Off Topic Messages

George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:53 pm

George Martin, has always been credited has the Beatles' is producer. So his responsibility has "producer" was to have a clear idea of what the song should sound like or how it should be presented and so fourth. That was his role and job and of course, he's credited on every Beatles album as "producer".

I've always had my doubts about George being credited "too much" in his role as "producer" and maybe not quite the genius some people seem to think he was, "the man responsible for making the Beatles sound".

Purely from memory, can't remember what mag it was or who the interviewr was, but i read this interview a few years ago of Ringo Starr. During the interview they talked a little bit about George Martin and his role as "producer'.

Interviewer, "must have been great having a producer like George"
Ringo, "i don't think George would mind me saying this and he would probably admit it himself, it was really John and Paul that produced the songs not George.
Interviewer, "so wasn't George any good in the studio then?"
Ringo, "yes he was good in the studio because the simple fact is, John & Paul couldn't read or write music. If they wanted say, a trumpet or whatever, they would go up to George and say, "we want this trumpet on here and we want it to go da da da da Daaaa" or whatever, then George would write that down, present it to the trumpet player and say, "thats what the boys want you to play".

As i say, can't remember where i read it but it's one of those chats that's always stuck in my mind. John and Paul wouldn't know anything about scales, clefs and semiquavers and so on. Everything they did was all in their heads. Being songwriters, they had the clear vision of how and what their songs should sound then explaining it to George so he could work out what it is they wanted.

I think Ringo's comment nailed it. Always what i had thought all along.

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Mon Aug 05, 2013 4:44 am

George Martin deserves every accolade for his work with the Fab Four, he was the perfect man to work with them.

At the start, the Beatles were very untutored about studio sessions, and he guided them. That Martin had worked with "The Goon Show," a band favorite, told them he was on their wavelength. Trust began early, and remained throughout the relationship. He also played on some of the songs and was allowed early on some input into the writing and arrangements. As the boys grew more savvy, he was smart enough to allow them to do what they wanted, even if he disagreed with some of the decisions.

He also wrote timeless scores for the songs which required them, as the Beatles expanded their musical palette. By the end, he was more advisor than producer, but still extremely welcome at Abbey Road, Trident, Apple or wherever they were making music.

Like Brian Epstein as the perfect person to manage them, George Martin was the perfect man for the job of producer.

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:19 am

Like you say, once they learnt there way around the studio, John & Paul took over. Lennon had once said in an interview, "George had hardly any knowledge of Rock'n'Roll when we first met him and we had never been in the studio, so we did a lot of learning together". But that's logical, first time in the studio you need someone like George to show you the ropes on how things work and so on. I'm not trying to discredit George, but trying to explain how it most probably was. Of course, George was a fully trained musician and skilled at writing music scores, probably went to university to learn all that. So to have someone like George around was very handy.

In reality, John & Paul were the real geniuses. Untrained that learnt there trade by ear from scratch and progessed as they went along. It's just something thats born in you. As far as their songwriting goes they learnt from each other, from their days in liverpool. Practising and getting better and learning how songs were constructed. No one can teach you how to write songs, that's something you can do or can't do. There will never be another two like them. We've had many great writers before them and after them, but that magical Lennon/McCartney duet will never be beaten, they were tops.

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:27 am

mysterytrainrideson wrote:Like you say, once they learnt there way around the studio, John & Paul took over. Lennon had once said in an interview, "George had hardly any knowledge of Rock'n'Roll when we first met him and we had never been in the studio, so we did a lot of learning together". But that's logical, first time in the studio you need someone like George to show you the ropes on how things work and so on. I'm not trying to discredit George, but trying to explain how it most probably was. Of course, George was a fully trained musician and skilled at writing music scores, probably went to university to learn all that. So to have someone like George around was very handy.

In reality, John & Paul were the real geniuses. Untrained that learnt there trade by ear from scratch and progessed as they went along. It's just something thats born in you. As far as their songwriting goes they learnt from each other, from their days in liverpool. Practising and getting better and learning how songs were constructed. No one can teach you how to write songs, that's something you can do or can't do. There will never be another two like them. We've had many great writers before them and after them, but that magical Lennon/McCartney duet will never be beaten, they were tops.


Indeed. But without the presence of George Martin at their EMI audition, and the many sessions to come, we would likely have never heard the genius of John Lennon and Paul McCartney.

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Mon Aug 12, 2013 12:38 am

Here's a salient example of what I'm talking about:

Taking it to Abbey Road, he asked George Martin for a 'fairground' production wherein one could smell the sawdust -- which, while not in the narrowest sense a musical specification, was, by Lennon's standards, a clear and reasonable request. (He once asked Martin to make one of his songs sound like an orange.) While the Beatles' producer worked more naturally with the conventionally articulate McCartney, the challenge of catering to Lennon's intuitive approach generally spurred him to his more original arrangements, of which BEING FOR THE BENEFIT OF MR. KITE! is an outstanding example. Using harmonium, harmonicas, and a tape of Victorian steam organs and calliopes cut up and edited into a kaleidoscopic wash, he created a brilliantly whimsical impression of period burlesque, ideally complementing Lennon's dry nasal delivery. Few producers have displayed a tenth of the invention shown here.

Ian MacDonald, Revolution in the Head: The Beatles' Records and the Sixties (Chicago: Chicago Review Press, Third Edition, 2007)

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:48 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:Here's a salient example of what I'm talking about:

Taking it to Abbey Road, he asked George Martin for a 'fairground' production wherein one could smell the sawdust -- which, while not in the narrowest sense a musical specification, was, by Lennon's standards, a clear and reasonable request. (He once asked Martin to make one of his songs sound like an orange.) While the Beatles' producer worked more naturally with the conventionally articulate McCartney, the challenge of catering to Lennon's intuitive approach generally spurred him to his more original arrangements, of which BEING FOR THE BENEFIT OF MR. KITE! is an outstanding example. Using harmonium, harmonicas, and a tape of Victorian steam organs and calliopes cut up and edited into a kaleidoscopic wash, he created a brilliantly whimsical impression of period burlesque, ideally complementing Lennon's dry nasal delivery. Few producers have displayed a tenth of the invention shown here.

Ian MacDonald, Revolution in the Head: The Beatles' Records and the Sixties (Chicago: Chicago Review Press, Third Edition, 2007)


George did well on "Kite". Lennon's imagination was a lot more creative and getting outside his brain for what he wanted couldn't have been easy. All credit to George.

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:57 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:George Martin deserves every accolade for his work with the Fab Four, he was the perfect man to work with them.


drjohncarpenter wrote:Like Brian Epstein as the perfect person to manage them, George Martin was the perfect man for the job of producer.


I agree with everything you wrote, it's a pity John Lennon didn't agree with us. Man, Lennon was such an assho#e!!!

http://music.yahoo.com/blogs/stop-the-presses/john-lennon-letters-reveal-bitterness-toward-george-martin-192300104.html

Amazingly, some people still worship the guy??? :wtf:

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:49 am

memfisking wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:George Martin deserves every accolade for his work with the Fab Four, he was the perfect man to work with them.


drjohncarpenter wrote:Like Brian Epstein as the perfect person to manage them, George Martin was the perfect man for the job of producer.


I agree with everything you wrote, it's a pity John Lennon didn't agree ...


Your lack of education betrays you yet again.

John Lennon, the leader of the Beatles and perhaps the greatest rock 'n' roll singer/musician/songwriter, appreciated George Martin as much as, if not more than, the other Beatles. He was a very intelligent, savvy person.

But the letter you reference is from a very angry period, circa 1971, where he had little good to say about anything regarding his group. He later made peace with Martin and McCartney. I'd recommend a few quality Beatles books where you could learn more, but that would be wasting my time and yours, since anyone may see your interest here has nothing to do with the topic.

Here's just a tidbit:

When Martin met John Lennon in Los Angeles in the mid-1970s, he took Lennon to task for some critical comments he'd made about Martin, published in "Rolling Stone". Lennon gave Martin a rare apology, and praised him for his dedication and hard work. (For Lennon's part, his "Rolling Stone" comments did include "George made us what we were in the studio," and "He helped us develop a language to talk to [other] musicians.")

George Martin
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0552326/bio



Thanks for stopping by!

::rocks

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:11 pm

On a sidenote; George's son Giles will be working with Paul McCartney on his new album- expected later this year.

http://www.contactmusic.com/story/paul- ... um_3809847

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:58 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:John Lennon........perhaps the greatest rock 'n' roll singer/musician/songwriter


Wrong. This is the guy you should put your money on!

image.jpg


::rocks
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Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:11 pm

memfisking wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:George Martin deserves every accolade for his work with the Fab Four, he was the perfect man to work with them.


drjohncarpenter wrote:Like Brian Epstein as the perfect person to manage them, George Martin was the perfect man for the job of producer.


I agree with everything you wrote, it's a pity John Lennon didn't agree with us. Man, Lennon was such an assho#e!!!

http://music.yahoo.com/blogs/stop-the-presses/john-lennon-letters-reveal-bitterness-toward-george-martin-192300104.html

Amazingly, some people still worship the guy??? :wtf:


TRUE

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:27 pm

memfisking wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:John Lennon........perhaps the greatest rock 'n' roll singer/musician/songwriter


Wrong. This is the guy you should put your money on!

Image

::rocks


Bruce is great, no doubt, but you're wrong again. Springsteen himself would say as much. He is also an intelligent, savvy man.

We've already established your input here is not motivated by the topic, so move on.

We want to have fun, not deal with your personal issues. Thanks!

::rocks ::rocks ::rocks

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:55 pm

Considering John Lennons greatest work was written "with a little help from his friends" (pun intended) and Lennon would/could not have written some of those great songs without Paul McCartney your statement just does not hold any water. Whereas Bruce Springsteens greatest work on the other hand, well guess who wrote those legendary songs/albums?

"God" (pun intended) loves a trier.

btw when are you gonna make it to Liverpool? Never been? Didn't think so.

::rocks

Re: George Martin--The Beatles' Producer.

Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:03 am

memfisking wrote:Considering John Lennons greatest work was written "with a little help from his friends" ...


Quite being a troll and move on. Thank you.