Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 3:39 am

Speaking for myself, if you were talking Just Pretend vs. My Wish Came True or I Love You Because, I'd come down solidly on behalf of the 70's.
It ain't about the genre or era, it's about each particular song.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:43 am

Revelator wrote:
Booker T wrote:There Goes is definitely a good vocal performance. But Felton put way, way too much syrup on the pancakes with the strings and voices.


I would defend those--it's not as if it was a gentle, understated song in the first place.

Rob wrote:Would you ever play the latter?


Now that I've edited my original post, yes.

drjohncarpenter wrote:You must own a different version of "There Goes My Everything." I hear a nice, workmanlike performance, nothing more, nothing less.


A second listen might dispel that impression.



As I have listened the song in question more than 100 times easily it would not dispel my impression that Elvis only gave a typical run through performace. He put just as much effort and sincerity in some of the '60's movie fluff.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:57 am

Deke Rivers II wrote:As I have listened the song in question more than 100 times easily it would not dispel my impression that Elvis only gave a typical run through performace. He put just as much effort and sincerity in some of the '60's movie fluff.


I'm still agog over the fact that you listened to a song you don't care for over a 100 times. I would just press the skip button. Having just relistened to it, I am reassured of the quality of the performance, especially the sensitivity and control in his phrasing.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:00 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Rob wrote:As for me, I prefer "There Goes My Everything" over "Tweedle Dee" any day.

Interesting comparison.

On the one hand we have a genteel, pleasant-but-unremarkable June 1970 cover of a much-recorded country standard, while on the other we have an exuberant, blazingly sexy live April 1955 recording of LaVerne Baker's "Tweedlee Dee."

Not only would I take the 1955 track over the 1970 cut any day of the week, I would proudly play it for a new listener and say, "THIS is Elvis."

But, hey, that's me.



Hmmmm ... I don't know Doc. I 'm tore over if I would rather play "My Boy" or "Life" for a new listener.

Or maybe I could throw in "Sylvia", "The Sound Of Your Cry", and "Love Me, Love The Life I Lead" as an EP style selection for good measure.

Oh hell, I'll just play the dirty dozen and see what kind of laugh, or bellyaching, I'll get.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:03 am

minkahed wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Rob wrote:As for me, I prefer "There Goes My Everything" over "Tweedle Dee" any day.

Interesting comparison.

On the one hand we have a genteel, pleasant-but-unremarkable June 1970 cover of a much-recorded country standard, while on the other we have an exuberant, blazingly sexy live April 1955 recording of LaVerne Baker's "Tweedlee Dee."

Not only would I take the 1955 track over the 1970 cut any day of the week, I would proudly play it for a new listener and say, "THIS is Elvis."

But, hey, that's me.



Hmmmm ... I don't know Doc. I 'm tore over if I would rather play "My Boy" or "Life" for a new listener.

Or maybe I could throw in "Sylvia", "The SOund Of Your Cry", and "Love Me, Love The Life I Lead" as an EP style selection.

Oh hell, I'll just play the dirty dozen and see what kind of laugh, or bellyaching, I'll get.

minkahed, those are all stellar choices. To really convert a potential new fan, you may want to unleash the From EP Blvd version of The Last Farewell followed by a live version of If You Love Me (Let Me Know). It is a guaranteed lock.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:11 am

midnightx wrote:
minkahed wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Rob wrote:As for me, I prefer "There Goes My Everything" over "Tweedle Dee" any day.

Interesting comparison.

On the one hand we have a genteel, pleasant-but-unremarkable June 1970 cover of a much-recorded country standard, while on the other we have an exuberant, blazingly sexy live April 1955 recording of LaVerne Baker's "Tweedlee Dee."

Not only would I take the 1955 track over the 1970 cut any day of the week, I would proudly play it for a new listener and say, "THIS is Elvis."

But, hey, that's me.



Hmmmm ... I don't know Doc. I 'm tore over if I would rather play "My Boy" or "Life" for a new listener.

Or maybe I could throw in "Sylvia", "The SOund Of Your Cry", and "Love Me, Love The Life I Lead" as an EP style selection.

Oh hell, I'll just play the dirty dozen and see what kind of laugh, or bellyaching, I'll get.

minkahed, those are all stellar choices. To really convert a potential new fan, you may want to unleash the From EP Blvd version of The Last Farewell followed by a live version of If You Love Me (Let Me Know). It is a guaranteed lock.


I'm tempted, but even as I, an avid fan of Elvis Presley, still cringe when I hear the first notes "The Last Farewell" wailing over my speakers like a shark is about to swallow someone whole.

From what I've read, Elvis was taken mad amounts of dilaudid in Feb. of '76, and that fact alone explains why he was not thinking properly when preparing to lay this title to tape.

Lord knows ...

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:10 am

midnightx wrote:
minkahed wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
Rob wrote:As for me, I prefer "There Goes My Everything" over "Tweedle Dee" any day.

Interesting comparison.

On the one hand we have a genteel, pleasant-but-unremarkable June 1970 cover of a much-recorded country standard, while on the other we have an exuberant, blazingly sexy live April 1955 recording of LaVerne Baker's "Tweedlee Dee."

Not only would I take the 1955 track over the 1970 cut any day of the week, I would proudly play it for a new listener and say, "THIS is Elvis."

But, hey, that's me.






Hmmmm ... I don't know Doc. I 'm tore over if I would rather play "My Boy" or "Life" for a new listener.

Or maybe I could throw in "Sylvia", "The SOund Of Your Cry", and "Love Me, Love The Life I Lead" as an EP style selection.

Oh hell, I'll just play the dirty dozen and see what kind of laugh, or bellyaching, I'll get.

minkahed, those are all stellar choices. To really convert a potential new fan, you may want to unleash the From EP Blvd version of The Last Farewell followed by a live version of If You Love Me (Let Me Know). It is a guaranteed lock.


I happen to like "if you love me(let me go), but he should have stopped performing after a year or so.
It became routine, just like the dive bomb, you gave me a mountain, love me, and see see rider.
Sometimes its not he song,but the fact that we have heard hundred of versions of it.
He dropped "let me be there" after a while and rightly so.
He should have looked at his catague of old material and worked on some of that stuff.
The fans would have loved it if he did that more.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:16 am

ekenee wrote:I happen to like "if you love me(let me go), but he should have stopped performing after a year or so.


I agree. Perhaps my memory is playing me wrong, but the best version I've heard Elvis perform was on Desert Storm, and none of the later ones were any better.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:25 pm

What do you think what the reaction would be, after listening to ''Tweedle Dee'' or ''How Great Thou Art'' (from EIC) to a non-fan?

I wont be surprised if this person asks me if ''Tweedle Dee'' was recorded in 1826 and ''w-t-f'' is this??? I know, equipment wasn't that developed in the 1950's. But still........

I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:34 pm

To me i dont care if someone likes a particular song,or dislikes one,its the listeners choice

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:00 pm

3577 wrote: I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.


HAHA!

Never trust a 3577.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:18 pm

Revelator wrote:
Deke Rivers II wrote:As I have listened the song in question more than 100 times easily it would not dispel my impression that Elvis only gave a typical run through performace. He put just as much effort and sincerity in some of the '60's movie fluff.


I'm still agog over the fact that you listened to a song you don't care for over a 100 times. I would just press the skip button. Having just relistened to it, I am reassured of the quality of the performance, especially the sensitivity and control in his phrasing.


Some of us are old enough that when we originally listened it was from the vinyl album or cassette and skipping was rather difficult. By the way....now with CD's I program it out of play. I also deplore "Yoga is as yoga does" but every now and then for some apparent sadistic reason I listen to the blame thing. :wink:

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 10:46 am

I think what Elvis should have done in the 70's is record more songs by Tony Joe White, Dennis Linde, Mark James and Jerry Chesnutt.
Elvis did record songs by all these writers in the 70's, but they all could've written more for him and became his stable of writers in the 70's. (i.e Leiber & Stoller, Pomus & Shuman, Ben Weisman, Aaron Schroder and Otis Blackwell were in the early years.)

I think Felton Jarvis biggest asset as a person and producer was his ability to get everyone to like him and befriend them.
Tony Joe White and Dennis Linde supposedly were two friends of his so I think he should have utilized that to it's fullest potential and gotten more material from both of them.
In my opinion it is Felton's failure that he didn't

I think the 70's would have been better if Elvis had recorded more songs by Tony Joe White.
Last edited by brian on Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:14 am

likethebike wrote:To lavish so much praise on a spirited but hardly remarkable performance of "Tweedle Dee" is kind of evidence of the bias that Greg speaks about. If it's from the '50s and it's a rock n' roll oriented track, hell it must be good. It's not that it's not a solid track but again we have overpraise because it fits a certain style.

Actually, you miscategorize my words in a vain attempt to make a counterpoint. Lavish praise is reserved for recordings like "Mystery Train," "If I Can Dream" or "Promised Land."

No, Elvis' live 1955 performances of "Tweedlee Dee" are simply another example of a twenty year-old remaking the music and popular culture by his own exuberance, blazing sexuality and unique musical talent.

Otherwise, yeah, it's just another song.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:34 am

If it's blazingly sexy than what's "Such a Night" or "So Glad You're Mine" or "Fever?"

It's a decent performance but there's not much variation in Elvis' performance and not an especially great difference between Elvis' interpretation and Lavern Baker's version. I think the latter is much better thought out. It just doesn't compare in terms of excitement against many of his other live recordings including his torrid versions of "Hound Dog" and "I Got A Woman." He reinvents those songs. He doesn't reinvent this. To get back to the original argument though, the phrasing Elvis uses on his version of "There Goes My Everything" is much more unique to him. My point echoes what Booker T said a few posts back. Consider songs on a case by case basis. (Although "My Wish Came True" is a personal favorite.) I feel sometimes journeyman or less work from the 1950s is elevated over inspired performances from Elvis' later years because the '50s are the hip choice. Sometimes journeymen or less rockers are elevated over inspired ballads. Taste of course is the great divider and I can't tell anyone what to like or dislike. I just try and interpret things as they strike me personally.

Ernst has addressed 3577's point. And for some reason, fans are put off by the different structures and arrangements of '50s and early '60s songs by all artists. Actually pre-folk rock, preRevolver type music. One guy I know said the reason he owned the later Beatles' records but wouldn't buy the early Beatles is because the early Beatles' stuff was "so simple." I explain how groups like the Ramones owe so much to this sound, how much the country performers they love owe to rockabilly, how much Boyz II Men owes to doo wop and it falls on deaf ears. I spoke to the doo wop singer Kenny Vance about this and he believes because of shows like Happy Days a lot of fans think its Mickey Mouse or something or mere novelties. Things aren't helped by the short memory history you get on pop channels like VH1.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 4:01 pm

3577 wrote:I wont be surprised if this person asks me if ''Tweedle Dee'' was recorded in 1826 and ''w-t-f'' is this??? I know, equipment wasn't that developed in the 1950's. But still........

I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.

I just used "Tweedle Dee" because the song does absolutely nothing for me as opposed to "There Goes My Everything" which I love. I would never play that particular 50's tune to a non-fan. As I wouldn't play something like "My Wish Came True." The back-up singing on that track is atrocious.

Not counting most of the movie tunes, there are very few Elvis songs from any decade that I wouldn't play to a non-fan. I am embarrassed by such a minute amount of Elvis tunes that they aren't worth mentioning.

However, there are some from all decades.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 4:24 pm

brian wrote:I think what Elvis should have done in the 70's is record more songs by Tony Joe White, Dennis Linde, Mark James and Jerry Chesnutt.
Elvis did record songs by all these writers in the 70's, but they all could've written more for him and became his stable of writers in the 70's. (i.e Leiber & Stoller, Pomus & Shuman, Ben Weisman, Aaron Schroder and Otis Blackwell were in the early years.)

I think Felton Jarvis biggest asset as a person and producer was his ability to get everyone to like him and befriend them.
Tony Joe White and Dennis Linde supposedly were two friends of his so I think he should have utilized that to it's fullest potential and gotten more material from both of them.
In my opinion it is Felton's failure that he didn't

I think the 70's would have been better if Elvis had recorded more songs by Tony Joe White.


I agree for the most part Brian, but not all of Jerry Chestnutt's tunes are winners. T*R*O*U*B*L*E is the pick of the litter, and It's Midnight and Love Coming Down are reasonably good songs. But Never Again is at best mediocre and Woman Without Love is exactly the kind of filler quality tune that should've gone in the rejection pile. Somebody should've asked Chestnutt if he had more tunes like T*R*O*U*B*L*E.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 4:54 pm

Pete Dube wrote: Somebody should've asked Chestnutt if he had more tunes like T*R*O*U*B*L*E.


Perhaps Elvishimselvis. :wink:

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:47 pm

Rob wrote:
3577 wrote:I wont be surprised if this person asks me if ''Tweedle Dee'' was recorded in 1826 and ''w-t-f'' is this??? I know, equipment wasn't that developed in the 1950's. But still........

I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.

I just used "Tweedle Dee" because the song does absolutely nothing for me as opposed to "There Goes My Everything" which I love. I would never play that particular 50's tune to a non-fan. As I wouldn't play something like "My Wish Came True." The back-up singing on that track is atrocious.

Not counting most of the movie tunes, there are very few Elvis songs from any decade that I wouldn't play to a non-fan. I am embarrassed by such a minute amount of Elvis tunes that they aren't worth mentioning.

However, there are some from all decades.

Just don't play Tucson '76 to a non-fan, it is not a pretty sight....

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 10:16 pm

midnightx wrote:
Rob wrote:
3577 wrote:I wont be surprised if this person asks me if ''Tweedle Dee'' was recorded in 1826 and ''w-t-f'' is this??? I know, equipment wasn't that developed in the 1950's. But still........

I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.

I just used "Tweedle Dee" because the song does absolutely nothing for me as opposed to "There Goes My Everything" which I love. I would never play that particular 50's tune to a non-fan. As I wouldn't play something like "My Wish Came True." The back-up singing on that track is atrocious.

Not counting most of the movie tunes, there are very few Elvis songs from any decade that I wouldn't play to a non-fan. I am embarrassed by such a minute amount of Elvis tunes that they aren't worth mentioning.

However, there are some from all decades.

Just don't play Tucson '76 to a non-fan, it is not a pretty sight....


It's ok midnightx, I'm positive "New Haven '76" will be better ...

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:11 pm

Pete Dube wrote:
brian wrote:I think what Elvis should have done in the 70's is record more songs by Tony Joe White, Dennis Linde, Mark James and Jerry Chesnutt.
Elvis did record songs by all these writers in the 70's, but they all could've written more for him and became his stable of writers in the 70's. (i.e Leiber & Stoller, Pomus & Shuman, Ben Weisman, Aaron Schroder and Otis Blackwell were in the early years.)

I think Felton Jarvis biggest asset as a person and producer was his ability to get everyone to like him and befriend them.
Tony Joe White and Dennis Linde supposedly were two friends of his so I think he should have utilized that to it's fullest potential and gotten more material from both of them.
In my opinion it is Felton's failure that he didn't

I think the 70's would have been better if Elvis had recorded more songs by Tony Joe White.


I agree for the most part Brian, but not all of Jerry Chestnutt's tunes are winners. T*R*O*U*B*L*E is the pick of the litter, and It's Midnight and Love Coming Down are reasonably good songs. But Never Again is at best mediocre and Woman Without Love is exactly the kind of filler quality tune that should've gone in the rejection pile. Somebody should've asked Chestnutt if he had more tunes like T*R*O*U*B*L*E.


Jerry Chesnutt was a good writer though

He wrote a lot of good country hits for several artists.

I think Jerry Chestnutt was a friend of Lamar Fike who in turn introduced him to Elvis


So Elvis actually knew all these writers personally except Dennis Linde which makes it more mind boggling to me that he didn't get more material from them.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:09 am

minkahed wrote:
midnightx wrote:
Rob wrote:
3577 wrote:I wont be surprised if this person asks me if ''Tweedle Dee'' was recorded in 1826 and ''w-t-f'' is this??? I know, equipment wasn't that developed in the 1950's. But still........

I think most of the non-fans will prefer a 70's recording over a 50's. Big time.

I just used "Tweedle Dee" because the song does absolutely nothing for me as opposed to "There Goes My Everything" which I love. I would never play that particular 50's tune to a non-fan. As I wouldn't play something like "My Wish Came True." The back-up singing on that track is atrocious.

Not counting most of the movie tunes, there are very few Elvis songs from any decade that I wouldn't play to a non-fan. I am embarrassed by such a minute amount of Elvis tunes that they aren't worth mentioning.

However, there are some from all decades.

Just don't play Tucson '76 to a non-fan, it is not a pretty sight....


It's ok midnightx, I'm positive "New Haven '76" will be better ...

When it comes to 1976 shows, making a definitive statement on the quality is a gamble....

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:55 am

likethebike wrote:If it's blazingly sexy than what's "Such a Night" or "So Glad You're Mine" or "Fever?"

Carnal, rapturous and sensual, respectively.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Sun Oct 11, 2009 7:01 pm

Once again, the two Felton "Hits" and "Misses" threads are fascinating and interesting.

Re: For minkahed: Felton Jarvis Misses, 1970-1976

Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:58 pm

minkahed wrote:Once again, the two Felton "Hits" and "Misses" threads are fascinating and interesting.

Thank you!

Invigorating discussion is what it's all about!!