All posts with more than 3000 Hits, prior to 2008

Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:18 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
carolynlm wrote:Not perfect???? Some of you are very difficult to please.

No, it's just that some of us prefer to honor the memory of Elvis by looking at his life and career in an honest and thoughtful manner.

carolynlm wrote:If there was anyone who was trying to 'sell' Elvis....the Aloha concerts are a pretty good place to start.

Not really.

The best place for anyone to begin an introduction to Elvis Presley is by viewing "Elvis '56" first, followed immediately by the two sit down shows taped for his 1968 TV Special, as released on DVD in 2004.

Entering the 1970s, TTWII SE is by far the most essential choice.



I agree with Carolyn about agreeing to disagree. While I largely share Doc's list of performances in order of historical importance, I think you too readily dismiss the Aloha show, (in your patented "this is the final word" /" the Oracle has spoken" tone). Doc, you kidder, you! :lol:

I agree with nearly all criticisms of the performance (as noted above) but let's not get carried away.

With the exception of maybe "My Way" (I prefer, shock of shocks, the '77 version), I think Kylan is on target with naming just some of the stellar tracks of that historic (and final) triumph: Likewise, we've all heard about how the '68 orchestrations were too busy and out of place, but really, let's not be armchair critics forever. Imagine yourself, seated in front of the tube in '68 or '73: any true fan is blown away.

Years later, analyzing the videos and DVDs from a jaded perspective, everyone is suddenly the would-be Bob Finkel or Bones Howe, etc.

Kylan wrote:CC Rider, Steamroller Blues, My Way, What Now My Love, Im So Lonesome, Big Hunk, Johnny B, I'll Remember You, You Gave Me A Mountain, Trilogy were all brilliant performances.



And how...!

Critic Dave Marsh also mostly raves over the show in his liner notes to the terrific DVD set. It's good to be mindful of Aloha's deficits, but within reason. :wink:
Last edited by Gregory Nolan Jr. on Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:23 am, edited 2 times in total.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:29 am

I always thought that his voice on the rehearsal concert was very shaky. By the time the main show came around whatever caused that problem seemed to have been rectified.
Also , if you listen to the very beginning of the "Alternate Aloha" cd from 1988 ,just before the opening bars of the 2001 Theme , you can hear Elvis say "ok , I'm ready when you are". Was there a tape recorder backstage , or was this just overdubbed for effect from the insert song sessions ????.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:33 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
JYM wrote:agree... On january 14, the music was perfect.

Perfect. Yes, yes, perfect.

Um, hey there JYM -- did you bother to read any of the previous two pages, or were you too engrossed with your Yanni "Live at the Acropolis" video?


I agreed to your post just before mine!

And to me, the music of Aloha is perfectly played by the band and the musicians of the orchestra.

And finally, yes I am a fan of Yanni. He is a great composer. Surely by far better than you poor guy...

Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:45 am

Gregory Nolan Jr. wrote:I agree with nearly all criticisms of the performance ...

FWIW, my comments were not necessarily criticisms, but a factual response to any fool who tries to claim the show was "perfect." Even James Brown at the Apollo isn't perfect. But it's close.

Actually, Sam Cooke's Live At The Harlem Square Club is just about perfect, come to think of it.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:10 am

It was a fine performance, but compared to EOT and TTWII, its a real let down to the electricity there was in the real Elvis Presley performance. His eyes are real glazed, and in the close up shots, he still, as Peter Guralnick put it, 'strangely bloated'. Some songs he sings very whiny and flat, like 'Suspicious minds' for example, although i love the movements in that performance

I would've loved if Elvis replaced songs like 'Welcome to my world' and 'Long tall Sally/Whole lot of shaking going on' with stuff that had'nt been released yet, like 'Its impossible', or something rocknroll he had'nt even tried like 'Too much'. Also, i would've loved if he, instead of doing that poppy ballad section of the show that cuts between the actual concert in the special, with songs he played on acoustic guitar. Elvis could've made it better, but hey, as he sang and said' walk a mile in my shoes'. After almost 20 years of doing this thing, i guess i'd be pretty worn out too

Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:30 am

True, we have over SEVEN HUNDRED SONGS to choose from, and thats just masters. We also have 1000s upon 1000s of different versions. I think that is a pretty damn good legacy

Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:31 am

Amen Caro........I love Aloha. Brilliantly done IMO........

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:26 am

[quote="carolynlm"]Not perfect???? Some of you are very difficult to please.
If there was anyone who was trying to 'sell' Elvis....the Aloha concerts are a pretty good place to start."

If you play the Aloha broadcast to young people ( I tried a couple of times), the reaction I gets is that he´s stiff and doesn´t rock out. But they think he´s quite cool in "On tour".

But my 87 year old father, thinks that Aloha is the best one...just because of the stiffness and the many ballads. So it depends on who you try to sell Elvis to.

//Björn

Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:36 am

carolynlm wrote:No the show wasn't perfect....but what is perfect?
Did Elvis ever perform a 'perfect' show from start to finish?
During Aloha, he looked great, sounded great, moved probably as much as the stage managers allowed him to.....and walked off the stage with having gained quite a few more fans.


The stiffness is very hard to explain. He moved a lot more on much smaller stages in 1956 or on the stand up shows 1968. He even moved more in Rapid city 1977!!!

//Björn

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:08 am

About the highlights of the show, nobody mentioned I´M SO LONESOME I COULD CRY. That was an outstanding performance. Apart from that, there were inspired and less inspired performances. This is not by any way EP best show but,at least, it was a triumph.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:26 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
JYM wrote:agree... On january 14, the music was perfect.

Perfect. Yes, yes, perfect.


Don't forget we're talking about music, which is one of the arts.

In the world of art, imperfections can make things 'perfect' !

It's all subjective.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:59 am

Reading this thread is like being in the twilight zone, I really can't believe what's being said. First there are the " bloated" comments", are you people fricking blind? How many classic photo's and portraits have we seen over the years from this show, too numerous to mention I dare say. Then his eyes were "glossy", again, what show were you people watching! Here's a guy who put on more great and memorable performances on TV that any performer that ever lived and under extreme pressure situations, because when EP appeared on TV, it was an event. From Berle, through the Sullivan shows, through the ridiculous Steve Allen show, then the comeback at Sinatra, then again the 68 special, ( the greatest performance in rock & roll history ) he then is asked to perform under the biggest stakes imaginable, a world-wide telecast done for the first time and knocks them dead, never mind the restictions, never mind that he had no margin for error. We fans have become really a--holes and unfair to Elvis and his legacy. The guy had to look perfect, sing perfect, dance, move and groove and speak perfect (even though he was prone to stutter a bit, even as a young man) or he gets critized. He wasn't a machine for phuck sakes and he wasn't God.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:15 pm

'Aloha' was one of the first LP's I ever bought after viewing the video in the late '70's. This was the first live Elvis I had ever seen after watching the movies on TV after he died. I loved the intensity of the way he sang, the closing of the eyes concentrating on the lyrics. 'Fever' at the time was my highlight, he seemed too have so much fun teasing the audience.

The power in his voice was amazing too me as a 10 year old. I still rate this show very highly as it made me a true fan of the man's talent.

Playing for all those countries in 1973 and indeed doing a damn fine job was indeed Elvis' personal career triumph and one too be very proud of.

Andy

Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:22 pm

carolynlm wrote:I really think that the stage managers would have had a lot to do with Elvis' 'non movement' during Aloha.......don't forget, this particular format had not been used a great deal....I think there was only a boxing match that had been beamed via satellite before this.....am I right? I'm not sure.....
Elvis was having as much of a good time as he probably felt he could...his movements during 'Fever'.....were so small, but he still caused the screams.....during the '68 Special Elvis states that 'they' told him he could do whatever he wanted to do....which was to sit down......maybe 'they' didn't say this to him for Aloha......who knows, we never will that's for sure...so why speculate....just enjoy.


Carolynlm, did you notice the difference between the rehearsal version of Fever as opposed to the Aloha show itself? The rehearsal version is more "sexy" if you will, he obviously toned it down the next night. I'm sure the Colonel in his own way mentioned to Elvis about playing it close to the vest, I'd bet on it.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:54 pm

jeanno wrote:About the highlights of the show, nobody mentioned I´M SO LONESOME I COULD CRY. That was an outstanding performance. Apart from that, there were inspired and less inspired performances. This is not by any way EP best show but,at least, it was a triumph.



Totally agree. That´s the masterpiece of the show. You can clearly see Elvis shiver with excitement at one point.

//Björn

Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:26 pm

Wasn't that what I said in the first place?

Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:58 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:The "Aloha" experience offers many nice moments, but it was never, and will never be, "perfect." And that's the way it is.


A perfect summary, Doc.

Was Elvis completely clean? His eyes look glazed over in parts and he can barely articulate the words in time for "Johnny B. Goode" and the "Long/Tall Sally/Whole Lotta Shakin' Goin' On" medley. Very sad. There are also weak performances of "Burning Love", "Something", "Love Me", "Blue Suede Shoes", "Hound Dog" and "Suspicious Minds". Even these weaker performances have their saving graces, however (e.g. love the slight pause after "rabbit!" during "Hound Dog"), but these performances don't remotely compare to earlier versions, or in the case of "Something", The Beatles' original. Elvis clearly had a very strong voice at the start of 1973 -- deep, rich, powerful -- but he just isn't trying consistently. He also sounds surprisingly "nasal", for want of a better word, throughout. Compare "Aloha" to the "Comeback Special" and the quality gap is like night and day. There are performances to be proud of -- "Steamroller Blues", "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry" (completely creams the Hank Williams original), "What Now My Love", "I'll Remember You", "An American Trilogy" and "A Big Hunk O' Love" -- but we've seen a more focused, more reliable Elvis than this. As good as "Aloha" is, and it is good, it clearly shows a different man from the late 60's, and marks the beginning of the end.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:52 pm

Cryogenic wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:The "Aloha" experience offers many nice moments, but it was never, and will never be, "perfect." And that's the way it is.


A perfect summary, Doc.

Was Elvis completely clean? His eyes look glazed over in parts and he can barely articulate the words in time for "Johnny B. Goode" and the "Long/Tall Sally/Whole Lotta Shakin' Goin' On" medley. Very sad. There are also weak performances of "Burning Love", "Something", "Love Me", "Blue Suede Shoes", "Hound Dog" and "Suspicious Minds". Even these weaker performances have their saving graces, however (e.g. love the slight pause after "rabbit!" during "Hound Dog"), but these performances don't remotely compare to earlier versions, or in the case of "Something",The Beatles' original. Elvis clearly had a very strong voice at the start of 1973 -- deep, rich, powerful -- but he just isn't trying consistently. He also sounds surprisingly "nasal", for want of a better word, throughout. Compare "Aloha" to the "Comeback Special" and the quality gap is like night and day. There are performances to be proud of -- "Steamroller Blues", "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry" (completely creams the Hank Williams original), "What Now My Love", "I'll Remember You", "An American Trilogy" and "A Big Hunk O' Love" -- but we've seen a more focused, more reliable Elvis than this. As good as "Aloha" is, and it is good, it clearly shows a different man from the late 60's, and marks the beginning of the end.


Well written but I beg to differ. First of all, his version of Something smokes the Beatles version, I also thought the medley was very good as well, as were the songs you mentioned that you like. Though I liked SM, I like it better with more movement, thus this was inferior. You also omitted It's Over which was also great. I just don't see where the "Elvis isn't trying" comes into play. By 1973 he was smooth and confident, perhaps he made it look too easy, but that's called confidence where I come from. If we use the 68 special as a measuring stick, then comparing anybody to that special isn't fair.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:22 pm

Joe Car wrote:First of all, his version of Something smokes the Beatles version


Elvis has a lovely smooth voice on this rendition of "Something", but he sounds a little dispassionate, too. His version is a little bit withdrawn and sullen -- when it should be sultry and enrapturing. The Beatles have this one.

Joe Car wrote:I also thought the medley was very good as well


It's exciting -- but let down by slurry vocals.

Joe Car wrote:Though I liked SM, I like it better with more movement, thus this was inferior.


It isn't just the movements that are lacking -- the vocal performance is equally uninspired. The performances he gave in 1969 annihilate it.

Joe Car wrote:You also omitted It's Over which was also great.


It's good -- but the Doc has highlighted a significant flaw.

Joe Car wrote:I just don't see where the "Elvis isn't trying" comes into play. By 1973 he was smooth and confident, perhaps he made it look too easy, but that's called confidence where I come from.


He does indeed make it look easy, and for that, he has my eternal admiration, but some of his performances are below par -- period.

Joe Car wrote:If we use the 68 special as a measuring stick, then comparing anybody to that special isn't fair.


Why not? Elvis is the performer in both. He didn't physically atrophy that much in four and a half years. And that's my point in comparing them. His mental outlook rapidly deteriorated. He was capable of so much more.
Last edited by Cryogenic on Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:24 pm

"Smokes the Beatles version?" You must be joking. Elvis' version is good, especially considering it's a live take with an orchestra. The Beatles only did one version (the studio version) so they had time to work on it...the melody, orchestration, bass, etc. makes for an incredible listening experience. Normally, I don't respond when people express their opinion as fact but "smokes the Beatles version" is so off-base that I felt the need to respond. Frank Sinatra even said that Something was the best love song of the past 30 years (and credited it to Lennon/McCartney but it was a Harrison song) and that was based on hearing the Beatles studio take. No one has improved on the Beatles' version of Something. ("Yesterday" on the other hand...)

Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:29 pm

ronnyg wrote:"Smokes the Beatles version?" You must be joking. Elvis' version is good, especially considering it's a live take with an orchestra. The Beatles only did one version (the studio version) so they had time to work on it...the melody, orchestration, bass, etc. makes for an incredible listening experience. Normally, I don't respond when people express their opinion as fact but "smokes the Beatles version" is so off-base that I felt the need to respond. Frank Sinatra even said that Something was the best love song of the past 30 years (and credited it to Lennon/McCartney but it was a Harrison song) and that was based on hearing the Beatles studio take. No one has improved on the Beatles' version of Something. ("Yesterday" on the other hand...)


Yeah, smokes the Beatles version, which is my opinion, as you have your's.
Just for the record, my guy sang his great version live, not in the studio.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:33 pm

Joe Car wrote:Yeah, smokes the Beatles version, which is my opinion, as you have your's.
Just for the record, my guy sang his great version live, not in the studio.


No offfence, Joe, but this sounds like jealousy talking. I don't think that there's an enormous disparity between the performances, especially taking into account the live aspect of Elvis', but The Beatles DO take the cake here. There was a chance for Elvis to blow people away here -- and he was the one that blew it with a dispassionate performance, coming in behind the original, when he could arguably, at least vocally, have surpassed it.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:19 pm

I agree with Joe for Something musically and vocally. Elvis at his worst will beat any of the Beatle vocally. The credit I give to them is to have composed it. That's it, that's all.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:36 pm

I agree with the comments regarding Elvis' rendition of Something although I would argue his August 1970 performance is superior to his Aloha performance.

Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:40 pm

If you really believe Elvis at his worst beats the Beatles vocally, check out his version of Hey Jude. If that is better to you than McCartney's vocal on the Beatles' version, you probably have listened to Do the Clam more in your life than Strawberry Fields Forever (meaning you pretty much listen to Elvis and not much else). Comparisons are fairly pointless anyhow. Elvis was a diffent type of vocalist than Lennon or McCartney (or Sinatra, Armstrong, Dylan, etc.)