Off Topic Messages

Who wins at their peak - ALI or TYSON ?

MUHAMMAD ALI
9
64%
MIKE TYSON
5
36%
 
Total votes : 14

Re: Tyson on Ali

Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:44 pm

Pete Dube wrote:
Mitch wrote:I remember seeing a highlight of a fight when a old white guy caught Ali with a good left hook that put him down. The end of the round saved Ali from being knocked out.


I believe that was British champ Henry Cooper, and he was a good, tough fighter. Canadian George Chuvalo also put Ali on his keester with a left hook. Ali was strangely susceptible to left hooks and I've occasionally wondered if he had a problem with peripheral vision in his right eye.


Thanks Pete for the name. I couldn't remember it. :)

::rocks

Re: Tyson on Ali

Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:46 pm

Pete Dube wrote:Canadian George Chuvalo also put Ali on his keester with a left hook...

I don't recall that.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:53 pm

I love these threads. Would Ali have beaten Tyson? Is Lincoln a better President than Obama? Who did the better version of My Boy? I guess we'll never know.

::rocks

Re: Tyson on Ali

Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:58 pm

Delboy wrote:I love these threads. Who did the better version of My Boy? I guess we'll never know.

::rocks


Wow, that's a thinker!!

I think Rob does a GREAT version of "My Boy" in the shower! :oops:

::rocks

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 12:20 am

elvisalisellers wrote:
Pete Dube wrote:Canadian George Chuvalo also put Ali on his keester with a left hook...

I don't recall that.


elvisalisellers, I just checked and I was wrong about the knockdown. This fight was shown on ESPN a couple of years ago and Chuvalo did tag Ali with surprisingly frequent left hooks, but he didn't knock him down. I just mis-remembered. Chuvalo was one incredibly tough man.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 12:28 am

Pete Dube wrote:
elvisalisellers wrote:
Pete Dube wrote:Canadian George Chuvalo also put Ali on his keester with a left hook...

I don't recall that.


elvisalisellers, I just checked and I was wrong about the knockdown. This fight was shown on ESPN a couple of years ago and Chuvalo did tag Ali with surprisingly frequent left hooks, but he didn't knock him down. I just mis-remembered. Chuvalo was one incredibly tough man.

First fight was very competitive.
Second fight Ali won convincingly.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 2:20 am

Ali was a great fighter and is a GREAT man.

Breaks my heart to see him in his current health condition. :(


Mitch

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:35 am

Delboy wrote:I love these threads. Would Ali have beaten Tyson? Is Lincoln a better President than Obama? Who did the better version of My Boy? I guess we'll never know.

::rocks


Was Abraham Lincoln a greater President than BARAK OBUMMA? :facep: :lol: Yes, I guess we'll never know!!!!! :lol:

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:20 am

Cooper was not in Ali's league in truth, but very likely would have got the knockout if the punch had landed earlier in the round. Sometimes power is enough.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 1:45 pm

Bodie wrote:If both boxers met in their prime then Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds but the longer the fight would go on then the fight would be in Ali's favour with a late stoppage or a points win.

The one thing that is over-looked with a prime Tyson is his defence.

In the 80's just before the Burbick fight and a few defences, Tyson hardly got hit cause of his peek-a-boo style which is something he stopped doing around the time of his first fight with Bruno and then things went down-hill from there and he just depended on his punching power.

The boxer that caught a prime Tyson with a cracking shot was Tony Tucker in the 1st round, a superb upper-cut that stopped Tyson in his tracks but he took it very well and went on to win the fight on points.
Tyson also had a great chin, Ali was not a one-shot puncher but his talent was wearing fighters down and he wouldn't have been able to do that with a prime Tyson in the early rounds.
Ali always had problems with short little men and a prime Tyson was so much better than a prime Frazier.
The best fight to see of a prime Tyson that lasted long enough to see what a great boxer he was is the Pinklon Thomas fight.


Totally agree Bodie-The general public's perception of Tyson is of a savage fighter with no real skills except power but the prime Tyson was one of the best defensive boxers ever,he also had really fast hands that could rival Ali's but the difference was he had the punching power Ali never had.
Who know's who would have won a fight between them? It's already been said that they were from different era's so it's not really fair to pit them against each other.All that can be said is that each would have had their hands full with each other.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 9:37 pm

Pete Dube wrote:
elvisalisellers wrote:
Pete Dube wrote:Canadian George Chuvalo also put Ali on his keester with a left hook...

I don't recall that.


elvisalisellers, I just checked and I was wrong about the knockdown. This fight was shown on ESPN a couple of years ago and Chuvalo did tag Ali with surprisingly frequent left hooks, but he didn't knock him down. I just mis-remembered. Chuvalo was one incredibly tough man.


Pete,

You might be thinking of Chuck Wepner.

He put Ali down in the 9th with a body punch in '75.

Sly Stallone apparently got the idea of the Rocky films from this fight.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:03 pm

Didn't Ali say it wasn't a knockdown, that Wepner stepped on his foot!

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:21 pm

If you study the Wepner "knockdown", Ali is going backwards before the nothing punch to his ribs actually lands.
The ref [Tony Perez] who erroneously ruled it as a knockdown, was the same ref who controversially stopped Ali in his tracks, when stunning Frazier in the second fight.

Ali went on to take Wepner apart for the remainder of the fight, before finally stopping him in the final round.

phpBB [video]

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:56 pm

elvisalisellers wrote:If you study the Wepner "knockdown", Ali is going backwards before the nothing punch to his ribs actually lands.
The ref [Tony Perez] who erroneously ruled it as a knockdown, was the same ref who controversially stopped Ali in his tracks, when stunning Frazier in the second fight.

Ali went on to take Wepner apart for the remainder of the fight, before finally stopping him in the final round.

phpBB [video]



If YOU study the fight, you will see Wepner punch Ali in the ribs and he go down regardless if Ali is going backwards.

Its an official knockdown.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:21 am

Bodie wrote:If YOU study the fight, you will see Wepner punch Ali in the ribs and he go down regardless if Ali is going backwards.
Its an official knockdown.

Some friendly advice for you, lay off with the "YOU" capitals.


For anyone else interested, you can quite clearly see [particularly at the angle at 0:26] that something has unbalanced Ali, prior to the "punch" actually landing.

Ali gesticulates with Perez as soon as he gets up, with a notion pointing towards his feet.

Every boxing expert worth his salt has referred to this as an erroneous knockdown.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:51 am

elvisalisellers wrote:
Bodie wrote:If YOU study the fight, you will see Wepner punch Ali in the ribs and he go down regardless if Ali is going backwards.
Its an official knockdown.

Some friendly advice for you, lay off with the "YOU" capitals.


For anyone else interested, you can quite clearly see [particularly at the angle at 0:27] that something has made Ali unbalanced prior to the "punch" actually landing.

Ali gesticulates with Perez as soon as he gets up, with a notion pointing towards his feet.

Every boxing expert worth his salt has referred to this as an erroneous knockdown.


You know, you really have a terrible attitude so don't start with the 'let me give you some friendly advice' trying to scare me cause it won't work.

I have brought some intelligent input into this discussion and you just want to turn it into a fight.

I tried to explain to you that regardless if Ali lost balance when he stepped back or tripped, he was hit with a body-punch and went down on his backside, if you've actually been in a ring like i have you would know this.

I don't think you want to accept your hero Ali was knockdown by an unknown like Wepner but he was.

It was an official knockdown and the ref gave the correct decision, let it go.

To cheer you up i do think Ali was the greatest Heavyweight of all time, with Joe Louis a close second.

Have a nice day, peace and love. :smt052

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:07 am

Bodie wrote:You know, you really have a terrible attitude...

What terrible attitude?
You mean, me tearing down your fanciful scenario of Ali being knocked out cold by Tyson?

Bodie wrote:I tried to explain to you...

:lol:

Bodie wrote:...if you've actually been in a ring...

Yep.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:14 am

elvisalisellers wrote:
Bodie wrote:You know, you really have a terrible attitude...

What terrible attitude?
You mean, me tearing down your fanciful scenario of Ali being knocked out cold by Tyson?

Bodie wrote:I tried to explain to you...

:lol:

Bodie wrote:...if you've actually been in a ring...

Yep.


You need to go back and re-read what i posted.

I never said Tyson would knock Ali out cold.

What i actually wrote was, a prime Tyson would have had a great chance of beating Ali in the first half of the fight, i didn't actually say that's what would happen.
Unlike you thinking you would know what would have happened if they had met in the ring, which is ridiculous.

You don't happen to know the lottery numbers for next weeks EuroMillions by any chance? :lol:

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 1:45 am

Bodie wrote:You need to go back and re-read what i posted.

I never said Tyson would knock Ali out cold.


We're going around in circles here... You said: "If both boxers met in their prime then Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds..."

I rebuked this fanciful notion with a learned response. You didn't like it.

Get over it.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:13 am

elvisalisellers wrote:
Bodie wrote:You need to go back and re-read what i posted.

I never said Tyson would knock Ali out cold.


We're going around in circles here... You said: "If both boxers met in their prime then Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds..."

I rebuked this fanciful notion with a learned response. You didn't like it.

Get over it.


We are going round in circles cause you are saying the know the outcome of a fight that can never possibly be fought.

I go with what i said and my own personal opinion is that Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds and the longer the fight would have gone on then my personal view is that Ali would have had the edge.

I never once predicted the outcome of the fight.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:24 am

Bodie wrote:I go with what i said and my own personal opinion is that Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds...

Once again, history is not on your side.

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:35 am

elvisalisellers wrote:
Bodie wrote:I go with what i said and my own personal opinion is that Tyson would be favourite to knock out Ali in the early rounds...

Once again, history is not on your side.


Let's just agree to disagree. :roll:

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 9:58 am

Here's the answer from the man himself Ali!
Part1
phpBB [video]



Part 2
phpBB [video]

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 10:24 am

elvisalisellers I don't mean to go off topic just a little, but this is probably the best time Ali ever had on TV, he was so surprised at was happening to him. This is really wonderful and thought I would share it here.
phpBB [video]

Re: Tyson on Ali

Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:57 pm

promiseland wrote:elvisalisellers I don't mean to go off topic just a little, but this is probably the best time Ali ever had on TV, he was so surprised at was happening to him. This is really wonderful and thought I would share it here.
phpBB [video]



Watched this a few years ago.

The funniest moment was when Ali was reminded about the bicycle he had when he was a kid and he remarked ' you have got there here as well?' or words to that effect. :lol: