Off Topic Messages

Fri Mar 24, 2006 2:00 pm

Peter they are not "leaving it out". It isn't Capitol.

Incidently I read that the stereo version of A Hard Day's Night didn't come out till the 80's!

Fri Mar 24, 2006 6:58 pm

likethebike wrote:I don't know Kylan, even when they came out they had kind of metallic sound to me and compared to many 90s and later releases in my collection the volume is low. I admit they are tons better sounding than say Warner Brothers releases from the '80s which were just a joke but I wouldn't say they are up to even the Hendrix re-releases of 1993. Sound issues aside, the lack of scholarship is somewhat disconcerting. When I'm buying vintage music, I like to learn about it. The length of the CDs themselves is also a concern. 35 minutes for $18 is not a bargain. The Red album was not issued in that first flush of releases but a few years later but that CD is the height of arrogance. They put it on two cds and it retails for over $30 with a length of just 66 minutes. It could have easily fit on one for half the price.

The Nelson and Beach Boys CDs are collectors' dreams. Maybe the label felt since these are less popular artists they needed more bells and whistles but it is only the Beatles due to give them the same treatment accorded these lesser artists. Once the bar has been raised like it has it's kind of hard to accept something less.

Not being a huge fan and having heard my fill on the radio over the years, my appetite for the Beatles taps out with that "Red album" collection which was a favorite of mine. I have that "1" set (bought a like-new copy for a $4.99) but have heard they butchered the sound, despite the huge sales. (I guess E1 really did ape that model!)

And I do miss a lot of those songs on that red album, which I'd like to get on CD. In this day and age, I don't need a doorstop-style of box, just a 1-CD slim-line of two discs and in this case, all of it would fit on one disc, as you mention.

All in all, the management of the Fab Four's recordings puts Elvis' to shame, right down to the large displays for Beatle releases to be found in Tower Records in the US. You don't see much in the way of dumb releases, of say, a "Love, the Beatles" polluting their ranks. And new albums like that "naked" thing are well-spaced and remain quite the event.

I'll take the '87-era sound of those Beatle discs (I remember the fanfare about those CDs from friends at the time) over will-it-never-end releases like "Elvis Inspirational" that give you piecemeal DSD/ 2006-quality remasters of randomly assembled tracks like "Danny Boy."

Who is the sage Beatles' version "Ernst Jorgensen" by the way? :lol:

P.S. I'm probably going to spring for that new Ricky Nelson set soon.

Sat Mar 25, 2006 3:16 am

The Beatles were an "album" experience. To me the American versions were the best.

I can't imagine not sitting down to Rubber Soul or Abbey Road. The Red or Blue album just don't cut it for me.

The songs are way out of context.

The way the Beatles are treated does put Elvis to shame. It is so sad.

Ge I wonder if they get to the later Beatles albums they will do an "essential" list instead of completing the project. Me thinks not.

Sun Mar 26, 2006 10:56 pm

I agree that the Beatles have some great albums and I probably should get those you mention. I just came to them via their hits and those are two comps that are nothing to be ashamed of.

I'm really curious about who manages their catalog, as we assume Ernst is some kind of pure guru beyond criticism... Well, who's his competition with other legendary acts? Maybe they know a thing or two...!

Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:39 am


I think you're missing my point. Even if A Hard Day's Night wasn't strictly Capitol, the goal of these sets is to present albums as Americans heard them during the Sixties. Taken together, the sets present the American Beatles experience. Regardless of its origins, AHDN is one of the albums that made up the American Beatles experience, so it should be included. You personally may not care for it, but it's quite likely that there are a number of people out there whose first Beatles experience came with that album, so there is an audience that longs to hear it, and one would expect that audience is as large (if not larger, considering the film's popularity) as, say, Meet the Beatles. All I'm saying is, if they're going to go through all this trouble, they might as well do it right. The only acceptable exclusion, I suppose, would be if it prevented future sets from fitting the four-albums-to-a-box model, but since they haven't announced how far they'll go or what they plan to include, we can only speculate.


I'm not sure if there is a single 'guru' behind The Beatles' releases, but Mark Lewisohn is roughly the equivalent of Ernst Jorgenson in some respects. He was one of few commisioned by EMI and allowed into Abbey Road vaults to index and organize the catalogue in the mid-Eighties (which naturally involved listening to all session tapes) and publish them in his oft-cited The Complete Beatles Recording Sessions. He also wrote The Complete Beatles Chronicle, a combination of Sessions and his own The Beatles Live!, which stands as an elaborate day-by-day account of The Beatles. He is often hired by Apple for his knowledge on the band, including work on the Anthology project, and is credited for "track details" in the 1 booklet. On the back-flap of my copy of Chronicle he is described as having "a long association with EMI, for whom he compiles and prepares albums and boxed sets and writes sleeve notes such as those for the Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band CD, the two-volume Past Masters, and the four-volume Lennon compilations."

However, he does not work for EMI, and he is not behind all the CD-releases. For example, Allan Rouse was the "project co-ordinator" behind 1, and Let It Be... Naked was produced by Paul Hicks, Guy Massey, and Allan Rouse. So I suppose he is a consultant, more than anything. Of course, there are so few Beatles releases that I suppose there isn't really a need for a Beatles release guru.
Last edited by Peter Franks on Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:25 am

Peter this is the CAPITOL box set right?

All the material got released eventually, so why not stay true to the originals?

Incidently, I am not saying I would mind having A Hard Day's Night though. Still the title song would have belonged as a bonus selection to Something New, cause that is how the original public heard it!

Its not that I didn't care for it, but it doesn't fit the parameters of the box sets!!!

Fri Mar 31, 2006 10:38 pm

Abbeyrd's Beatle Page today linked to some promotional videos for The Capitol Albums, Volume 2.

Windows Media: ... e_v100.asx (low quality) ... e_v300.asx (high quality)

Real Player: ... e_v100.ram (low quality) ... e_v300.ram (high quality)

Quicktime: ... (low quality) ... (high quality)

Fri Mar 31, 2006 11:10 pm

Talk about being purists! The Beatles Capitol releases use the AMERICAN master tapes! 2nd generation from the British originals!!! The American releases were tweaked and had their "sound" vs British original "sound"...

Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:12 am

Some would say the tweaked sound is more pure to the original HIT RECORDS that stormed the U.S. charts!

Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:48 am

This is not good news. :evil:

I've been in contact with one of the "Principals" on the project. The stereo was mastered first by Ted Jensen. A "reference" mono fold down of the stereo was made, for some reason. Ted Jensen then mastered the mono Rubber Soul from the correct Capitol mono Rubber Soul master.

Because I can't say anything definitive, I was told I could say this:

If, by mistake, the mono reference fold down was sent to one of the manufacturing facilities by mistake, the problem will be corrected. Capitol IS aware of this POSSIBLE mistake and plans an announcement.

David Schwartz ... tcount=408

Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:35 pm

I'll certainly be buying the box, but likethebike is correct: the Beatles' British albums (the way the boys intended the records to be heard) should be re-mastered and re-released with singles, alternates and essays.

It's ridiculous that the LPs haven't been upgraded since 1987, this is the most important band in history! You even get upgrades of albums that are 10 years old nowadays.

Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:17 pm

Hopefully the packaging will be better than the last set. And as Bike has pointed out, the British versions of these albums need the proper reissue treatment. With one of the most important and influential bodies of work in contemporary music history, it is shame that The Beatles' catalogue is basically represented by horrible sound and packaging. While they don't flood the market with an endless stream of pointless compilations, they should commit themselves to making sure that their catalogue is represented in the best way possible (the same can be said for the bulk of the Springsteen CD catalogue).