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Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:25 am

Someone described how these projects have relatively short time frames in terms of planning and execution.

I'll grant all that, but it's a minor demerit. Presumably the hard-core Elvis fan world will pick up the slack to improve
this set. Given that it's 2012, I'm shocked we even have such a release at all, so I'll take it.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:46 am

Jaime:

I think the sound is better here on the evening show than the original releases, but not to the point where I thought his voice sounded strained before and now it sounds strong and controlled. This sounds fuller to me than before but all this, "It's like the first time I've heard it" excitement is a little over the top for me.

The evening show was a great concert before and this release enhances it even more.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:35 am

Absolutely Steve..... i thoroughly enjoyed this new sounding E/S and it sounded fantastic to my ears -great improvement!~ :lol:

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:52 am

Also posted in ekenee's thread:

My set has arrived. I have not yet really scrutinised it but have played through some of the film and interview segments, and briefly listened to some of the audio, particularly focusing on Polk Salad Annie. Initial thoughts:

The way the CDs are housed is terrible - tightly constricted into little slots that you have to man-handle out to gain access. Not good. At the least the centre CD holes should be accessible so they can be pushed out. Beyond this the packaging is very nice, with some great images and presentation similar to the Big Beat set but in a smaller format.
The footage is fun but the lack of instant access to the footage points is frustrating. The frame rate is a little distracting at times but otherwise very cool to watch synced with the audio.
The interview footage is raw and choppy and thus lacks real flow. Constructing the interview from the various film sources would have been preferable, or at the least including the full audio on one of the CDs would have sufficed. Image quality is ok if a little soft.
The audio is heavily compressed.

I hope those comparing the new mixes to the old mixes are volume matching the sources first. There is a LOT more dynamic range in the 1972 mix of the evening show for example compared to the new mix - which has to be significantly reduced in volume to best compare. Here is a quick volume matched sample comparing the chorus from Polk Salad Annie from the evening show:

http://soundcloud.com/user8478287/princ ... ad-compare

The first is from Prince From Another Planet, the second is from the Complete Masters (original 1972 mix). Ignore the graph on SoundCloud as it's not accurate. This is how they actually look:
Polk Salad Annie Prince-MSG.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:41 am

Interesting, Matthew. Can you interpret that further for us, lunkheads in the bleachers?

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:51 am

Basically it is best to compare two audio representations of the same music at the same volume level. If one compares PFAP to MSG without doing so then PFAP is significantly louder than MSG which has the impression of "standing out more". When volumes are matched then the nuances of the mixing and audio processing are better observed.

What one prefers is subjective but certainly PFAP is not audiophile whilst MSG from Complete Masters is.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:01 am

I have only listened to the shows in my car thus far...I think they sound good, but I think I expected a bigger difference in sound from the original mixes. I did enjoy them, but I will have to listen with my headphones before I really take it all in. Thus far I only watched the doc, not the full concert footage. I liked it...nothing ground breaking, but a nice, well done mini-documentary that made good use of EOT footage, and the new footage.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 8:15 am

Thanks for the explanation, Matthew. I remember a lot of such graphics being employed to explain what was
wrong with ELV1S" some ten years ago.

Is it fair to say that it is a "louder" disc...but might there be some redeeming parts to the project? It sounded distinctly
different to me and not just "loud."

I'm glad to have it all.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:25 am

Mine arrived today and I was disappointed with the sound - loudness is not better - as Vic Anesini knows..Just compare his mastering on "complete".

I can't help feeing that this was an FTD project before being hi-jacked by Sony or is Sony just copying MRS

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:08 am

Finally last night I saw the dvd.I have to say the whole package is great, I didnt expect it to be so big.The book was great and the cds sound the same with originals if you ask me. The consert footage was great. to bad it was only 20 minutes. My only nitpick is that they could have maybe used some pictures to "cover"| the black screen between the footage. You can easly loose focus if you see black screen for 5 minutes and then a 45 second clip shows and then another 3 minutes of darkness. But other than that it was great!!

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:40 am

KiwiAlan wrote:Mine arrived today and I was disappointed with the sound - loudness is not better - as Vic Anesini knows..Just compare his mastering on "complete".

I can't help feeing that this was an FTD project before being hi-jacked by Sony or is Sony just copying MRS

I doubt there was much Vic Anesini could do to help the release when mastering it, all that compression is built into the mix made by the "Coldplay guy" - who uses various compressors in his mixing technique to get different EQ results on different instruments and voices. The dynamic range didn't stand a chance!

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:26 pm

Jim Dandy wrote:IMO it seems the 1997 release of the afternoon show used the evening show's version of 2001 (note the warble at the end of the track which is audible since the release of the eveneing show release) but has now been replaced with the correct version from 10/6/72 a/s.

Really?

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:00 pm

Matthew wrote:....all that compression is built into the mix made by the "Coldplay guy" - who uses various compressors in his mixing technique to get different EQ results on different instruments and voices. The dynamic range didn't stand a chance!

Elvis cannot remotely be compared to Coldplay. Why the hell was he chosen for the project anyway...anyone know?

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:08 pm

ekenee wrote:
Mike S wrote:
Thanks for your review which echos my thoughts almost exactly.

Only difference I have is that the afternoon show featured on the import CD Operation Big Apple features much better sound in my opinion than this remix. Have you heard It?


No, I actually never got around to buying the import versions of those shows.
But I believe you when you say they are better in sound than these remixes.


Heres PSA VENUS

CD1
http://en.packupload.com/0N5IDVLHWG9

CD2
http://en.packupload.com/C11X2C95K60

The links look similar but they are different versions .......

Here also is my ReWorked version from the CM Set, just to compare

http://en.packupload.com/N69TJQE62RM

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:21 pm

I feel sorry for the people who put these sets together because people are just never happy. Just non stop nitpicking.

The blank screen annoys me blah, blah, u can't hear John Wilkenson enough blah, blah, the footage looks grainy blah, blah....the cds are orange, blah, blah, it was released in November and not June,, blah, Blah, blah, the high end frequency and bass analyzer don't match up....blah, blah....UGH. enough!!!!!

They put a lot of effort in to this and some people just can never be satisfied

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:26 pm

I like it.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:33 pm

Newspaper article on PFAP from Chicago Sun-Times:

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/m ... lanet.html

Brian

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:17 pm

DEH wrote:I feel sorry for the people who put these sets together because people are just never happy.

Then you completely misunderstand the motives of the people responsible for producing these releases. Please read carefully:

The ONLY reason they exist at all is because they want YOUR MONEY.

It is not some huge favour being done for fans from the kindness of their collective hearts. What those expressing their disatisfaction are really saying is - next time let them work harder for your money by creating a quality product.

You should realise that if you are repeatedly satisfied with inferior or poorly thought out products, then that is what you will continually get. You can't really blame the companies producing them. They're in business to make money (as much as possible). It's your job to make sure you get value for your money and those complaining are actually helping you to achieve this.
DEH wrote:They put a lot of effort in to this and some people just can never be satisfied

On the contrary, they did not put enough effort into this release which is why some have raised complaints.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:25 pm

Mike S wrote:
DEH wrote:I feel sorry for the people who put these sets together because people are just never happy.

Then you completely misunderstand the motives of the people responsible for producing these releases. Please read carefully:

The ONLY reason they exist at all is because they want YOUR MONEY.

It is not some huge favour being done for fans from the kindness of their collective hearts. What those expressing their disatisfaction are really saying is - next time let them work harder for your money by creating a quality product.

You should realise that if you are repeatedly satisfied with inferior or poorly thought out products, then that is what you will continually get. You can't really blame the companies producing them. They're in business to make money (as much as possible). It's your job to make sure you get value for your money and those complaining are actually helping you to achieve this.
DEH wrote:They put a lot of effort in to this and some people just can never be satisfied

On the contrary, they did not put enough effort into this release which is why some have raised complaints.


Complaining does not Help. Not when its nitpicking.

If u don't like their products. DON'T BUY IT. Take it back...whatever. But complaining is much more fun.

Buying 8mm footage from a fan and synching up the sound is not putting in a good effort???? again Some people can never be pleased.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:40 pm

DEH wrote:Complaining does not Help. Not when its nitpicking.

It's not nitpicking. There are fundamental flaws with the way the material has been presented in this set and unsurprisingly some people are not happy with that.

If you are happy with this set, then good for you. However there are others here who are disappointed that this material has not been presented in a better fashion and do not want to see these errors repeated on future releases. By registering their disatisfaction, their voice is being heard, simple as that.

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:01 pm

Mike S wrote:
DEH wrote:Complaining does not Help. Not when its nitpicking.

It's not nitpicking. There are fundamental flaws with the way the material has been presented in this set and unsurprisingly some people are not happy with that.

If you are happy with this set, then good for you. However there are others here who are disappointed that this material has not been presented in a better fashion and do not want to see these errors repeated on future releases. By registering their disatisfaction, their voice is being heard, simple as that.


It's not. The minority are not going to be listened to.:)

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:43 pm

Fundamental flaws my a @"!

I have watched the DVD twice and know which songs have footage so I can use the song select if I wish. No big issue. The documentary is good, the press conference could be better but I still enjoyed it. Sony employed one of the highest rated producers around and I doubt that comes cheap. Check his history he is not some Coldplay guy but has a huge catalogue covering a wide range of artists including Dylan legacy releases. You may not like the presentation of the music but that doesn't mean it's fundamentally flawed. Many like it as is. This is a lovely well thought out package no doubt done on a tight budget. Oh and the booklet is lovely piece of work.

Just a thought but a wider dynamic range doesn't make an audiophile product. It's a good start but the mix can still be screwed up. Whilst I have always enjoyed the various versions of MSG it's because I love the show. Elvis sounds miles away and his voice thin when compared to the fuller vocals we now get.

Cheers Jamie

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:45 am

Jamie wrote:Fundamental flaws my a @"!

I have watched the DVD twice and know which songs have footage so I can use the song select if I wish. No big issue. The documentary is good, the press conference could be better but I still enjoyed it. Sony employed one of the highest rated producers around and I doubt that comes cheap. Check his history he is not some Coldplay guy but has a huge catalogue covering a wide range of artists including Dylan legacy releases. You may not like the presentation of the music but that doesn't mean it's fundamentally flawed. Many like it as is. This is a lovely well thought out package no doubt done on a tight budget. Oh and the booklet is lovely piece of work.

Just a thought but a wider dynamic range doesn't make an audiophile product. It's a good start but the mix can still be screwed up. Whilst I have always enjoyed the various versions of MSG it's because I love the show. Elvis sounds miles away and his voice thin when compared to the fuller vocals we now get.

Cheers Jamie

Spot on!

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:04 am

a mess of polk salad wrote:
Jamie wrote:Fundamental flaws my a @"!

I have watched the DVD twice and know which songs have footage so I can use the song select if I wish. No big issue. The documentary is good, the press conference could be better but I still enjoyed it. Sony employed one of the highest rated producers around and I doubt that comes cheap. Check his history he is not some Coldplay guy but has a huge catalogue covering a wide range of artists including Dylan legacy releases. You may not like the presentation of the music but that doesn't mean it's fundamentally flawed. Many like it as is. This is a lovely well thought out package no doubt done on a tight budget. Oh and the booklet is lovely piece of work.

Just a thought but a wider dynamic range doesn't make an audiophile product. It's a good start but the mix can still be screwed up. Whilst I have always enjoyed the various versions of MSG it's because I love the show. Elvis sounds miles away and his voice thin when compared to the fuller vocals we now get.

Cheers Jamie

Spot on!


I think the only "fundamental flaw" is the tight CD slits. And I don't really give much of a toss about that.

As the Stranglers once sang.. "Everybody loves you when you're dead", and when the Elvis music catalogue reissue scenario breathes its final breath, people will realise how lucky we were to have a beautiful, affordable product like PFAP in 2012. It isn't 1995 anymore, the industry is wrecked, but even if it was booming this would still be an exceptionally good product. Hooray!

Re: Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant!

Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:09 am

Jamie wrote:Just a thought but a wider dynamic range doesn't make an audiophile product.

Not on its own no. PFAP is a strange hybrid, we have a modern, compressed (almost restricted sounding) mix married with mastering from an engineer renowned for his audiophile aesthetics. In this case the result is far from audiophile philosophy.

On the other hand Vic Anesini's remastering of the original 1972 mix is excellent. Say what you will about the original mix - it is what it is, but the mix has been mastered without additional compression applied and with tasteful EQ.

As I listen to these shows I am coming to the conclusion that the drive to achieve a "in the 4th row" sound was better achieved by FTD's "Live On Stage In Memphis" release from 2004. The Prince mixes don't really achieve the same result - Elvis' vocal sound oddly detached from the rest of the sound elements, including the backing voices. The original mix finds Elvis' vocal track sitting with the rest of the band. Prince is not terrible, but it's not quite "right" either.

The original mix certainly has a dryer overall sound where as the new mix is slightly wetter - more reverb, but particularly on Elvis' vocal. Verdict is still out. One thing is for sure though, Jerry's all important bass solo in Polk Salad Annie has still never sounded better than on the original 1972 Madison Square Garden mix. Prince is far better than the likes of Afternoon and Live In Texas but still not quite as good as the punchy mixed to the front result of MSG.