Live 1950s's non-TV video & audio footage of Elvis found

Hi PEP

I suppose this is the afternoon show
AS the different clips that I have seen are all from the afternoon show

You write that its the complete performance of Elvis
and that its over 15 min ,but the afternoon show is almost 30 min in lengt
Or is this the complete performances of 4 or 5 songs

do you now any thing about this?

Sorry, I have No further information

PEP

Sure PEP, whatever you say!

Mr. Pirzada is going to be laying out some serious money, if he's going to release this properly... given that he'll probably get charged somewhere in the neighborhood of $10,000 for **each** song that needs to be cleared by the respective music publishers; plus the union fees for the musicians that are performing (both seen and unseen); plus the fee that RCA/BMG may well want for issuing their clearance (since they probably were assigned the rights to Elvis' live performance recordings after he was under contract to them); plus the clearance fee for the use of Elvis' likeness that EPE will want (since celebrities control the rights to the use of their likeness in connection with any commercial venture)...

Glad I'm not paying for all of it!

-Kevin

Hi PEP

I suppose this is the afternoon show
AS the different clips that I have seen are all from the afternoon show

You write that its the complete performance of Elvis
and that its over 15 min ,but the afternoon show is almost 30 min in lengt
Or is this the complete performances of 4 or 5 songs

do you now any thing about this

either way this is the most fantastic news WAUV

I look forward to a on tour and a TTWII dvd box (if where that lucky)

but to see this tupelo footage with original sound will just be out of this world ,even just for a couble of complete songs

This is the Biggets Elvis news in many many years

Doc ,Tallhair where are you now it really starts to get exiting

Elvis in 1956 in his home town pulling all the stops and a hot band behind him ,with thousand of teenagers screaming there lungs out at his feet
can it get anybetter

here here

This unreleased Elvis footage in Concert from Tupelo 1956,
contains the complete performance of Elvis with the
original sound. (officially licenced from the copyright owner)

Who is the copyright owner, EPE for his image, or RCA/BMG for the music?

It is a little hard to believe that back in 1956 somebody filmed an entire show with sound...and sat on it for 30 years (post death) without cashing in

All manner of questions come to mind...was it 16mm or 8mm (no super 8 in those days). Either way the tape recorder and associated battery packs would be huge.

And no one noticed.

Not even mixing boards those days, so an audience recording. Of course he could have hung a boom mike over the stage.

As everyone there seems to be blind.

Would have to be the afternoon show, unless there was a lightning rig.

Which no one noticed.

The entire show, must have had two cameras to ensure that nothing was lost when the reel changes were made. No cartridges to slap in those days, you actually had to thread the fim. On a 30 minute show you would need 3 spools at the very least..

Wish I was the one who took the film (worth an absolute fortune) and sold it for probably peanuts to a dodgy rip off guy in England. Yeah right

This unreleased Elvis footage in Concert from Tupelo 1956,
contains the complete performance of Elvis with the
original sound. (officially licenced from the copyright owner)

Who is the copyright owner, EPE for his image, or RCA/BMG
for the music?

My guess is in theory you would be correct, however
I just wonder if in this case there are some loop holes...

For example regarding the audio, in this case would
it fall under the public domain act in Europe?

An for the sake of arguement would that be the same case
for the his image....

Anyone know?

PEP

Last edited by PEP on Fri Mar 23, 2007 12:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

Hi everyone

EIN has just added some of the biggest news in years -

Sources close to the UK based Memphis Recording Service label tell us that Joseph Pirzada is currently finishing off his latest project that will bring for the first time ever, unreleased Elvis footage in Concert from the 1950’ with original sound. To date, the only live 50’s performance footage with sound we know are from the TV shows. The release will also include an unreleased interview with Elvis from 1957 and live audio music. More details to follow…

Nigel
http://www.elvisinfonet.com

Fantastic . And so called long time inner circle big experts (in their own view, I don't give names.. ) who have always spread negative hopes too us that nothing new exists in the archives. Well history always tells us that stuff exists even from the 50s. The only way to have new stuff are paying the money...

Kenneth

money talks.

My guess is in theory you would be correct, however
I just wonder if in this case there are some loop holes...

For example regarding the audio, in this case would
it fall under the public domain act in Europe?

An for the sake of arguement would that be the same case
for the his image....

Anyone know?

PEP

No, since this is a live performance that took place in the United States, it would properly be subject to US Copyright restrictions.

Even if the performance itself were somehow to be considered a public domain performance (and I don't think for a moment that RCA/BMG would be ready to concede that point), the publishing on the songs is most definitely **not** public domain-- unless Elvis is wowing the crowd with selections from the Stephen Foster songbook. So those will definitely have to be cleared.

According to US legal precedents, EPE would control the use of Elvis' likeness, and therefore, they would have a right to raise clearance issues regarding its use in connection with this commercial project. In fact, all of the on-camera performers will have to have their appearances cleared, on top of the payment of their respective union performance fees.

So, there really isn't a cheap way out, these days...

-Kevin

"According to US legal precedents, EPE would control the use of Elvis' likeness, and therefore, they would have a right to raise clearance issues regarding its use in connection with this commercial project."

Looking at all the very cheaply made Elvis DVD's here in the UK,I don't think EPE would have a say in this project,if it's a strictly European release that is,as I'm sure EPE wouldn't have allowed some of the crap that's out there to hit the shelves if they had control over that material here in the .UK.

Looking at all the very cheaply made Elvis DVD's here in the UK,I don't think EPE would have a say in this project,if it's a strictly European release that is,as I'm sure EPE wouldn't have allowed some of the crap that's out there to hit the shelves if they had control over that material here in the .UK.

I'm pretty certain that I wouldn't want to be the person that decides to challenge them by issuing something like this... because frankly, they just might decide to sue for damages anyway. And once a lawsuit gets filed, it forces the defendant to hire attorneys to defend themselves-- and believe me, I think I can guess which side of the argument can most afford to drag out litigation, if they choose to.

-Kevin

Looking at all the very cheaply made Elvis DVD's here in the UK,I don't think EPE would have a say in this project,if it's a strictly European release that is,as I'm sure EPE wouldn't have allowed some of the crap that's out there to hit the shelves if they had control over that material here in the .UK.

I'm pretty certain that I wouldn't want to be the person that decides to challenge them by issuing something like this... because frankly, they just might decide to sue for damages anyway. And once a lawsuit gets filed, it forces the defendant to hire attorneys to defend themselves-- and believe me, I think I can guess which side of the argument can most afford to drag out litigation, if they choose to.

-Kevin

Kevin I agree with everything you said.

At the same time there was a fellow by the name of Sid Shaw
who challeged EPE in the 90's, who has claimed he won his
court case against EPE...anyway this is what he said a while back...

I sued Elvis Presley Enterprises Inc in the UK High Court and Court of Appeals and beat them in landmark legal battles in 1997 and 1999 canceling their trade marks and making Elvis Presley public domain in this country. If I hadn’t succeeded Elvis fans in Britain and Europe would find life a lot tougher and be controlled like they are in America having to pay to use the name Elvis even for their charity fund-raising efforts.


Now, I just wonder if this project is then inreturn somehow protected....
at least in Europe...against EPE really being able to do anything...

PEP

This news might bring Ger back to us.

Or bring the Doc back to slag it off, much like he did with the other Memphis Recording Service's great releases.

This is one great news!
can't wait to see that

From elvis.com.au (bold text my doing):

Joseph Pirzada is working on a new DVD-Video/Audio and Book release. The DVD will contain nearly 25 minutes of newly found concert footage from the 50's with complete filmed song performances (more than 1) with sound and an unreleased interview with Elvis from 1957.

The film is currently being restored for the first time ever although no definite release date has been given except that it will be very very soon.

The book contains well over 100 pictures and artifacts (95% of them unseen).

Joseph is the owner so there are no legal issues what so ever and the sound thankfully, is already PD. Joseph tells us; "This is the most exciting thing in years, to think that an Elvis concert from the 50's with sound is possible. I must say I am very proud to be at the helm of this project"

It has to be the amateur filmed footage, one which I missed out on last year.
I tried to buy it but it was sold extremely fast.
It has been part of a collection from an Elvis fan in Lubbock, TX since the early days.
He had a large collection of 1950 footage, with some very rare performances.
His first filming was at the Fair Park Auditorium, hometown Lubbock. 2 performances and Tupelo
The 56 footage : Forth Worth, Shreveport, Richmond Norfolk, Lubbock, El Paso, New Orleans, Tupelo, San Antonio.
1957: Tupelo, San Francisco, Oakland, Los Angeles
Also footage Elvis eating somewhere with reporters and driving off etc.
Some have sound which is very rare in those days.

His grandson did put it on eBay last year and they were approached within 10 minutes.
He didn’t reveal the amount but it was a great deal as he said it.
He mentioned that the buyer said that he was thinking of using a part ot it for a DVD.
There are not too much people with that much money and releasing possibilities.
I tried to buy some the collection, asked what is was but he said that he had a buyer already, it it wouldn’t come through he would get back to me.
He had also a lot of photos and souvenirs and the ticket stubs.
I think that some of this will be on the release…. Anyway a very nice idea indeed a tour DVD from the 50’s well in this way I get it much cheaper.

Let’s hope I’m right!

It has to be the amateur filmed footage, one which I missed out on last year.
I tried to buy it but it was sold extremely fast.
It has been part of a collection from an Elvis fan in Lubbock, TX since the early days.
He had a large collection of 1950 footage, with some very rare performances.
His first filming was at the Fair Park Auditorium, hometown Lubbock. 2 performances and Tupelo
The 56 footage : Forth Worth, Shreveport, Richmond Norfolk, Lubbock, El Paso, New Orleans, Tupelo, San Antonio.
1957: Tupelo, San Francisco, Oakland, Los Angeles
Also footage Elvis eating somewhere with reporters and driving off etc.
Some have sound which is very rare in those days.

His grandson did put it on eBay last year and they were approached within 10 minutes.
He didn’t reveal the amount but it was a great deal as he said it.
He mentioned that the buyer said that he was thinking of using a part ot it for a DVD.
There are not too much people with that much money and releasing possibilities.
I tried to buy some the collection, asked what is was but he said that he had a buyer already, it it wouldn’t come through he would get back to me.
He had also a lot of photos and souvenirs and the ticket stubs.
I think that some of this will be on the release…. Anyway a very nice idea indeed a tour DVD from the 50’s well in this way I get it much cheaper.

Let’s hope I’m right!

Thanks for the info, Thekingstillrocks.
This release sounds like it could be a cracker.
Any idea on the sort of dollars this film would have sold for?

It has to be the amateur filmed footage, one which I missed out on last year.
I tried to buy it but it was sold extremely fast.
It has been part of a collection from an Elvis fan in Lubbock, TX since the early days.
He had a large collection of 1950 footage, with some very rare performances.
His first filming was at the Fair Park Auditorium, hometown Lubbock. 2 performances and Tupelo
The 56 footage : Forth Worth, Shreveport, Richmond Norfolk, Lubbock, El Paso, New Orleans, Tupelo, San Antonio.
1957: Tupelo, San Francisco, Oakland, Los Angeles
Also footage Elvis eating somewhere with reporters and driving off etc.
Some have sound which is very rare in those days.

His grandson did put it on eBay last year and they were approached within 10 minutes.
He didn’t reveal the amount but it was a great deal as he said it.
He mentioned that the buyer said that he was thinking of using a part ot it for a DVD.
There are not too much people with that much money and releasing possibilities.
I tried to buy some the collection, asked what is was but he said that he had a buyer already, it it wouldn’t come through he would get back to me.
He had also a lot of photos and souvenirs and the ticket stubs.
I think that some of this will be on the release…. Anyway a very nice idea indeed a tour DVD from the 50’s well in this way I get it much cheaper.

Let’s hope I’m right!

Great info, judging by your post I assume the buyer was Mr. Pirzada himself. At least if it was him, it will eventually be shared with the public, rather then having a private collector lock it up for another 50 years!

It has to be the amateur filmed footage, one which I missed out on last year.
I tried to buy it but it was sold extremely fast.
It has been part of a collection from an Elvis fan in Lubbock, TX since the early days.
He had a large collection of 1950 footage, with some very rare performances.
His first filming was at the Fair Park Auditorium, hometown Lubbock. 2 performances and Tupelo
The 56 footage : Forth Worth, Shreveport, Richmond Norfolk, Lubbock, El Paso, New Orleans, Tupelo, San Antonio.
1957: Tupelo, San Francisco, Oakland, Los Angeles
Also footage Elvis eating somewhere with reporters and driving off etc.
Some have sound which is very rare in those days.

His grandson did put it on eBay last year and they were approached within 10 minutes.
He didn’t reveal the amount but it was a great deal as he said it.
He mentioned that the buyer said that he was thinking of using a part ot it for a DVD.
There are not too much people with that much money and releasing possibilities.
I tried to buy some the collection, asked what is was but he said that he had a buyer already, it it wouldn’t come through he would get back to me.
He had also a lot of photos and souvenirs and the ticket stubs.
I think that some of this will be on the release…. Anyway a very nice idea indeed a tour DVD from the 50’s well in this way I get it much cheaper.

Let’s hope I’m right!

Great info, judging by your post I assume the buyer was Mr. Pirzada himself. At least if it was him, it will eventually be shared with the public, rather then having a private collector lock it up for another 50 years!

Amen, Brother Joe.

From elvis.com.au (bold text my doing):

Joseph Pirzada is working on a new DVD-Video/Audio and Book release. The DVD will contain nearly 25 minutes of newly found concert footage from the 50's with complete filmed song performances (more than 1) with sound...

Joseph is the owner so there are no legal issues what so ever and the sound thankfully, is already PD.

I'm not generally psychic, but I foresee someone getting a rude lesson in music publishing copyright, and possibly synchronization rights and performance contract law, in the future...

But that's what happens when ownership of physical elements is confused with ownership of underlying intellectual property rights, which are separate and distinct entities.

As was pointed out earlier, unless Elvis' performance consists of Gregorian chants or medieval minstrel ballads, at a minimum, the music publishing still needs to be cleared. And it's within the rights of the music publishers to forbid the use of their songs in a project for **any** reason-- say, for example, if they felt that the performers and/or the record label involved were not being properly compensated.

Just some food for thought.

-Kevin

From elvis.com.au (bold text my doing):

Joseph Pirzada is working on a new DVD-Video/Audio and Book release. The DVD will contain nearly 25 minutes of newly found concert footage from the 50's with complete filmed song performances (more than 1) with sound...

Joseph is the owner so there are no legal issues what so ever and the sound thankfully, is already PD.

I'm not generally psychic, but I foresee someone getting a rude lesson in music publishing copyright, and possibly synchronization rights and performance contract law, in the future...

But that's what happens when ownership of physical elements is confused with ownership of underlying intellectual property rights, which are separate and distinct entities.

As was pointed out earlier, unless Elvis' performance consists of Gregorian chants or medieval minstrel ballads, at a minimum, the music publishing still needs to be cleared. And it's within the rights of the music publishers to forbid the use of their songs in a project for **any** reason-- say, for example, if they felt that the performers and/or the record label involved were not being properly compensated.

Just some food for thought.

-Kevin

Kevin, not trying to be nosy, just wondering how long it takes to get projects like this off the ground, such as your outstanding Sullivan DVD!

Kevin, not trying to be nosy, just wondering how long it takes to get projects like this off the ground, such as your outstanding Sullivan DVD!

Well, to be rather exact, my contribution dealt with what was onscreen-- the actual behind-the-scenes heavy lifting was done by Andrew Solt, Greg Vines and their crack squadron of production professionals!

I'm sure the process of clearance, distribution and other necessary production negotiation took well over a year.

-Kevin

Gotta look up the songs he did that show.

Hope they can improve the sound .....

If our stores are full of cheap nasty b/w releases of Elvis' TV performances from 1956 why will their be a problem with this live '56 footage? I'm sick of seeing blurred Dorsey & Sullivan live performances on these type of releases - which does far more harm than a proper restored quality item.

Imagine buying one of these cheap DVD releases getting it home and seeing some Sullivan stuff and THEN passing on the Sullivan Box set because of the assumption that this was the quality of all Sullivan archive footage, surely doing great harm to the quality product?

Just my thoughts . . .

Exactly, Shaky. I've seen cheap DVDs of the Dorsey and Sullivan songs (in really shitty quality) in lots of shops. Nobody has stopped them, and there'll be so much product out for the 30th anniversary that EPE won't know who to sue first! Perzada's product will probably slip through the net.