All posts with more than 3000 Hits, prior to 2008

Complete Sessions?

Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:43 am

I was playing the FTD set 'His Hand In Mine' again tonight, and wondered why FTD couldn't have included the Complete session?

There's not much missing, don't get me wrong, but there's enough missing to stop us all from throwing away our bootlegs containing material from these sessions!

Quite a lot is just the count-in's missing but there are some complete takes and work parts missing too :-

Milky White Way - False Start of Take 7 before the Master
He Knows Just What I Need - Take 9
Surrender - Take 4 (Used for Master)
Surrender - Work Part Take 1
Surrender - Work Part Take 2
Surrender - Work Part Take 8 (Used for Master)
Mansion Over The Hilltop - False Start of Take 3 before the Master
In My Father's House - Take 8 (Used for Master)
In My Father's House - Work Part (Used for Master)

I know three Masters were used twice too, and this put them in context with the rest of the session where the count-in was added and maybe where a little more dialogue was also part of the take, as was done with 'Crying In The Chapel'.

At first I thought it must be because of disc space that the complete session wasn't released, but then started digging deeper into the CD's

Disc 1 has a playing time of 61 minutes 22 seconds
Disc 2 has a playing time of 79 minutes 14 seconds

This means that there is nearly 20 minutes of disc space that is not used on this set, which is more than enough space to put the on the 'Missing' tracks listed above, as well as all of the count-in's, and the Masters they used twice!

I know the Count-In's aren't neccessary, but I personally like to hear them as they complete a take and also add to the feel of the session.

My question is this - How many of you would like to see the full sessions released by FTD, if disc space permits them to do so?

Years ago, Ernst stated that they (BMG) would never release full sessions, presumably because he thinks the fans don't want this - but since the FTD release of 'Loving You' I thought maybe he'd changed his mind as the complete February 14 1957 session was used.

I know Ernst reads this Messageboard and gauges opinions from it - so let's let Ernst know one way or the other if we want complete sessions released or not!

I for one would love it!

Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:49 am

Agreed Keith. On these Classic doubles, if the complete session fits and is available, please please include all studio chat/count ins etc please!!!

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:08 am

I think it is anathema to Sony/BMG to "give it all away". They have to hold something back, even if it is just a couple of count ins, or a short false start. Need something "new" for the future!!!!

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:08 am

I've already thrown away all my bootlegs!! Oh wait!! I don't own any.

Question: If they give you everything NOW. What will they give you later??

Personally, I don't need every word, hiccup, false start, cuss word etc.

As for missing complete takes from this or other sessions, they're probably being held back for some future project.
Last edited by JerryNodak on Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:10 am

Keith i also agree i sold all my import cds a while ago hoping that ftd would release full sessions but now im trying to find surrender by Elvis again i think if ftd released complete session cds they would sell even more copys and has you said the boot cds will be no longer needed i would like everything from each session false starts the countin etc.. it might be boring to some people but not me .

Jess :D
Last edited by jess wade on Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:13 am

JerryNodak wrote:I've already thrown away all my bootlegs!! Oh Wait!! I don't own any.


Sh#t man, what was it you threw away then!!! :shock:

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:24 am

JerryNodak wrote:I've already thrown away all my bootlegs!! Oh wait!! I don't own any.

Question: If they give you everything NOW. What will they give you later??

Personally, I don't need every word, hiccup, false start, cuss word etc.

As for missing complete takes from this or other sessions, they're probably being held back for some future project.

I've asked this question before Jerry - but are you really a fan? Seriously?

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:25 am

Kieth you are correct and I agree the whole session should have been included. Also check out the near complete "follow that dream" session too on FTD.

The "what will they have later" arguement doesn't hold water because of couple of factors. These are limited edition collectors cd's not available to the general public. Once deleted they can re-issue them at a later date for future generations. And they could always release more, "country", 'gospel", or "love song" collections for 'later'.

Even if they release every single take of every song, they will continue to re-release all the stuff over and over again with different song orders and different covers to future generations. There are literally thousands of combinations they could do in the future.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:34 am

Yes, I am a fan, really!! Just not a fan (atic). I DON't need absolutely EVERYTHING!!!

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:38 am

but would you buy
His hand in mine and other ftds again just to get the complete sessions cause i think thats what will happen 1 day


Jess

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:40 am

Yes! I would like to buy all "complete sessions". I have a lot of original import cds with many complete sessions and I will not sell they. Kiss Me Quick complete sessions, I Got Stung, Tottaly stung, Surrender By Elvis, Finding The Way Home, Something Complete and many others. I like to listen the complete session of every song, including dialog and count in.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:45 am

Complete sessions with everything?? I'd never be able to sit through it.

If that means I'm not a fan by the usual mb definition, then so be it.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:55 am

Jerry all I'm trying to do is gauge opinions on what fans want, as I know Ernst visits and reads this Messagaboard.

If Ernst knows the opinions of us fans, maybe he'll change his mind about future FTD's and release the full sessions - if that's what the majority of fans want! But we need to let him know this.

I'm not trying to put you down in any way and I appreciate your input - all opinions are welcome, and are essential, to give an honest viewpoint.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:01 am

I would also like to have the complete sessions, count-ins and chatter as well. It kinda irks me that I still have to hunt around for all the missing tidbits I don't have. That means I still gotta buy the boots :evil:

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:20 am

I want the whole session too. That would have made this album, Follow That Dream, and Today perfect.

However, I need to arrest you, Keith. We did get those "missing" "Surrender" takes; they were spliced together for the master.

Per

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:28 am

thekingisalive wrote:However, I need to arrest you, Keith. We did get those "missing" "Surrender" takes; they were spliced together for the master.

Per

Not with the count-in's and chat we didn't! :wink:

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:30 am

BIGREDG wrote:Agreed Keith. On these Classic doubles, if the complete session fits and is available, please please include all studio chat/count ins etc please!!!


Ditto!!!


8)

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:56 am

That’s a valid point, Keith. I stand corrected. :lol:

Per

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:58 am

Keith: I understand what you're trying to accomplish. It just gets under my skin when someone asks if I'm a fan. I don't know what you're age is, but I can assure you I was listening to and enjoying Elvis' music long before many on this MB were born. Decades in some cases.

I don't know why Ernst didn't include everything from "His Hand In Mine,"
but I'm sure he had his reasons. In fact, I'd like to hear them.

Perhaps in the future FTD will include complete sessions on a "Classic" release. Will I but it?? Depends on the album. Would I ever be able to sit down and listen to the whole session in one sitting?? No. I don't listen to the 2-disc "Classic" albums that way now.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:59 am

The fact that there is 20 mins of disc space and material to fill it raises the question why it wasn't. Understandably if there was no room left then fine but from what I gather these classic album are supposed to collect all the takes released and unreleased and put them on one release - disc space permitting of course.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:07 am

Matthew, that was the purpose as originally stated by FTD, but they have failed to live up to it time and time again. I can just mention the following releases to prove my point:

Harum Scarum
Girl Happy
Follow That Dream
Elvis Today
His Hand in Mine

The list is much longer than this, but let’s not be totally pedantic.

Per

Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:14 am

thekingisalive wrote:Matthew, that was the purpose as originally stated by FTD, but they have failed to live up to it time and time again. I can just mention the following releases to prove my point:

Harum Scarum
Girl Happy
Follow That Dream
Elvis Today
His Hand in Mine

The list is much longer than this, but let’s not be totally pedantic.

Per


Well thankfully I have no interest in the soundtracks. Elvis Today would have been a perfect release if it wasn't for the mastering. His Hand In Mine is still a great release on the face of it - I don't own it yet as my opinion on the principle of re-releasing material already on FTD regular releases is not a positive one however, the mastering work by Kevan and Sebastian is swaying me otherwise.

Hopefully in the future the 70s masters will be given the same respect that the 50s master are with Kevan and the 60s master are with Sebastian. The question is who is the magic wizz to let loose on the 70s material.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:49 am

Keith F wrote:My question is this - How many of you would like to see the full sessions released by FTD, if disc space permits them to do so?


If space permits....,sure, but that is not a realistic question. If there is limited material available, FTD will release the most interesting stuf at optimum quality.

However - since many sessions do not even fit on a single cd - it is obvious that a choice was made to offer the best of both worlds: quality against budget. Unless you think that there is sufficient interest for fans to pay the extra cost to release a 4-cd pack of the 'Harum Scarum Outtakes' with 30+ false starts of STB (as an example) - you will understand that it is not all that simple and that credit should be given to Ernst in what he does best: find the best optimium between budget and delivery.

Keith F wrote:If Ernst knows the opinions of us fans, maybe he'll change his mind about future FTD's and release the full sessions - if that's what the majority of fans want! But we need to let him know this.

Again, it is not that simple. What do you expect ? That EJ says 'he boss..have you read the FECC MB'...I have a real sound business case: there are 11 people interested in some more 40 more outtakes at the same price - just let's do it ....please' ? Get real - most people forget that EJ reports to a boss with a business case and that his boss has to defend that business case as well.
Last edited by E-Cat on Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:55 am

E-Cat wrote:Most people forget that EJ reports to a boss with a business case and that his boss has to defend that business case as well.


I suspect Ernst to a degree is his own boss when it comes to FTD decisions. Working with Elvis' material for 20 years he has proberbly earned that luxury.

Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:59 am

Matthew wrote:
E-Cat wrote:Most people forget that EJ reports to a boss with a business case and that his boss has to defend that business case as well.


I suspect Ernst to a degree is his own boss when it comes to FTD decisions. Working with Elvis' material for 20 years he has proberbly earned that luxury.


Managing the Elvis Catalogue is based on a business case - more than ever before !