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Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:37 am

You guys all act like a decade is a long time.

THe 90's were only blink of an eye away.

I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums.

Y'all are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Coulda shoulda woulda.

Bottomline Elvis wanted to be a moviestar.

He was going to give it the ol' college try.

In the meantime he put his record career in the back seat.

But he didn't want any regrets of not trying for the serious movie career.

Ok, it didn't work out ,. but at least he tried.

He lost 6 years.

He couldn't tour anyway, cause the colonel had a bad back..LOL/

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:48 am

ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:48 am

ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.

You're right. It's not that long at all, only 5,259,490 minutes.

It's like waiting for a bus.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:50 am

ekenee wrote:it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums.

1) in the modern landscape and
2) often because they want to put out good work.

6 years is actually quite a long time, frankly. For every rare musical achievement during Elvis' down years there's a tanker load of rubbish to drown out their voices.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:26 am

brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.


Not making excuses at all.
He was CONTRACTED to do 3 movies a year.
He wanted to be a movie star.
Of course, if the movies had won him a dozen academy awards who
would be complaining that he let his record career take a back seat?
Only because the movies were critical failures you say he wasted his time.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:35 am

ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.


Not making excuses at all.
He was CONTRACTED to do 3 movies a year.
He wanted to be a movie star.
Of course, if the movies had won him a dozen academy awards who
would be complaining that he let his record career take a back seat?
Only because the movies were critical failures you say he wasted his time.


Yes, that's the whole point.

Elvis wasting his talent in the mid to late 60s.

Not just the movies but the soundtracks he should have refused to record those songs.

If he still recorded crap songs and won an academy award i'd still say he was wasting his talents.

Elvis expressed regret and disatisfaction with his career during this time during the Elvis on Tour interview.

Why can't everyone else admit that as well.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:26 am

brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.


Not making excuses at all.
He was CONTRACTED to do 3 movies a year.
He wanted to be a movie star.
Of course, if the movies had won him a dozen academy awards who
would be complaining that he let his record career take a back seat?
Only because the movies were critical failures you say he wasted his time.


Yes, that's the whole point.

Elvis wasting his talent in the mid to late 60s.

Not just the movies but the soundtracks he should have refused to record those songs.

If he still recorded crap songs and won an academy award i'd still say he was wasting his talents.

Elvis expressed regret and disatisfaction with his career during this time during the Elvis on Tour interview.

Why can't everyone else admit that as well.


Hey, I know all of this.
But you are looking at it in hindsight.
By the time Elvis knew what was happening he was contracted to do those movies for another 7 years.

"and when I got out of those movie contracts I started to do live performances again". Elvis --1972

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:38 am

ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.


Not making excuses at all.
He was CONTRACTED to do 3 movies a year.
He wanted to be a movie star.
Of course, if the movies had won him a dozen academy awards who
would be complaining that he let his record career take a back seat?
Only because the movies were critical failures you say he wasted his time.


Yes, that's the whole point.

Elvis wasting his talent in the mid to late 60s.

Not just the movies but the soundtracks he should have refused to record those songs.

If he still recorded crap songs and won an academy award i'd still say he was wasting his talents.

Elvis expressed regret and disatisfaction with his career during this time during the Elvis on Tour interview.

Why can't everyone else admit that as well.


Hey, I know all of this.
But you are looking at it in hindsight.
By the time Elvis knew what was happening he was contracted to do those movies for another 7 years.


That's an excuse.

I am speaking of it in hindsight but also the writing was on the wall at the time.

A solution would have been for Elvis to fire Parker and get another manager who would then re-negotiate the contracts for the better.

Parker was making new deals for movies and re-negotiating Elvis' contracts all the time.
He was just doing it to make bad movies instead of good ones.

By 1964 music was changing and Parker's soultion was lets just make bad films and record bad songs over and over again.

Colonel Parker also wasn't helping with Elvis' goals of being a respected actor so i'd fire him around 1964.

Elvis was far too tolerant of Colonel Parker's shenanigans.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:48 am

brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:
brian wrote:
ekenee wrote:You guys all act like a decade is a long time.
I am sure 1962 (elvis' last number one record) to 1968, (Elvis' tv comeback) seem like forever now, but

it is a mere 6 years. There are artists that go that long between albums..


You are making excuses.

You are comparing the music business now with how it was back then.

Back in the 60s nobody took years off between albums and a decade is a long time.

Apples and oranges.


Not making excuses at all.
He was CONTRACTED to do 3 movies a year.
He wanted to be a movie star.
Of course, if the movies had won him a dozen academy awards who
would be complaining that he let his record career take a back seat?
Only because the movies were critical failures you say he wasted his time.


Yes, that's the whole point.

Elvis wasting his talent in the mid to late 60s.

Not just the movies but the soundtracks he should have refused to record those songs.

If he still recorded crap songs and won an academy award i'd still say he was wasting his talents.

Elvis expressed regret and disatisfaction with his career during this time during the Elvis on Tour interview.

Why can't everyone else admit that as well.


Hey, I know all of this.
But you are looking at it in hindsight.
By the time Elvis knew what was happening he was contracted to do those movies for another 7 years.


That's an excuse.

I am speaking of it in hindsight but also the writing was on the wall at the time.

A solution would have been for Elvis to fire Parker and get another manager who would then re-negotiate the contracts for the better.

Parker was making new deals for movies and re-negotiating Elvis' contracts all the time.
He was just doing it to make bad movies instead of good ones.

By 1964 music was changing and Parker's soultion was lets just make bad films and record bad songs over and over again.

Colonel Parker also wasn't helping with Elvis' goals of being a respected actor so i'd fire him around 1964.

Elvis was far too tolerant of Colonel Parker's shenanigans.



Yes, I agree with all of that.
And history repeated itself in the form of a 7 year las vegas contract which kept him going back to that
town twice a year instead of touring the world.

Elvis should have done alot of things but he didn't.
He also should have gotten a financial manager to manage his money better.
He needed a lifecoach.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:56 am

The man made a mistake. He hung on to his dream of being a movie star far too long, to the point where it numbed his creativity and his remarkable talent. He admitted as much in the 72 EOT interview. Fact is, he created great music in the 60's and the 68 comeback special is the greatest rock and roll ever performed by a human being! Michael Jordan wasted 3 years chasing his dream, ( which was playing baseball ), in his prime and came back and won 3 more championships! The same could be said about him.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 7:15 am

Joe Car wrote:The man made a mistake. He hung on to his dream of being a movie star far too long, to the point where it numbed his creativity and his remarkable talent. He admitted as much in the 72 EOT interview. Fact is, he created great music in the 60's and the 68 comeback special is the greatest rock and roll ever performed by a human being! Michael Jordan wasted 3 years chasing his dream, ( which was playing baseball ), in his prime and came back and won 3 more championships! The same could be said about him.


Don't forget that the army took Elvis away for two years in his prime.
Many gifted people have tragic lives never realized to their fullest potential.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:42 am

Matthew wrote:Beggars belief.


Can you ever manage substance rather than one liners that exist only to indicate how lucky Elvis' music is to have your so wise patronage and how superior your are to your fellow fans? If you don't have anything to really say don't say it.

Now to respond to intelligible arguments.

There is a kind of tendency to equate a moral component to pop record making. This is a result of the self-important style of writing that so dominated early rock criticism. There is no moral component here as to what Elvis should have done. The studios in making movies like Kissin' Cousins, Easy Come, Easy Go Tickle Me, Paradise Hawaiian Style, etc. were trying to give audiences what they wanted based on what they had liked before. They liked the sure thing in the face of competition from television. Your artist grew bored with that formula and approaching ten years in the business started to burn out a bit on recording just as most of his writers after a decade in the business began to burn out as well. You can count the hits of Otis Blackwell, Don Robertson, Leiber and Stoller, etc wrote after 1965 on one hand. You burn out. It was not a healthy situation. Elvis eventually burned out and recharged his batteries with great stuff from 1966-1969.

The idea that if he would have only followed this trend or that trend maybe it would have all been cherries is mostly wishful thinking. Because I don't know any artist particularly in 1950s/1960s rock n' roll, which demanded multiple singles and LPs per year, who maintained a decade plus long career of consistent excellence. Bob Dylan released ten LPs in the 1960s with one a double. That's 11 LPs. The basement tapes make up another two LPs. And you could throw in the live double that never came out. That's a max of 15 LPs in eight years, at the peak of his powers. Elvis had a two year head start but his quantity of excellent material is not that far behind. You have equivalent of at least 10 plus LPs of excellence as much excellence as Dylan released in total. There was a lot more junk that came out but what matters was that Elvis to connect but connected a lot.

Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated.

One thing that always bothers me on this board is that so few fans recognize that it is not 1964 anymore. The rules have changed and also the circumstances have changed. Nobody forces you to listen to Paradise Hawaiian Style, or Easy Come, Easy Go, etc. You know going what those albums are. Now that Elvis' career is complete we can see the good work that was done. It has been captured and contextualized. And it's evident that in the 1960s there was a lot of good work. That's what matters in the end. There's a tendency with great artists to take great work for granted and you just can't do that especially for an artist like Elvis. The "feel" is what's important beyond all. Sometimes that feeling is not going to be there. That he got it so much is a tribute to his talents.

Again there's no need for excuses when the body of work is there. That you had to go through crap to get at it all, is largely irrelevant because it is there. That artist that made these great records continually, consistently over the course of decades does not exist, maybe, maybe Sinatra. That Bob Dylan I mentioned before by 1970 his fans were holding pitchforks over Self-Portrait. Those same fans would not fully embrace an entire Dylan LP until Blood on the Tracks almost five years later.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:49 am

likethebike wrote:Can you ever manage substance rather than one liners that exist only to indicate how lucky Elvis' music is to have your so wise patronage and how superior your are to your fellow fans? If you don't have anything to really say don't say it.

Can you ever manage substance rather than novels that exist only to indicate how lucky Elvis' music is to have your so wise excuses and how superior your are to your fellow fans? If you don't have anything to really say don't say it.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:24 am

likethebike wrote:Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated. .


I was thinking more along the lines of Bright lights and country music fever was better than Girl Happy or Frankie and Johnny.

Elvis recording How Great Though Art in 1966 and ''Guitar man'' a year later was all well and good.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:33 pm

brian wrote:
likethebike wrote:Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated. .


I was thinking more along the lines of Bright lights and country music fever was better than Girl Happy or Frankie and Johnny.

Elvis recording How Great Though Art in 1966 and ''Guitar man'' a year later was all well and good.



Most people dont care about gospel LPs. I was a teenager when that album came out and believe me, no one I know bought it. Yes it was good, but relevant no. The Everly Bros & Bobby Darin & Ricky Nelson had much more contemporary albums & singles in the mid 60's than Elvis did but they were not hits.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:36 pm

A simple TV appearance on Ed Sullivan (like maybe a 10th anniv appearance) could have done the trick. Many artists take a day or 2 off from filming a movie to fly in and do such a thing, then & now. It could have boost sales of the latest single and make Elvis appear more in touch since Sullivan had a current music act on every week. The Col prevented all this from happening due to $$$.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:18 pm

r&b wrote:
brian wrote:
likethebike wrote:Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated. .


I was thinking more along the lines of Bright lights and country music fever was better than Girl Happy or Frankie and Johnny.

Elvis recording How Great Though Art in 1966 and ''Guitar man'' a year later was all well and good.



Most people dont care about gospel LPs. I was a teenager when that album came out and believe me, no one I know bought it. Yes it was good, but relevant no. The Everly Bros & Bobby Darin & Ricky Nelson had much more contemporary albums & singles in the mid 60's than Elvis did but they were not hits.


It was a good album and it was something Elvis wanted to do so good for him.

I'm glad he recorded that album.

I am aware that gospel music is not popular with most teenagers that's not why Elvis recorded it.

Artistically it was a good thing for him to do and it was more commercially successful than albums by Bobby Darin, Ricky Nelson and Everly Brothers at the time.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:26 pm

I think it's vital we stop referring to the 60's as a lost decade - that's a mile wide of the mark. If we're being honest, we're referring to 64-65, and the first hald of 66 as the potentially lost or wasted years. There's great work that any artist would be proud of either side of these years. What we do know is that Elvis never "gave up". The home recordings from the time show he continued to practice, to listen to current music, to develop as a singer. There's much truth in what LTB says, as always - there was nearly always something of merit to find, but the challenge in these years was how hard you had to dig to find it. Sometimes, it's just a phrase. When Elvis sings "And this is the end of my song" at the end of Frankie and Johnny, that one phrase wouldn't be out of place on the King Creole soundtrack. Well, apart from the fact it would be an odd one line addtion, but you get my point!

If we'd had an album such as The Lost Album / Elvis Sings Memphis Tennessee FTD during Mid 64, that would certainly have helped, rather than chopping those songs up as "bonus songs".

There seems to be such resentment by some here of the fact Elvis wasn't always at the top of his game - that he stumbled for a couple of years, made some poor movies, had to record some sub standard soundtrack material, which he should never have done, but he quickly put efforts in place to reverse that. To dismiss How Great Thou Art because it wasn't current or commercial is missing the point - it's perhaps the single album he took the greatest care over, making a huge effort to ensure every detail was just right, and the Grammy award was well deserved. We can hardly say he'd given up when recording this - it was a true labour of love for him and his singing is sublime. No one cares about gospel LPs? Elvis certainly did, and millions were sold over the years.

I make no excuses in that Elvis made movies and recorded poor soundtrack material, but no-one can honestly say he ever "gave up".

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:26 pm

r&b wrote:
brian wrote:
likethebike wrote:Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated. .


I was thinking more along the lines of Bright lights and country music fever was better than Girl Happy or Frankie and Johnny.

Elvis recording How Great Though Art in 1966 and ''Guitar man'' a year later was all well and good.



Most people dont care about gospel LPs. I was a teenager when that album came out and believe me, no one I know bought it. Yes it was good, but relevant no. The Everly Bros & Bobby Darin & Ricky Nelson had much more contemporary albums & singles in the mid 60's than Elvis did but they were not hits.



that's what I like about Elvis....he released a gospel album when nobody would be interested in it :wink:
He felt and followed his musical tastes not only with the gospel stuff if not also with the other nashville recordings from the 60's....to me that means to be ORIGINAL
Also in the 70's he did the same....while everybody was expecting him to do new R&R stuff and sound like Led Zeppelin (to name one), the guy still had his music beliefs and came with song like American Trilogy, Bridge over troubled waters, Polk salad annie etc....

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:30 pm

r&b wrote:
brian wrote:
likethebike wrote:Brian you mention Ricky Nelson. What Nelson Lps in the decade stack up to How Great Thou Art? What Nelson single from 1968 is a good as "Guitar Man"? Consistency is a bit overrated. .


I was thinking more along the lines of Bright lights and country music fever was better than Girl Happy or Frankie and Johnny.

Elvis recording How Great Though Art in 1966 and ''Guitar man'' a year later was all well and good.


Most people dont care about gospel LPs. I was a teenager when that album came out and believe me, no one I know bought it. Yes it was good, but relevant no. The Everly Bros & Bobby Darin & Ricky Nelson had much more contemporary albums & singles in the mid 60's than Elvis did but they were not hits.


Don't agree. Many fans and DJs loved "How Great Thou Art" released early in '67 not only for the fantastic music... many DJs were saying, "One of Elvis's finest achievements in a recording studio!" but also saying, "The soundtrack mold is starting to crack."

Rumors of Elvis doing non-soundtrack recordings were out in '66, but little details of the sessions were available. When Elvis' Spinout album was released in Oct. '66, DJs were playing the bonus songs..."Tomorrow is A Long Time", "Down in The Alley" and "I'll Remember You." Prior soundtrack releases... many DJs didn't even bother to open Elvis' Soundtrack albums, they would briefly mention "It comes with a bonus photo inside."

Now a lot of Records stores were displaying Elvis banners throughout their shops and playing Elvis' records again. Prior with Elvis' New releases ... some didn't even bother to unpack Elvis' Albums.

Elvis hadn't yet moved away from the movie soundtracks, but these recordings were a powerful first step... and both Fans and DJs knew it.

Release Date: 3/8/1967
Image

Release Date: 10/31/1966
Image
pics... http://www.elvisrecords.us

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:00 pm

brian wrote:It was a good album and it was something Elvis wanted to do so good for him.
I'm glad he recorded that album.

RCA's and Elvis' motivation for the How Great Thou Art sessions was mostly due to the commercial success of the single "Crying In The Chapel" a year earlier.

It wasn't only about what "Elvis wanted to do".

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:08 pm

Blue River wrote:
brian wrote:It was a good album and it was something Elvis wanted to do so good for him.
I'm glad he recorded that album.

RCA's and Elvis' motivation for the How Great Thou Art sessions was mostly due to the commercial success of the single "Crying In The Chapel".

It wasn't only about what "Elvis wanted to do".


That may well be but that's beside the point.

He recorded gospel in the 50s and he recorded His Hand in mine in 1960.

RCA may have had motivation for Elvis to do another gospel LP but this was a record that he wanted to make.

If Elvis disliked gospel music he wouldn't have recorded any of it.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:22 pm

Blue River wrote:
brian wrote:It was a good album and it was something Elvis wanted to do so good for him.
I'm glad he recorded that album.

RCA's and Elvis' motivation for the How Great Thou Art sessions was mostly due to the commercial success of the single "Crying In The Chapel" a year earlier.

It wasn't only about what "Elvis wanted to do".


It was no secret that Elvis had become disinterested in his movie soundtrack work. I thought RCA and Parker wanted Elvis to do a Christmas album, but Elvis insisted on a gospel album.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:52 pm

DarrylMac wrote:I think it's vital we stop referring to the 60's as a lost decade - that's a mile wide of the mark. If we're being honest, we're referring to 64-65, and the first hald of 66 as the potentially lost or wasted years. There's great work that any artist would be proud of either side of these years. What we do know is that Elvis never "gave up".


1967 was Elvis' worst year as a recording artist in my view.

He recorded the Clambake and Speedway soundtracks as well as the song ''Dominick the bull'' during 1967.

He recorded the Double Trouble and Easy come, Easy go soundtracks during the second half of 1966.

Elvis recording 7 or 8 good songs during 1967 doesn't make up for the bulk of bad material he recorded during that year or 1966 either.

Re: Elvis in the '60s

Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:11 pm

brian wrote:
Blue River wrote:
brian wrote:It was a good album and it was something Elvis wanted to do so good for him.
I'm glad he recorded that album.

RCA's and Elvis' motivation for the How Great Thou Art sessions was mostly due to the commercial success of the single "Crying In The Chapel".

It wasn't only about what "Elvis wanted to do".

RCA may have had motivation for Elvis to do another gospel LP but this was a record that he wanted to make.

I agree.



brian wrote:1967 was Elvis' worst year as a recording artist in my view.

My choice for Elvis' worst year as a recording artist is 1965... no doubt about it.

Quality songs/recordings by Elvis in 1965 -
Frankie And Johnny
Please Don't Stop Loving Me
Hard Luck
This Is My Heaven
Sand Castles


Quality songs/recordings by Elvis in 1967 -
Speedway
Let Yourself Go
Your Time Hasn't Come Yet, Baby
Guitar Man
Big Boss Man
Hi-Heel Sneakers
Just Call Me Lonesome
You Don't Know Me
You'll Never Walk Alone
We Call On Him
All I Needed Was The Rain