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Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:32 pm

r&b wrote:
elvisalisellers wrote:
Swingin-Little-Guitar-Man wrote:He doesn't know the lyrics and it sounds like a rehearsal or impromptu rather than a song with actual takes.

debtd1 wrote:I don't mind it, he's only 'jamming'...he wasn't intending it to be taken so seriously be FECC 43 years on.

bajo wrote:I take it as a jam and as such I think it's ok.

At last, a bit of sanity.

Once again I will state, if intended as a jam and throwaway its ok but it was used as an album track on a full priced LP in 1972! Werent you people around then for this insanity? It was embarrasing and inexcusable for an artist like Elvis, but as someone else said, he really didn't care anymore about the record releases, Like Vince Everett in Jailhouse Rock when Peggy said to Vince, 'No one is so big that they can ignore the records Vince'. Well. fiction turned into reality.


I guess people are looking back at this with the benefit of hindsight. But it's quite scary that Elvis fans can't actually see there was anything wrong with putting a half-finished recording on an album. But the trick would be repeated the following year with Love Me Love the Life on Fool.

But there really was no excuse - not least because songs such as Sound of Your Cry, I'm Leavin' Rags To Riches, Where Did The Go Lord and much material from the 1971 sessions had not appeared on an LP. Quite what the thinking was behind the inclusion of Hey Jude is something we shall probably never know. It simply doesn't make sense to include it when complete superior masters were available. Hey Jude would have been fine on a camden LP, but not on a full-price one - but then, perhaps, after Love Letters anything was possible.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:32 pm

Nicely put, Doc.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:39 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Delboy wrote:Only joking........it still sucks.
::rocks

Nothing from American Sound in 1969 "sucks."

Frankly, it gets tiresome to read the constant bashing of a recording that was never intended to be released, and in fact was the last master from these fabulous sessions to see issue, in 1972 on a rag-tag RCA LP of leftovers.

"Hey Jude" by the Beatles was THE song of the year in 1968, and Elvis clearly loved it very, very much. So, on a whim, he sat down and began banging it out on piano, for his own pleasure. Like all the other work done in Memphis that winter, Presley's vocal was stunning, his tone so light and effortless, it remains a pleasure for any true fan. He was engaged. He cared about the song. And, as we all know, so soon after this would no longer be the norm.

Unlike some other tracks done in the same manner at American, producer Chips Moman knew immediately this was just an exercise for his artist. Elvis' stab at "Hey Jude" was never slated for a single A-side, B-side or LP track. But it was Elvis singing the Beatles, so tape rolled.

And that's the way it is.


The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance. If never intended to be released, it should have remained in the vaults.

The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question. This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later. The same can be said for the lacklustre and downright poor shows that were to follow. Whether Presley had a hand in picking the songs for the album or not is unimportant: if he did have a hand in it, then presumably he no longer gave a damn; if he didn't have a hand in it then that shows he didn't give a damn either. No escape on this one.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:06 pm

poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance.

Elvis' performance is clearly not "poor," there are no such performances from 1969 at American Sound. Period.


poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question.

How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them.


poormadpeter wrote:This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later.

Early sign? Starting with 1970's third Las Vegas booking in barely a year's time, and the subsequent 1971 release of "Life" and "Rags To Riches" as single A-sides, and Love Letters From Elvis as an LP, savvy fans could see that the Hollywood routine and studio disinterest had been supplanted by the Vegas routine and studio disinterest.


So, again, the vitriol aimed at "Hey Jude" is baffling, and I suspect at the root of it all is the fact that it is a massive hit single written, recorded and released by the Beatles.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:15 pm

everything written by, associated with, even remotely connected to the Beatles is beyond criticism. la la la how life goes on.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:19 pm

oh sorry la la la in a song is really bad

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:29 pm

pingpong wrote:everything written by, associated with, even remotely connected to the Beatles is beyond criticism. la la la how life goes on.

Thank you for proving my point.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:31 pm

my pleasure.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:37 pm

I don't care whether it was recorded in Memphis 1969, Nashville 1970, or Graceland, 1976, this recording of Hey Jude is terrible and so is Elvis' vocal. Saying if it came from 1969 Memphis, it can't be bad is silly. At least on this recording, and to a lesser extent, the 1969 August versions paired with Yesterday, Hey Jude doesn't seem like a song Elvis could get into. It doesn't work for him.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:44 pm

stevelecher wrote:I don't care whether it was recorded in Memphis 1969, Nashville 1970, or Graceland, 1976, this recording of Hey Jude is terrible and so is Elvis' vocal. Saying if it came from 1969 Memphis, it can't be bad is silly. At least on this recording, and to a lesser extent, the 1969 August versions paired with Yesterday, Hey Jude doesn't seem like a song Elvis could get into. It doesn't work for him.



it is an awful performance of an awful song. period.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:51 pm

pingpong wrote:it is an awful performance of an awful song. period.

Thank you for proving my point a second time.

Sad that there are fans who hold such narrow views.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:53 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance.

Elvis' performance is clearly not "poor," there are no such performances from 1969 at American Sound. Period.


poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question.

How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them.


poormadpeter wrote:This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later.

Early sign? Starting with 1970's third Las Vegas booking in barely a year's time, and the subsequent 1971 release of "Life" and "Rags To Riches" as single A-sides, and Love Letters From Elvis as an LP, savvy fans could see that the Hollywood routine and studio disinterest had been supplanted by the Vegas routine and studio disinterest.


So, again, the vitriol aimed at "Hey Jude" is baffling, and I suspect at the root of it all is the fact that it is a massive hit single written, recorded and released by the Beatles.


What complete piffle. Just because the song was written by The Beatles does not mean that people cannot criticise Presley's performance. What's more, most people hold the recordings we have officially from Presley's August 1970 engagement very highly, although the rot was certainly setting in by the following engagement in January 1971.

You write: "How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them".

What you fail to see is that this can be turned on its head - isn't it odd that we see you spewing "laser-like venom" over various other sub-par recordings and yet not this one? I suspect at the root of your view is the fact that it is a massive hit single written, recorded and released by the Beatles.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:09 pm

Hey Jude is a wonderful Beatles recording. One of the great two-sided hit records of all time. IMO, it is not wonderful by Elvis. I don't know if it was a rough vocal while he was still struggling with laryngitis, or what, but it is a poor outing from our hero who did make numerous other great recordings at that same time.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:12 pm

poormadpeter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Delboy wrote:Only joking........it still sucks.
::rocks

Nothing from American Sound in 1969 "sucks."

Frankly, it gets tiresome to read the constant bashing of a recording that was never intended to be released, and in fact was the last master from these fabulous sessions to see issue, in 1972 on a rag-tag RCA LP of leftovers.

"Hey Jude" by the Beatles was THE song of the year in 1968, and Elvis clearly loved it very, very much. So, on a whim, he sat down and began banging it out on piano, for his own pleasure. Like all the other work done in Memphis that winter, Presley's vocal was stunning, his tone so light and effortless, it remains a pleasure for any true fan. He was engaged. He cared about the song. And, as we all know, so soon after this would no longer be the norm.

Unlike some other tracks done in the same manner at American, producer Chips Moman knew immediately this was just an exercise for his artist. Elvis' stab at "Hey Jude" was never slated for a single A-side, B-side or LP track. But it was Elvis singing the Beatles, so tape rolled.

And that's the way it is.


The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance. If never intended to be released, it should have remained in the vaults.

The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question. This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later. The same can be said for the lacklustre and downright poor shows that were to follow. Whether Presley had a hand in picking the songs for the album or not is unimportant: if he did have a hand in it, then presumably he no longer gave a damn; if he didn't have a hand in it then that shows he didn't give a damn either. No escape on this one.



Yes he loved and cared so much for the song, he didnt get one lyrical verse right Thats being enaged all right.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:45 pm

I do agree that Elvis clearly cared about the song, and put effort into the somewhat impromptu performance. It wasn’t a planned effort and no real subsequent focus was put forth once Elvis initially laid it down. But the results are not worthy of any considerable praise either. It was a somewhat misguided approach to the song. Had Moman wanted to help shape and form a proper master, most likely the final result would have been significantly different in arrangement and execution. I have always contended that Elvis’ rendition of Hey Jude should have remained an archival curiosity. Had RCA released it for the first time as a posthumous vault-find during the early-90s reissue campaign as part of the ‘60s box set, most likely fans would have a different level of appreciation for Elvis’ version.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:53 pm

Robert Matthew-Walker, the auther of the book 'A Study In Music', discribes the Elvis version of Hey Jude thus "Hey Jude is so unlike the original as to make it a different song. He performs it in a high voice , as though half-whispering to a friend, but this strange atmosphere exerts a fascination"

The Beatles version is, of course, the diffinative one. But I also like the Elvis version, taking into consideration that it isn't a finished master. The venom attached to it must be because it was included on a full price album (Elvis Now). But I bet if we new it existed but wasn't released, everyone would be pleading that it should be. After all it is no worse releasing this unfinished master than say, Tomorrow Night and other unfinished masters.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:56 pm

midnightx wrote:Had RCA released it for the first time as a posthumous vault-find during the early-90s reissue campaign as part of the ‘60s box set, most likely fans would have a different level of appreciation for Elvis’ version.

They did that with the 1971 recording of My Way on the 70's set, going so far as call it a "master". Although it's interesting to have heard it, Elvis' performance is horrible and his choice to shelve it was a good one.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:03 am

I'm not convinced it was Elvis' choice to shelve it. Jarvis simply never considered it a viable contender for any of the post-1971 hodge-podge efforts. Had Elvis' lack of interest in recording continued through the remainder of 1977, you never know, Jarvis may have dug it up and issued it on a post-Moody Blue studio album.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:08 am

I remember this was discussed before, can someone copy and paste that topic in here too?

There is nothing wrong with Elvis' performance in this! And to say it "sucks" is just stupid!

I first listened to this song on Too Much Monkey Business FTD cd which is a remix version of it, and I loved it.

And this version is great too! I agree with Doc when he said "Nothing from American Sound in 1969 "sucks." "

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 2:02 am

ElvisLive3August1969 wrote:I remember this was discussed before, can someone copy and paste that topic in here too?

There is nothing wrong with Elvis' performance in this! And to say it "sucks" is just stupid!

I first listened to this song on Too Much Monkey Business FTD cd which is a remix version of it, and I loved it.

And this version is great too! I agree with Doc when he said "Nothing from American Sound in 1969 "sucks." "


I have to be honest and say that I think the google.com version sounds superior despite the tinkering that others might disapprove of. I even find the spliced alternate presented to us by FTD in the Memphis Sessions CD more enjoyable than the Elvis Now version.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 2:40 am

poormadpeter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance.

Elvis' performance is clearly not "poor," there are no such performances from 1969 at American Sound. Period.


poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question.

How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them.


poormadpeter wrote:This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later.

Early sign? Starting with 1970's third Las Vegas booking in barely a year's time, and the subsequent 1971 release of "Life" and "Rags To Riches" as single A-sides, and Love Letters From Elvis as an LP, savvy fans could see that the Hollywood routine and studio disinterest had been supplanted by the Vegas routine and studio disinterest.


So, again, the vitriol aimed at "Hey Jude" is baffling, and I suspect at the root of it all is the fact that it is a massive hit single written, recorded and released by the Beatles.


What complete piffle.

So much for an intelligent reply that might engender a worthy discussion. PS: you miss the point.

Thanks for stopping by.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 2:47 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is not of the recording, despite the obviously poor performance.

Elvis' performance is clearly not "poor," there are no such performances from 1969 at American Sound. Period.


poormadpeter wrote:The bashing is of the fact that it was released and the artist didn't care that a half-finished recording featuring a hoarse, faultering vocal and half-forgotten lyrics was being made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for the album in question.

How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them.


poormadpeter wrote:This fact was an early sign that Presley not only no longer cared about his artistry, but also that he didn't care for the public that had helped him revive his career just a few years later.

Early sign? Starting with 1970's third Las Vegas booking in barely a year's time, and the subsequent 1971 release of "Life" and "Rags To Riches" as single A-sides, and Love Letters From Elvis as an LP, savvy fans could see that the Hollywood routine and studio disinterest had been supplanted by the Vegas routine and studio disinterest.


So, again, the vitriol aimed at "Hey Jude" is baffling, and I suspect at the root of it all is the fact that it is a massive hit single written, recorded and released by the Beatles.


What complete piffle.

So much for an intelligent reply that might engender a worthy discussion. PS: you miss the point.

Thanks for stopping by.


Perhaps you miss the point because you once again quote what you want to and not the rest of my comments, which was an intelligent reply worthy of discussion -ie, your bias towards the recording as a Beatles fan, and the hypocrisy of your defence of the song when compared to your slating of others of equal or greater merit.

And your following comment, which ignores that fact that I far from a 70s apologist, as you well know and as can be seen from my many posts on the era, including my recent thoughts on FEPB.

How odd we do not see the same laser-like venom for any number of substandard Presley releases on single and LP between 1964 and 1977, which were made available to his audience who were paying their hard-earned money for them.

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:01 am

Just testing

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:12 am

Posted earlier but seems to have got lost? Hey Jude was only a jam session elvis knew he didn't know all the words but was comfortable enough with friends to enjoy it. And thank god for that! Had he wanted to record it I believe he could have nailed it in a couple of takes.
Elvis just comfortable and singing does it for me.
Mark

Re: Hey Jude: A new appreciation; did we underestimate it?

Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:29 am

How can anyone not enjoy the performance of this song? It is so casual and intimate-it's the highlight of the original LP for me.

JosephC