All posts with more than 3000 Hits, prior to 2008

Sun Nov 05, 2006 2:16 pm

shanebrown wrote:No, I don't think it's great material. No, Elvis shouldn't have been performing. No, this shouldn't have been filmed or released. But it was - and a bad situation was made worse by greedy record producers (instead of putting out a single disc it was a double) and the thoughtless editing of the show.


Let sleeping dogs lay.

Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:11 pm

Cryogenic wrote:Yeah.

That's never going to happen. Except if people wear their rose-tinted glasses beforehand.

The behind-the-scenes footage alone is heartbreaking. After Elvis receives the Medallion of Life from Monique, and considering how tired he looks, it's very uncomfortable watching him being dabbed and almost prodded by the makeup guy, again and again. It's like they were worried about his face cracking and falling off. The whole mood in that dressing room is so different to anything shown in TTWII. The contrast is evocative of a Shakespearean tragedy. Yet that footage is oddly compelling. The meeting between Elvis and Monique is interesting on a cultural level alone. And he is extremely sweet with that girl. Ultimately, the footage is what it is, and very sad at that.


Also, when he enters the dressing room, he stands in front of the mirror, taking a glance at himself. I wonder what his thoughts were...

Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:11 pm

Kylan wrote:
oh give it a rest dude!!! so because he looked relatively good and healthy for Aloha, and was an amazing one time concert event, he's supposed to be chided because he was shortchanging giving us just image and myth? but he's applauded to come out looking like near death when he should have been in ICU?? seriously get a grip!!! sorry fella but comments like that send me up the wall!!


Calm down, man! :lol: Where did I say he was shortchanging us or giving a bad performance in "Aloha"? That was a brilliant performance, but I still say he is more than anything else showing us a perfect "image", the legend Elvis. I feel the "real" Elvis is much more visible in TTWII and EOT. And I still say he seems to be trying pretty hard in Rapid City to give us a good show, despite everything. And that's worth a lot in my book.

That's it.

The footage is hard to watch but the point I was trying to get across was that "Joe Public" generally seems to believe Elvis was in even worse shape in his last years. Thus a release wouldn't really do any damage, but might instead evoke sympathy for a dying, but still fighting, artist. IMHO. And I'm getting tired of this subject too, you know! :wink:

Sun Nov 05, 2006 4:39 pm

I thought Aloha was a bit flat and uninteresting, just like watching the Oscars. Well I guess with Marty producing both it would a bit. It was a poor mans 68 Special at the time. It does little for me and I've never watched the entire DVD SE package.

CBS, someone asked about the lighting on page 1, why it had to be floodlit for EIC and yet On Tour etc was a better mood light. It was to do with the format it was recorded on. VT needed more light whereas film didn't. I've often thought that the so called Boston VT tapes from On Tour would look very dark, though I've yet to see any of it.

Whilst we are on EIC (strange there wasn't a thread already on this subject to save having to repeat type everything over again, nevermind) does anyone know what the following short clip is from re the song. It is NOT from the Teddy Bear - Dont Be Cruel performance - even though it was used for that. Elvis does come back to the stage and gives out three scarves all with his right hand. On this clip from Omaha he gives it out with his left. I'm trying to insert it into the right part of the show on the 19th but I'm unsure where it is from.

Clip Link

Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:30 pm

"Ultimately, the arguments are valid on both sides, I've come to realise. Omaha is the big stinker. Rapid City is a little more tolerable, at the very least. With tasteful and careful editing, the two could be fused and a good product could be born. The editing itself could even be a little artistic, but not too ornate, bringing some weaker moments to life in a new way. That said, I don't like the idea of hiding and sweeping away the truly bad moments, for that is a denial of history, and strips the Elvis Aaron Presley story of the scope and context it needs. If the darkest moments are not embraced and forgotten, then you have nothing to contrast the good against, and no roadmap for charting the decline of EP or the personality that shaped his music. A person's life is a complex tapestry, and while it can't all be celebrated, it should all be recognised and studied. I'll finish with a quotation from my favourite philosophical source: "If one is to understand the great mystery, one must study all its aspects..." "

Cryogenic : quite brilliantly put. I take my hat off to you.

Steve Morse

Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:33 pm

Steve Morse wrote:"Ultimately, the arguments are valid on both sides, I've come to realise. Omaha is the big stinker. Rapid City is a little more tolerable, at the very least. With tasteful and careful editing, the two could be fused and a good product could be born. The editing itself could even be a little artistic, but not too ornate, bringing some weaker moments to life in a new way. That said, I don't like the idea of hiding and sweeping away the truly bad moments, for that is a denial of history, and strips the Elvis Aaron Presley story of the scope and context it needs. If the darkest moments are not embraced and forgotten, then you have nothing to contrast the good against, and no roadmap for charting the decline of EP or the personality that shaped his music. A person's life is a complex tapestry, and while it can't all be celebrated, it should all be recognised and studied. I'll finish with a quotation from my favourite philosophical source: "If one is to understand the great mystery, one must study all its aspects..." "

Cryogenic : quite brilliantly put. I take my hat off to you.

Steve Morse


It was damn good wasn't it!

Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:42 pm

Steve_M wrote:Whilst we are on EIC (strange there wasn't a thread already on this subject to save having to repeat type everything over again, nevermind) does anyone know what the following short clip is from re the song. It is NOT from the Teddy Bear - Dont Be Cruel performance - even though it was used for that. Elvis does come back to the stage and gives out three scarves all with his right hand. On this clip from Omaha he gives it out with his left. I'm trying to insert it into the right part of the show on the 19th but I'm unsure where it is from.

Clip Link


Might that clip be during Hound Dog?

Axe

Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:48 pm

Steve_M wrote:I thought Aloha was a bit flat and uninteresting, just like watching the Oscars. Well I guess with Marty producing both it would a bit. It was a poor mans 68 Special at the time. It does little for me and I've never watched the entire DVD SE package.

CBS, someone asked about the lighting on page 1, why it had to be floodlit for EIC and yet On Tour etc was a better mood light. It was to do with the format it was recorded on. VT needed more light whereas film didn't. I've often thought that the so called Boston VT tapes from On Tour would look very dark, though I've yet to see any of it.

Whilst we are on EIC (strange there wasn't a thread already on this subject to save having to repeat type everything over again, nevermind) does anyone know what the following short clip is from re the song. It is NOT from the Teddy Bear - Dont Be Cruel performance - even though it was used for that. Elvis does come back to the stage and gives out three scarves all with his right hand. On this clip from Omaha he gives it out with his left. I'm trying to insert it into the right part of the show on the 19th but I'm unsure where it is from.

Clip Link


It's from Can't help falling in love in Omaha.. 100% sure.

Cheers, RJ

Sun Nov 05, 2006 11:15 pm

Thanks Robert, that looks spot on to me.

Just goes to show what a mish-mash cut up bodge job the edit was or just how poor a set of shows they were that they needed to to take mid range shots from the end of a show to pad out some of the middle.

For the record, having spent many many hours buried in both lots of footage for these shows, Omaha has taken on a new light to me and although not all of it I do like much of it more than Rapid city. That's not how I used to prefer it.

Sun Nov 05, 2006 11:20 pm

Steve_M wrote:CBS, someone asked about the lighting on page 1, why it had to be floodlit for EIC and yet On Tour etc was a better mood light. It was to do with the format it was recorded on. VT needed more light whereas film didn't. I've often thought that the so called Boston VT tapes from On Tour would look very dark, though I've yet to see any of it.


Thanks, Steve, for your reply! Should have thought of that myself! But "Aloha" was also videotaped, wasn't it?

Sun Nov 05, 2006 11:27 pm

Steve_M wrote:Thanks Robert, that looks spot on to me.

Just goes to show what a mish-mash cut up bodge job the edit was or just how poor a set of shows they were that they needed to to take mid range shots from the end of a show to pad out some of the middle.

For the record, having spent many many hours buried in both lots of footage for these shows, Omaha has taken on a new light to me and although not all of it I do like much of it more than Rapid city. That's not how I used to prefer it.


Kinda feel the same way. Vocally, many songs are better in Rapid City. True.
But us MB members usually rate Omaha very poor, but some songs are damn good anyway.
I won't start about the way he looked, we know that.
The dialogues are struggling in Rapid City, and Elvis noticed that too.
(I can sing but i can't talk, just like Mell Tellis-whoever that is :wink: )
Also, the crowd is way better in Omaha.
The Rapid City crowd is just dead meat.
I can imagine it must be a hell of a job to re-edit this stuff...

Cheers, RJ

Mon Nov 06, 2006 12:28 am

Joe Car wrote:
Steve Morse wrote:"Ultimately, the arguments are valid on both sides, I've come to realise. Omaha is the big stinker. Rapid City is a little more tolerable, at the very least. With tasteful and careful editing, the two could be fused and a good product could be born. The editing itself could even be a little artistic, but not too ornate, bringing some weaker moments to life in a new way. That said, I don't like the idea of hiding and sweeping away the truly bad moments, for that is a denial of history, and strips the Elvis Aaron Presley story of the scope and context it needs. If the darkest moments are not embraced and forgotten, then you have nothing to contrast the good against, and no roadmap for charting the decline of EP or the personality that shaped his music. A person's life is a complex tapestry, and while it can't all be celebrated, it should all be recognised and studied. I'll finish with a quotation from my favourite philosophical source: "If one is to understand the great mystery, one must study all its aspects..." "

Cryogenic : quite brilliantly put. I take my hat off to you.

Steve Morse


It was damn good wasn't it!


Thanks, guys!

I learn from the best (N880EP).

Bonus points if you can guess the source of my quotation. :wink:

Mon Nov 06, 2006 12:39 am

Steve_M wrote:
Just goes to show what a mish-mash cut up bodge job the edit was or just how poor a set of shows they were that they needed to to take mid range shots from the end of a show to pad out some of the middle.



Well,Steve there was bad editing in the broadcast version of Aloha Too,and there were new editing "Mistakes" in the Deluxe set too !!! Check out the ending of Burning Love.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:17 am

The Rapid City performance was better by a long shot but the crowd reaction was better in Omaha
rick

Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:27 am

How do you know this? Or rather, what do you judge this by ?

I notice that the crowd reaction in the EIC as broadcast showed the crowd from Rapid responding to scenes filmed in Omaha on many occasions.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:28 am

Cryogenic wrote:The behind-the-scenes footage alone is heartbreaking. After Elvis receives the Medallion of Life from Monique, and considering how tired he looks, it's very uncomfortable watching him being dabbed and almost prodded by the makeup guy, again and again. It's like they were worried about his face cracking and falling off. The whole mood in that dressing room is so different to anything shown in TTWII. The contrast is evocative of a Shakespearean tragedy. Yet that footage is oddly compelling. The meeting between Elvis and Monique is interesting on a cultural level alone. And he is extremely sweet with that girl. Ultimately, the footage is what it is, and very sad at that.


Never thought I would see the day when I agree wholeheartedly with you.......but......some very poignant
words Cryo.......same goes for your first post on this topic......well said.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:18 am

Cryo, ever since you joined this board, you have been a true asset to it . Thoroughly enjoyed your informative posts. Well done mate :wink:

Mon Nov 06, 2006 2:44 pm

June 21st 1977.

Elvis turns up looking okay and nods his welcome to the camera and proceeds down to the dressing room.

Next scene inside the dressing room we have a completely different character who is about to go on stage. Out of it, slurred and talking like he's swallowed Dr Nicks entire tour supply.

Why and whose decision was it to make Elvis look worse to go on stage than when he was off it ?

Not just for these CBS shows but for others as well. The CBS shows made him look even worse with that hideous make up that was rendered onto his face. The DVD scenes of My Way show clearly that this was over the top where the pulling of the scarves from around his neck have worn away the make up leaving a distictive line where the "rubber mask" stops and the real Elvis begins.
Then whats-her-name from CBS apparently asks Todd to get a good look at Elvis on the 26th when he gets the award because from the VT's they've watched Elvis looks real terrible. Huh ? Well who put him in that horrible greenish rubber mask then ?

Something wierd was sure going on in 1977.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:11 pm

We only get a short glimpse of Elvis arriving backstage in Rapid City, but you're right - funnily enough that's where Elvis looks his best in all the footage from the two shows... Something sure happened when the door to the dressing room was closed; Dr Nick was there with his black bag. I've always found that part rather eerie to watch, when the door opens again and Elvis looks so different. It wasn't just because of the bad make-up.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:26 pm

Hav-A-Tampa wrote:We only get a short glimpse of Elvis arriving backstage in Rapid City, but you're right - funnily enough that's where Elvis looks his best in all the footage from the two shows... Something sure happened when the door to the dressing room was closed; Dr Nick was there with his black bag. I've always found that part rather eerie to watch, when the door opens again and Elvis looks so different. It wasn't just because of the bad make-up.


I honestly don't think there is any mystery about what happened behind the closed door... it's just sad is all. :cry:
Last edited by elvis-fan on Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 6:10 pm

Well I think there is a mystery. It is as follows:

Why did they make Elvis look and act worse for stage than when he was off it ?

If there is a relevant answer to that then you're right, there's no mystery. But whilst I and others find it mysterious then I think there must be a mystery for it to be mysterious.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:02 pm

We must not forget that the stage lightning has a lot to say when it comes to how Elvis looked on stage compared to off stage.
Please don't try to create a myth here...like Dr. Nick fed Elvis with some pills etc :roll: ..and that's why he looked better off stage than on.

I think it is as simple as that...the stage lightning weren't as forgiving as the light backstage. Elvis was also a bit more relaxed.
People at this forum have some strange opinions sometimes...like they want things to be a mystery :lol:

Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:31 pm

Please don't try to create a myth here...like Dr. Nick fed Elvis with some pills etc ..and that's why he looked better off stage than on.

Well, Dr. Nick loading Elvis up on drugs is no myth. Whether that is a reason why his behaviour and appearance is so off during EIC can always be debated, but don't try to create a myth that "lighting" is the main reason Elvis looked better backstage.

Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:00 pm

Xaykev wrote:We must not forget that the stage lightning has a lot to say when it comes to how Elvis looked on stage compared to off stage.
Please don't try to create a myth here...like Dr. Nick fed Elvis with some pills etc :roll: ..and that's why he looked better off stage than on.

I think it is as simple as that...the stage lightning weren't as forgiving as the light backstage. Elvis was also a bit more relaxed.
People at this forum have some strange opinions sometimes...like they want things to be a mystery :lol:


Stage lighting ? The whole arena was lit for the CBS taping, this wasn't stage isolated stage lighting. He was better lit on the stage than he was having just got out of the car.

I don't want to create a myth that Dr Nick fed Elvis pills I want that to be a known bloody fact that Dr Nick fed Elvis pills. Dr Nick is on record as well confessing to having fed Elvis pills.

I don't have an opinion on why Elvis and those around him chose for him to look worse on stage than off it, strange or otherwise.
I would like to form an opinion on this but in order to form a calculated opinion i need to find some answers to something that mystifys me, why did they operate this policy ? not just for CBS (so that throws the "lighting theory out the window) but for many shows especially in 1977.

Next I'll be hearing that the man who at times couldn't barely move on stage in front of the public in 1977 without wincing in pain was able to run around playing football in private whilst on vacation in Hawaii. Bah-ha-hah, I know, I have a vivid imagination, maybe it was the Hawaiian lighting....

Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:08 pm

I don't have an opinion on why Elvis and those around him chose for him to look worse on stage than off it, strange or otherwise.


Well, the Mexican Sundial jumpsuit didn't help things....