Off Topic Messages

Sat May 06, 2006 12:27 pm

TJ wrote:
Sean Ryan wrote:Thats right.

If you want to blame anyone for so many people voting for the BNP.Blame the Labour Party.


No, because that's a cop out. Anyone who votes for the BNP is either racist or stupid. It's impossible to justify a vote for those thugs. That's not to say I'm not also dubious at the way some local authorities house new immigrants, but a vote for those hateful bastards is not the answer.


TJ,
The reason why i thought it was Labour's fault that so many people voted for the BNP was cause of what the Work Minister Margaret Hodge said.

She said, regarding her Barking constituency " That 8 out of 10 white voters were considering voting BNP.
She was criticised for giving the BNP the publicity they wanted.

Sat May 06, 2006 1:10 pm

People should be held account for their own idiocy. But the other political parties, especially the one in power, should be held accountable for not adequately compensating for it. Any support the BNP gets is bad. Bad, bad, bad.

Sat May 06, 2006 1:54 pm

Cryogenic wrote:People should be held account for their own idiocy. But the other political parties, especially the one in power, should be held accountable for not adequately compensating for it. Any support the BNP gets is bad. Bad, bad, bad.


I agree.
Recently, there was an article about some of the Party Members of the BNP.Some had criminal convictions for gang-rape, football violence,assault,racial hatred(now theres a surprise) etc.

I cant understand some people angry towards the governments atitude regarding the immigration system but to vote for the BNP because of it is idiotic.

Sat May 06, 2006 2:24 pm

Sean Ryan wrote:
Cryogenic wrote:People should be held account for their own idiocy. But the other political parties, especially the one in power, should be held accountable for not adequately compensating for it. Any support the BNP gets is bad. Bad, bad, bad.


I agree.
Recently, there was an article about some of the Party Members of the BNP.Some had criminal convictions for gang-rape, football violence,assault,racial hatred(now theres a surprise) etc.


A year before Nick Griffin assumed membership, he himself was charged and convicted of incitement to racial hatred -- he got a two-year suspended sentence. Griffin has also consorted on numerous occasions with white supremacists in other countries. He's even supported and stood next to the likes of Colonel Gaddafi and Ayatollah Khomein. Now, of course, he thoroughly denounces terrorism, terrorist states and the entire religion of Islam. He also believes in a Jewish conspiracy to rule the world (which he has since re-packaged as a "Zionist conspiracy"). He denies the holocaust, but on certain occasions, he will admit it happened, yet claim it's been vastly overstated by a "Jewish, liberal media". Notice how he patterns his hair after Hitler, too, while many of his brethren sport crewcuts and skinheads. Like Hitler, Griffin doesn't love just any white person, either -- he has made some hateful comments about homosexuals, for example. The list of his attrocious beliefs and attitudes is endless.

His party is another matter entirely. Virtually none of the BNP members who managed to become councillors had any real political knowledge; most didn't attend council meetings at all. I remember one being interviewed on TV a few years back -- he literally couldn't answer any question put to him. I'm not talking evasion; I'm talking stood-there-dumbfounded. The party lies, cheats, intimidates and punches its way to power. Its methods are brutal, but they pale in comparison to its policies, which are nothing short of horrific. But I'm preaching to the enlightened here. If you're interested in more:

http://www.stopthebnp.org.uk/uncovered/pg01.htm

Sean Ryan wrote:I cant understand some people angry towards the governments atitude regarding the immigration system but to vote for the BNP because of it is idiotic.


Unfortunately, I have a wayward uncle who scrapped his Labour party membership and went over to the BNP. He seems to be beyond hope all now. Looking back, I can say he's always harboured racist tendencies, but it was an assault by two Black gangsters that pushed him over the edge. It's perfectly understandable -- but in no way acceptable. Now he throws every cliche and distortion in the book at me whenever I see him (which is, you'll be surprised to learn, hardly ever). We're constantly dealing with bigots and fools on this message board, too. The fight goes on.

Sat May 06, 2006 2:56 pm

Hi Cryogenic,

Thanks for posting that.
Interesting read.

Concerning your Uncle.Its a shame when something like that happens and it changes that persons views regarding colour.

I,ve always said that the vast majority of people in this world, regardless of colour or religon or what country they are in, are good honest people who just want to live a good life, but there is a small minority from all walks of life who want to spoil it for everyone.

Its very sad. :cry:

Sat May 06, 2006 8:36 pm

Sean Ryan wrote:TJ,
The reason why i thought it was Labour's fault that so many people voted for the BNP was cause of what the Work Minister Margaret Hodge said.

She said, regarding her Barking constituency " That 8 out of 10 white voters were considering voting BNP.
She was criticised for giving the BNP the publicity they wanted.



Margaret Hodge said that to warn other voters that they had to get off their backsides to vote if they wanted to prevent BNP success. I'm sorry, but blaming her is just ridiculous. I can't imagine anyone voting BNP simply because of what she said. If so, they are too bloody stupid to have the vote.

Sun May 07, 2006 1:36 am

It was her own Party that actually blamed her.It was the wrong thing for her to say.
If anyone voted for the BNP cause of what she said then they are stupid.

Sun May 07, 2006 12:51 pm

A lot of people where I live are very concerned regarding many issues that Labour are failing to recognise, 10 miles one way from me is Burnley where Asians were rioting the other year, 30 miles the other way is bradford where Asians were rioting the other year, immigrants come into our area from all over and it appears that they take precedence over the locals and you wonder why some people listen to what the BNP are saying regarding putting British people first instead of kowtowing to the immigrants, Me, I personally can see right through the BNP but some people are taken in, (young and old) that's one of the resons why people are voting for them, theya re sick of being treated as second class citizens in their own country.

Sun May 07, 2006 1:06 pm

People will stop voting BNP when the Government stops allowing everyone and anyone into this country and then putting them first. Immigrants get precedence when it comes to housing and other benefits. If they are refused anything they complain that we are racist and everyone immediatley caves in to their demands.

We've got islamic extremists bombing us and threatening us, riots in Northern cities, foreign criminals released into the community to strike again and disgusting scenes such as those witnessed a few months ago in London where that idiot dressed as a suicide bomber and others walked through our streets calling for our extermination :shock:

The BNP are not the answer. I dont believe all the anti BNP rhetoric any more than I believe theirs but as cryogenic pointed out they are just not very good at the job of politics. If we want to see them off we must get some form of control over our borders again.

Sun May 07, 2006 4:39 pm

bray1977 wrote:Immigrants get precedence when it comes to housing and other benefits.


A common misconception.

In fact, immigrants suffer considerable negative discrimination with regard to benefits and housing.

Sun May 07, 2006 5:10 pm

Bray1977 Excellent post mate


Colin - It certainly looks that way, a friend of mine from Burnley told me that the council are building a new housing estate, for asian immigrants only! while local English people are still being forced to live in shitholes!! and they wonder why there is a lot of tension in Burnley!!

Sun May 07, 2006 6:27 pm

Liverbobs wrote:Colin - It certainly looks that way, a friend of mine from Burnley told me that the council are building a new housing estate, for asian immigrants only!


A friend of mine thinks all accepted immigrants get a house, a car and £1,000 in cash.

Doesn't make it true.

Maybe we should look for new friends.

Sun May 07, 2006 7:41 pm

Colin,
You seem very unaware of the situation in this country towards immigrants.

Why is it that so many of them want to come to Britain?? Cause its a soft touch.

Havent you heard of the song' Clean Up Your Own Backyard'? :wink:

Sun May 07, 2006 8:46 pm

Sean Ryan wrote:Colin, You seem very unaware of the situation in this country towards immigrants.
Why is it that so many of them want to come to Britain?? Cause its a soft touch.
Havent you heard of the song' Clean Up Your Own Backyard'? :wink:


They want to come here because conditions are better than 'at home'.

What a good advert for Britain !

They aren't treated very well by the authorities or the people.

We actually need the talents and skills of a lot of them.

Our whole society has been built by immigrants and their descendants.

Err..... can we leave my backyard out of this ?

Sun May 07, 2006 9:04 pm

Yes...

The hypocrisy of needing someone or a group of people and then turning around and denouncing them truly knows no bounds. Perhaps the most famous example in modern history is Hitler disparaging the Jews in "Mein Kampf" followed by their extermination at the hands of his Nazi leadership. Likewise, the BNP always needs a scapegoat -- preferrably as many as it can find, to drum up as much support as it can. And, like Hitler, it truly would persecute all these sets of people given the chance, too. I just hope Griffin and his cronies never get past the "Mein Kampf" stage.

All of the BNP's views are Stygian. While, at its heart, the BNP is a racist organisation, such a label barely encompasses the tyrannical morbidity that defines every nerve fibre of the party. Take its views on pornography. It actually believes that pornography leads to violent/sex crimes and should be banned. It also believes in capital punishment -- even for crimes other than murder. The question is: would it implement those views before or after it's driven every last non-white person out of the country? I don't even want to know. It is a truly barbaric and vicious creation. As one person aptly put it: it uses the tools of democracy to destroy democracy. Labour and all of the other parties need to ensure that people are educated to the point or otherwise convinced to denounce and avoid this organisation at all costs.

Sun May 07, 2006 9:19 pm

Cryogenic wrote:Yes...The hypocrisy of needing someone or a group of people and then turning around and denouncing them truly knows no bounds....


The majority of people in the UK want nothing to do with more extremist views and ambitions of far-right Fascist parties like the BNP.

Some are being persuaded to vote for them by misinformation.

The idea that we are being swamped by immigrants who get preferrential treatment over our existing population, for example.

Simply not true.

Sun May 07, 2006 9:34 pm

ColinB wrote:
Cryogenic wrote:Yes...The hypocrisy of needing someone or a group of people and then turning around and denouncing them truly knows no bounds....


The majority of people in the UK want nothing to do with more extremist views and ambitions of far-right Fascist parties like the BNP.

Some are being persuaded to vote for them by misinformation.

The idea that we are being swamped by immigrants who get preferrential treatment over our existing population, for example.

Simply not true.


It is true.Thats why so many people are voting for the BNP.No one trusts the Labour Party or The Tories.10,000s of British people are moving abroad every year because of the influx of immigrants.

You claim that they want to come here cause the conditions are worse 'at home'. Well, thats there problem.Its got nothing to do with the British Taxpayer.If it was raining , would let a stranger into your house?

We do NOT need the talents and skills of them.We have enough people in this country already.Its only a small island.

For example, lets take that police woman which was murdered by that Somolian guy. He was supposed to have been deported in 2001 but he wasnt cause this government said it was too dangerous for him to go back.He shoots dead a female police officer in cold blood and disappears and where does he go back to? Somolia. :roll:

Sun May 07, 2006 9:38 pm

ColinB wrote:
Cryogenic wrote:Yes...The hypocrisy of needing someone or a group of people and then turning around and denouncing them truly knows no bounds....


The majority of people in the UK want nothing to do with more extremist views and ambitions of far-right Fascist parties like the BNP.


Thanks for reminding us of that. The vast majority, as you say, do not believe in or stand for the utter lunacy and hatred espoused by the BNP.

Sun May 07, 2006 9:49 pm

For example, lets take that police woman which was murdered by that Somolian guy. He was supposed to have been deported in 2001 but he wasnt cause this government said it was too dangerous for him to go back.He shoots dead a female police officer in cold blood and disappears and where does he go back to? Somolia.


That travel agency where the policewoman was shot is situated about 500 yards from where my wife attends university.

Sun May 07, 2006 10:03 pm

Cryogenic have you maybe suffered something personally at the hands of a BNP member? I ask because the vitriolic hatred you show for the party is similar to the hatred you accuse them of.

I dont think most British people care about skin colour or religion, its the attitude displayed by many immigrants that is offensive. Many of them are no sooner here than they are demanding benefits that the natives dont get, the natives part in this is just to pick up the bill. We are being swamped, the nature of the country is changing and not for the better. I am not speaking about british born blacks and asians here but the waves of new immigrants with their fake marriages etc. It is like inviting guests to your house only to have them tell take over your living room and start re decorating.

As to the BNP I dont consider them a viable alternative Government and i doubt they'll ever get that far. But they are not the demons the media would have us believe. The bad old days of the National Front and its hordes of baying skinheads are gone. The BNP has a large measure of support among war veterans and pensioners who have lived all thaeir lives here, worked hard and in many cases fought for this country only to see a load of foreigners come in and get for free more than they ever had. Its a bit offensive to label such people "bad" or "idiots".

Sun May 07, 2006 10:08 pm

Liverbobs wrote:For example, lets take that police woman which was murdered by that Somolian guy. He was supposed to have been deported in 2001 but he wasnt cause this government said it was too dangerous for him to go back.He shoots dead a female police officer in cold blood and disappears and where does he go back to? Somolia.


That travel agency where the policewoman was shot is situated about 500 yards from where my wife attends university.


Liverbobs,

When its that close to home it makes it more real than just seeing it on the news.
Such a terrible thing to have happened and very much avoidable, no thanks to the Home Office.

Sun May 07, 2006 10:33 pm

bray1977 wrote:Cryogenic have you maybe suffered something personally at the hands of a BNP member? I ask because the vitriolic hatred you show for the party is similar to the hatred you accuse them of.


Any rational personal should -- and would -- agree with me.

I implore you to do some research.

bray1977 wrote:As to the BNP I dont consider them a viable alternative Government and i doubt they'll ever get that far. But they are not the demons the media would have us believe.


They are NOT???

As The Doc is fond of saying: read and learn.

They are vile. Scum. An inkspot on the table cloth of democracy. Do the research. By God, do the research! They don't stand for anything except pure hatred. I feel it is a shame you have mistaken my own forceful language for hatred. I am simply employing a vocabulary and a lexicon that comes closest to capturing the magnitude of their hideousness. But no language truly does. Don't let their re-branded image fool you. Many members are thugs. Griffin was convicted of incitement to racial hatred. He has supported dictators. He has spoken at KKK rallies. He believes in the supremacy of the white race (which would be ipso facto from speaking at a KKK rally -- but this is also true by his own admission). He believes that all multi-cultural societies tend towards tyranny (even though multi-culturalism is a relatively new thing and tyranny is usually tyranny because those in power crush anyone not like them -- e.g. Hitler and the Third Reich).

bray1977 wrote: The bad old days of the National Front and its hordes of baying skinheads are gone.


New bottle, same wine.

I am just opposed to racism and oppression in all its forms. But if you must know: my grandfather once stood as a candidate for the National Front in a West Midlands constituency. He has passed those views onto his son, my uncle. The same thing happened with Griffin: he was raised by a racist father and taken to his first NF rally at 15. What kind of an upbringing is that? I hate racism. Hate, hate, hate it. The BNP are the new NF. To claim otherwise is to be ignorant.

bray1977 wrote:The BNP has a large measure of support among war veterans and pensioners who have lived all thaeir lives here, worked hard and in many cases fought for this country only to see a load of foreigners come in and get for free more than they ever had. Its a bit offensive to label such people "bad" or "idiots".


I never labelled such people "bad" -- but their actions, whether they realise it or not, are bad. And they are idiots for not seeing the tyranny under their noses. These are, as you just pointed out, the same people who fought for the democratic nation of Britain against a fascist regime. Now they happen to be voting for one! It's shocking to think about. But you're right to some extent: their actions are indicative of failings on Labour's side. Everyone is implicated, at some level, when someone votes for the BNP. The world is not a vaccum. For this reason, amongst others, I implore you once again to do the research.

Sun May 07, 2006 10:41 pm

Cryogenic wrote:
bray1977 wrote:Cryogenic have you maybe suffered something personally at the hands of a BNP member? I ask because the vitriolic hatred you show for the party is similar to the hatred you accuse them of.


Any rational personal should -- and would -- agree with me.

I implore you to do some research.

bray1977 wrote:As to the BNP I dont consider them a viable alternative Government and i doubt they'll ever get that far. But they are not the demons the media would have us believe.


They are NOT???

As The Doc is fond of saying: read and learn.

They are vile. Scum. An inkspot on the table cloth of democracy. Do the research. By God, do the research! They don't stand for anything except pure hatred. I feel it is a shame you have mistaken my own forceful language for hatred. I am simply employing a vocabulary and a lexicon that comes closest to capturing the magnitude of their hideousness. But no language truly does. Don't let their re-branded image fool you. Many members are thugs. Griffin was convicted of incitement to racial hatred. He has supported dictators. He has spoken at KKK rallies. He believes in the supremacy of the white race (which would be ipso facto from speaking at a KKK rally -- but this is also true by his own admission). He believes that all multi-cultural societies tend towards tyranny (even though multi-culturalism is a relatively new thing and tyranny is usually tyranny because those in power crush anyone not like them -- e.g. Hitler and the Third Reich).

bray1977 wrote: The bad old days of the National Front and its hordes of baying skinheads are gone.


New bottle, same wine.

I am just opposed to racism and oppression in all its forms. But if you must know: my grandfather once stood as a candidate for the National Front in a West Midlands constituency. He has passed those views onto his son, my uncle. The same thing happened with Griffin: he was raised by a racist father and taken to his first NF rally at 15. What kind of an upbringing is that? I hate racism. Hate, hate, hate it. The BNP are the new NF. To claim otherwise is to be ignorant.

bray1977 wrote:The BNP has a large measure of support among war veterans and pensioners who have lived all thaeir lives here, worked hard and in many cases fought for this country only to see a load of foreigners come in and get for free more than they ever had. Its a bit offensive to label such people "bad" or "idiots".


I never labelled such people "bad" -- but their actions, whether they realise it or not, are bad. And they are idiots for not seeing the tyranny under their noses. These are, as you just pointed out, the same people who fought for the democratic nation of Britain against a fascist regime. Now they happen to be voting for one! It's shocking to think about. But you're right to some extent: their actions are indicative of failings on Labour's side. Everyone is implicated, at some level, when someone votes for the BNP. The world is not a vaccum. For this reason, amongst others, I implore you once again to do the research.


I agree. The BNP are a fascist regime.

Sun May 07, 2006 11:01 pm

Steve_M wrote:but local councils now ask people to remove signs in december saying "Merry christmas" in case it offends people of other faiths. well i'm of no faith and it offends me.

Why can't i ask the council to bulldoze a mosque coz i'm offended by it ?


Thar's a great example, Steve.

As Charton Heston said: "political correctness is tyranny with manners".

The BNP do indeed jump on political correctness and use it as fuel for the fire. We have many problems in society. That's why we have political systems in the first place. But the majority choose democracy. And so they should.

Sun May 07, 2006 11:46 pm

After many cities not wanting to offend other cultures by putting up Xmas lights.
.....After hearing that the Birmingham council changed its opinion and let a Muslim woman have her picture on her driver's license with her face covered.
.......After hearing of a Primary School in Birmingham where a boy was told that for PE they could wear Football League shirts (Aston Villa, Birmingham, West Brom etc) but NOT an England shirt as it could offend others !
This prompted the editorial below written by a UK citizen. Published in a British tabloid newspaper.
IMMIGRANTS.NOT BRITON'S, MUST ADAPT.
Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on London, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Brits. However, the dust from the attacks has barely settled and the politically correct" crowd begin complaining about the possibility that our patriotism is offending others.
I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Britain. However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand. This idea of London being a multicultural centre for community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Britons, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle. This culture has been developed over centuries of wars, struggles, trials and victories fought by the untold masses of men and Women who laid down any one of the millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language! "In God We Trust" is our National Motto. This is not some Christian, right wing, political slogan. We adopted this motto because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of
our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture. If St. George's cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.
We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we Really don't care how you did things where you came from. This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our National Motto, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great British freedom, "THE RIGHT TO LEAVE". If you aren't happy here then f#@* off! We didn't force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted. Pretty easy really, when you think about it.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------