after that is unclear.