Off Topic Messages

Sun Aug 28, 2005 12:35 pm

Well, I've been gone for the last week or so (I know,I know......nobody noticed :( ), so I've missed the action here "live".

But this nonsense of equating Bush with Hitler is deeply disrespectful of the Jews who were slaughtered in WWII ( though this equation does reflect the Sheehan assertion that the Jews are running the world :roll: ), as well as all those lost to the gas chambers and ovens of Hitler .

Left Wing Kookism at it's most shameful.

The revisionist history train just keeps on rolling.



Antiwar activist
Founder of Gold Star Families for Peace


Antiwar extremist Cindy Sheehan has captured headlines by camping out in front of President Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas. There, the 48-year-old founder of Gold Star Families for Peace claims she is hounding the president to end the Iraq War in the name of her beloved son, Casey, who died in Iraq, and in the name of grieving families everywhere. The image of a grief-stricken mother traveling by caravan from California to Texas, then living in a tent, merely so she can have a brief meeting with the president has deep propaganda value for the antiwar Left. Thus, the New York Times noted longingly in its headline Thursday, "One Mother's Loss Becomes a Problem for the President." However, none of the mainstream media accounts of this beatified mourner recognize her long history of extremist rhetoric, her close association with far-Left and anti-Semitic figures, or the way she has seemingly rewritten her own history when it suited her purposes.

Sheehan says if granted a (second) consultation with President George W. Bush, she wants to ask him, "Why did you kill my son?" Both the question and the blame are misplaced. Sheehan and the media have emphasized that Iraqis killed 24-year-old Casey Sheehan in Sadr City last April, just five days after his arrival in Iraq. Cindy Sheehan's tale of motherly grief is gripping. She told the leftist blog Buzzflash:

Casey told me, "Mom, this is what we trained for. I'm ready. It's my job. Because the sooner I get there, the sooner I'll come home." And he came home three weeks later in a flag-draped coffin.

However, the media have ignored two important facts. First, Casey initially signed up in May 2000 and voluntarily re-enlisted in the service in August 2003, knowing he would likely be called into active duty in Iraq. Secondly, as a mechanic in the 1st battalion, 82nd Field Artillery Regiment, Casey did not have to go into the battle that claimed his life. When some of his fellow soldiers encountered resistance, he and others in his unit chose to go into combat to save his friends. Cindy Sheehan herself recounted it this way:

"[T]he sergeant said, "Sheehan, you don't have to go," because my son was a mechanic. And Casey said, "Where my chief goes, I go."

Where this young man went, tragically, was to an early grave. But his death was an act of patriotism and human compassion, one which should tinge her understandable maternal grief with deep pride.

Instead, Cindy Sheehan threw herself into shrill, anti-Bush and anti-American activism. Shortly after his death, she founded Gold Star Families for Peace, an "antiwar" group whose first stated purpose is "To bring an end to the occupation of Iraq." (Emphasis added.) She presently has a blogspot on MichaelMoore.com and spouts extremist rhetoric alongside many of the Hate America Left's most potent bomb-throwers.

A Legacy of Leftist Anger

One might speculate that her son's death freed Cindy Sheehan to take a more prominent role in stating the convictions she long held. Her hatred of President George W. Bush apparently harkens back to well before her son ever set foot in Iraq. In "An Open Letter to President George Bush," published in the Not In Our Name newsletter shortly after the 2004 presidential elections, she wrote:

"George, in 2000 when you stole that election and the Democrats gave up, I gave up, too. I had the most ironic thought of my life then: "Oh well, how much damage can he do in four years?"


According to San Francisco-based talk show host (and acquaintance of the Sheehan family) Melanie Morgan, Cindy Sheehan's antiwar animus dates to well before her son's death.[1] The Sheehans always opposed U.S. involvement in Iraq. Asked about the views she and her husband, Pat, had toward the Iraq War before their son's deployment, she answered: "We didn't understand why the United States was there. We never thought that Iraq was an imminent threat to the United States."

She has taken advantage of her status as an aggrieved mother to spread her poisonous brand of far-Left politics. Her natural target was the Iraq War. Sheehan testified at John Conyers' "impeachment hearings" on June 16, regarding the Downing Street Memo. She said, "The so-called Downing Street Memo dated 23 July, 2003, only confirms what I already suspected: the leadership of this country rushed us into an illegal invasion of another sovereign country on prefabricated and cherry picked intelligence. It appears that my boy Casey was given a death sentence even before he joined the Army in May of 2000." To be sure no one missed the point, she added, "I believed before our leaders invaded Iraq in March, 2003, and I am even more convinced now, that this aggression on Iraq was based on a lie of historic proportions and was blatantly unnecessary."

However, she has branched out into denouncing the military and the United States itself. According to FPM contributor Lee Kaplan, Sheehan likened convicted terrorist lawyer Lynne Stewart to literary hero Atticus Finch at a rally at San Francisco State University. Stewart passed on messages from convicted 1993 World Trade Center bomber Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman to his terror cell in Egypt and often pledged her belief in the morality of anti-capitalist violence. According to Kaplan's account, Sheehan's rhetoric that evening could as easily have been written by the "Blind Sheikh" himself; she, too, regarded America as the "Great Satan": "America has been killing people on this continent since it was started. This country is not worth dying for."

She furthered this belief with a pronouncement on her official website, in which she describes her vision of a utopian future in America: "I will rejoice to hear the sounds of the collective Mea Culpa and the beating of breasts."

To deprive this evil empire of a sufficient military, Cindy endorsed the San Francisco citywide measure known as "College Not Combat," which would encourage the city's high schools to deny military recruiters access to their student directories, from which they seek military enlistments. The fact that the cause she championed in the name of "the children" would be a violation of section 9528 of the "No Child Left Behind" Act, an infraction punishable by the revocation of federal education funds, did not cause her or her ideological comrades to bat an eye. The "College Not Combat" coalition includes a host of socialist and anti-American organizations, including International ANSWER, Code Pink, the National Lawyers Guild, the International Socialist Organization, Socialist Organizer, the Malcolm X Grassroots Movement (which hails convicted cop-killers as "political prisoners"), and others. Such left-wing organizers often speak of the need to reduce the number of young people joining the armed forces, in order to frustrate "imperialist" U.S. foreign policy.


One such radical leftist is Medea Benjamin, the founder of Code Pink, Global Exchange, and the mastermind behind the violent anti-World Trade Center riots in Seattle. Benjamin enjoys a close working relationship with Cindy Sheehan as part of the professional antiwar fringe. Medea, a longtime admirer of Fidel Castro, with the help of fellow Castroite Leslie Cagan, founded the International Occupation Watch. Established in the city of Baghdad during the height of Operation Iraqi Freedom, Benjamin said its stated goal was to get as many U.S. troops as possible to declare themselves conscientious objectors and be sent home. Through Code Pink, she even managed to take $600,000 of cash, medicine, and supplies to "the other side" in the Iraqi terrorist capital of Fallujah (possibly the whereabouts of Casey Sheehan's killers). In an essay in Nation magazine, Benjamin spelled out a long-term strategy to deflate the U.S. military presence in Iraq and around the world.

Benjamin's anti-American foreign policy views are seemingly shared by Kathy Kelly, with whom Cindy shared the stage during antiwar protests. Kelly is the Director of Voices in the Wilderness, which violated UN sanctions against Saddam Hussein's Iraq in the 1990s. Kelly visits "political prisoners" held captive by the United States…in Iraq. She has spoken at numerous campuses, often with radical Islamists, and has supported the Nicaraguan Sandanistas. In late 2003, Kelly received a three-month sentence for trespassing at Ft. Benning, Georgia, during a massive protest against the anti-Communist "School of the Americas."

David Fenton has been laying the propaganda groundwork the Left needs to justify its anti-American policies for nearly a generation. A one-time photographer for the Weathermen, a left-wing terrorist organization, as well as a partisan calling for the "liberation" of South Vietnam, Fenton went on to angle the U.S. media on behalf of the Nicaraguan Sandanistas and the Marxist regime of Grenada. Fenton Communications was soon enlisted to popularize the George Soros-funded MoveOn.org and the Win Without War Coalition. In 2004, Cindy Sheehan appeared in an anti-Bush TV commercial, paid for by a 527 group known as "Real Voices," which were distributed by…Fenton Communications. Coincidentally, David Fenton also promotes the September 11th Families for Peaceful Tomorrows, another organization of left-wingers making political capital from the death of their loved ones.

Fenton is not Sheehan's only public relations conduit. Her statements are also distributed by the Institute for Public Accuracy, the organization that sponsored Sean Penn's trip to Baghdad on the eve of war. The day after September 11th, this taxpayer-funded entity offered "expert" testimony on terrorism to credulous media outlets. One IPA-sanctioned spokesman said Osama bin Laden's handiwork "holds up a mirror to U.S. policy of causing massive civilian suffering in Iraq…[W]e hope that along with the grief, we can…form deeper compassion and understanding." The IPA is a member organization of United for Peace and Justice, the "mainstream" face of the antiwar movement, which held many of the major antiwar demonstrations in 2003 and was founded by…Communist Party member Leslie Cagan.

It appears Sheehan embraces the anti-American views of the far-Left, possibly even advocating that soldiers disobey their officers. An online interview reveals that after defining "supporting war and killing" as "anti-Gospel, anti-religion, and anti-Christ," she told American troops they were being "misused," and finally exhorted them: "Refuse to kill innocent people." Yet no U.S. officer can legitimately order someone to kill "innocent people"; it seems she has joined Medea Benjamin and Leslie Cagan's crusade to mint ranks of conscientious objectors who will study (anti-terror) war no more.

Blame the "Murderous Thugs" (Jews)

Sheehan does not just lay the blame for her son's death on evil America, though. She recently wrote: "my first born was murdered. Am I angry? Yes, he was killed for lies and for a PNAC Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel. My son joined the Army to protect America, not Israel." Such rhetoric echoes the line being taken by David Duke and his ilk at their most recent recruiting website, NoWarForIsrael.com: neo-cons run foreign policy; neo-cons are Jews; therefore, the war on Iraq was cooked up by a "cabal" of rapacious Jews to benefit the nation of Israel.

Sheehan also applies dehumanizing rhetoric to "neo-con" officials in the Bush administration. In an antiwar speech this April, Sheehan said of a well-known Jewish conservative, "As soft-spoken and sincere-sounding as Paul Wolfowitz is, is there yet any sane adult in this country whose skin does not crawl when this murderous liar opens his mouth and speaks?" She fumed, "Our country has been overtaken by murderous thugs....gangsters who lust after fortunes and power." It is possible her target is "merely" capitalism. But her vicious rhetoric leaves open the possibility that she makes room at her altar of hatred for Jews, as well.

Take the Left's Bus to Crawford

This extremism has not kept Cindy Sheehan from becoming an overnight star, endowed with all the righteous mysteries of suffering motherhood. Nor has her rhetoric and continued association with fringe figures barred her from enjoying the fellowship of the larger Left. After she began her multi-week camp out near the president's ranch, legendary leftist agitator Ralph Nader dispatched a letter declaiming, "This rogue regime, led by two draft-dodgers and officially counseled by similar pro-war evaders during the Vietnam War, is not 'our country.'"

Former Howard Dean presidential campaign strategist Joe Trippi made an appearance in the flesh. Trippi joined with Jodie Evans and the website Democrats.com to produce a web broadcast hailing Sheehan.

In this podcast, Sheehan's venomous vacuity is on display in its every facet. She intimated the Secret Service might have murdered her had she not placed a notice with the blogosphere, saying the Secret Service told her she would get run over by a car if she stayed there. "Thank God for the internet, or…we would already be a fascist state," she foreswore. "The mainstream media is a propaganda tool for the government." Sheehan likewise derided "the elections, um, you know the 'elections' quote/unquote, that happened in November."

Then came the callers. Congresswoman Jan Schakowsky, D-IL, who described herself as a member of the "Out-of-Iraq Coalition," called in for the broadcast. Rep. Schakowsky, a member of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, gushed, "I'm just so proud of you…My heart is with you." (Schakowsky, like Medea Benjamin, gushes over Fidel Castro, as well; Schakowsky has consistently tried to ease travel restrictions to the island gulag. For these and other "progressive" efforts, Schakowsky received an award from the Democratic Socialists of America.)

Sheehan also received a question from "journalist" Greg Szymanski, who has covers Sheehan for the ArcticBeacon.com and the American Free Press. According to its website, ArcticBeacon.com is dedicated, in part, to covering the "Alien Presence on Earth and UFO Phenomena." American Free Press is the newest incarnation of THE SPOTLIGHT newspaper, which the Anti-Defamation League classifies as "the most widely read publication on the fringe Right." Both were published by Willis Carto's Liberty Lobby, an organization with ties to neo-Nazism and anti-Semitism that is "presently the most influential right-wing extremist propaganda organization in the United States." Szymanski has written numerous articles for the publication, including one hinting President Bush was complicit in 9/11.

Perhaps this constellation of anti-American extremists explains her blog entry for Day 5: "We had a little bit of trouble with locals today. We are beginning to feel a little unwelcome here."

Bush Far Too Amenable

Despite the fact that Cindy Sheehan and an entourage of 50 rolled into town in a bus with the words "Impeachment Tour" emblazoned upon it - fresh from attending a Veterans for Peace convention, no less - the Bush administration has not given this odd woman an icy reception. National Security Adviser Steve Hadley and Deputy White House Chief of Staff Joe Hagin spoke with Sheehan for 45 minutes.

This high-level (and unwarranted) meeting has not satisfied Sheehan's leftist friends. Code Pink founder Diane Wilson is leading a hunger strike until Bush meets with her in person…for a second time. The website AfterDowningStreet.org also demands a face-to-face meeting. That website's coalition members include Code Pink, Global Exchange, Rainbow/PUSH, Louisiana Activist Network, the Earth Island Institute, Historians Against the War, Veterans for Peace, Radio Left, and others. Notable individuals offering their support to the website include Daniel Ellsberg, of Pentagon Papers infamy; Robert Shetterly; and Joel Wendland, Managing Editor of Political Affairs, a journal of the Communist Party USA.

And some 40 Congressional Democratic have signed a letter urging President Bush to meet Sheehan, as well. Among its signatories: Reps. George Miller, Barbara Lee, Zoe Lofgren, Mike Honda, Lynn Woolsey, and Pete Stark (all those listed, Democrats from California).

The Second Time Around

As noted, Cindy Sheehan already met with Bush last June, two months after Casey's death, along with a delegation of grieving military families. After that meeting, Sheehan initially said President Bush was caring, and the two spoke of their deep religious convictions. "I now know he's sincere about wanting freedom for the Iraqis," Cindy declared. "I know he's sorry and feels some pain for our loss. And I know he's a man of faith." She says she and her husband thought about broaching their discontent with the war but held back out of respect for what they thought their late son would have wanted. She instead enjoyed the commiseration of the also-bereaved. She concluded by saying, "That was the gift the president gave us, the gift of happiness, of being together."

Sheehan has begun telling another tale in recent days. During her podcast this week, Sheehan told Greg Szymanski, "Your account, that you wrote, is a true one." In one of Szymanski's two identical accounts, Cindy Sheehan claimed during their visit President Bush was "acting cocky and it was probably one of the worst experiences in my entire life." He bounced around the room in a jovial manner. Szymanski quotes Sheehan as saying her 25-year-old daughter, Carley, "told me that after he made [a] remark, he gave her one of the filthiest looks she had ever had gotten in her life." And, she says, Cindy was not alone; every other family felt this, as well. Cindy sums up: "Looking back, all I can say is that the meeting with Bush was one of the most disgusting experiences in my life." (She also referred to President Bush as the "Führer" and called the War on Terrorism "blatant genocide.")

When asked to rectify these varying statements - which, for the most part, she isn't - Sheehan said she was "still in shock" when she met President Bush in 2004 and could not recount her horrible ordeal properly for nearly a year after the fact.



Disavowal

The fact that Cindy Sheehan has used her son's coffin as a political soapbox has not set well with many members of Sheehan's extended family. In a backlash, patriotic members of Casey's father's family have distanced themselves and their late, heroic relative from Cindy's anti-American ways. KSFO-AM radio talk show host and Move America Forward leader Melanie Morgan received the following e-mail from Cherie Quarterolo, the late Casey Sheehan's aunt and godmother, and is sent on behalf of Casey Sheehan's family:

Hello again Melanie,

Our family has been so distressed by the recent activities of Cindy we are breaking our silence and we have collectively written a statement for release. Feel free to distribute it as you wish. Thanks - Cherie.

In response to questions regarding the Cindy Sheehan/Crawford Texas issue: Sheehan Family Statement:

The Sheehan Family lost our beloved Casey in the Iraq War and we have been silently, respectfully grieving. We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of Cindy Sheehan. She now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the expense of her son's good name and reputation. The rest of the Sheehan Family supports the troops, our country, and our President, silently, with prayer and respect.

Sincerely,
Casey Sheehan's grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins.


Thank goodness someone in the Sheehan family puts family, country, and dignity above political motivation. At last we see where Casey got the heroic sense of duty and patriotism that led him to lay down his life for his friends. R.I.P.

Sun Aug 28, 2005 3:23 pm

Yes some of us remember the other anti-war movement which finally helped to rescue the long suffering Vietnamese people who had already helped beat the Japanese (With American guns) and the French too!

We remember US Army generals denouncing the pinko left back then too. :shock:

Now at Last the Israeli Apartheid state has been told to curb it's expansionism. The middle-east has suffered long enough from the Oil Barons and corrupt goverments that back them.

Just a brief observation:-)

Sun Aug 28, 2005 5:13 pm

Among the misstatements and misrepresentations made here are:

1. The Jones suit was a criminal investigation. No. It was a civil suit. Jones originally brought the suit as sexual harassment suit. However, she changed testimony mid-stream perhaps in anticipation of the fact that she would lose a harassment suit which necessitated proving loss of income and job promotion. She received her raises and never asked for a promotion.

2. The Clintons paid Jones with public money. An absolute falsity although I forgive it because I was under the same assumption as I remember a public payment being discussed at the time but hey it was seven years ago. According to a story in the Associated Press that ran the week after the settlement, that quoted an anonymous source in the White House $375,000 came from the Clinton's personal accounts valued between $1-5 million and the rest came from insurance. The Clintons were not bound to disclose where they got the money because this was a private suit not related to Clinton's presidential activities and therefore public money could not be used.

People say a lot of things it doesn't make them true. There has to be some sort of factual accounting when you make statements about a historical event particularly when you are talking about polarizing figures like the Clintons ( or GW Bush). You'd be amazed at how many are just made up by people who want to destroy their reputations.

These include: Clinton-Bin Laden, Jane Fonda in the prison camp, Mariah Carey's "skinny" Ethiopian comments and so and so on.

Also some important information was left out of the Clinton impeachment.

1. Susan Weber Wright later deemed the Lewinsky testimony immaterial to the overall case after all the testimony was in. That should tell how far afield they went to drag Lewinsky in.

2. The case was decided in Clinton's favor. They were awaiting appeal when they settled.

3. The settlement contained no admission of guilt or an apology.

4. Jones was pushed and financed by right wing groups to move forward with the allegations. Columnist Anne Coulter worked behind the scenes to up the pressure on the president.

Sun Aug 28, 2005 7:54 pm

Is that all you can come up with...symantacs? While it is quite difficult to corner someone as elite as the president, the civil route is the first way to go. The fact that no charges were brought doesn't mean d*ck when you consider the difficulty. That said, you are wrong when it comes to one fact, the controversy was off of a CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION, did you forget White Water?...I never once said that there were criminal charges brought before this fact. Of course Purgery pretty much changes that, doesn't it? So WRONG AGAIN. Get it straight, the Paula Jones case was key to the determination from the Grand Jury testimony.
Of course more symantacs are sure to follow to set up your flimsy case. Just because the case was dissmissed doesn't mean that there wasn't shady crap going on. Anyone that knows how the system works can see how this could really go. The fact that he paid her off and continued to have this stuff pile up is further proof to his guilt. There is no question in my mind as to who the sexual predater and liar is. He is a coward that used his power to hurt young women. If he thinks he would have won, then he should have taken it all the way, the truth is that he was guilty as sin and the Grand Jury testimony alone shows what a liar he is from sentence to sentence. He practically admitted his guilt.

So the Clintons didn't use public money and you figure this out from it coming from their own private account? Hmmm and where did that money come from..maybe the Criminal Investigation at hand? Are you seriously going to take this angle with a straight face? The president was sued and he paid his way out of it with tax payers money(as governer as well). I don't care how you swing it, while he is in office he is feeding off the people. The fact that he further was playing around buying Monica gifts is also more shameful.

Likethebike, I applaud you coming back to the subject at hand. If you disagree with what I said above, then by all means go forward.

Sun Aug 28, 2005 11:32 pm

genesim wrote:How did I know you would show up again. :lol: Couldn't stay away could you?

So how is Jerry the coward doing? You claim you want peace, but you keep coming back like the good little stalker you are.


God your such a silly friend! Want to debate? LOL LOL :lol:

JEFF d
Elvis fan

Mon Aug 29, 2005 1:33 am

Well it is kinda like racing a handicap...it just isn't fair. "friend" :lol: Only a moron doesn't check his work.

Mon Aug 29, 2005 3:35 am

Now what were you debating again? If you are a real friend or not? LOL :lol: :lol: YES You ARE a real friend! :lol:

JEFF d
Elvis fan

Mon Aug 29, 2005 4:00 am

likethebike wrote:I have addressed all your points ad infinitum. As with every post on every political and many times non-political targets you ignore and dismiss any evidence that disagrees with your point. There is no point that can be made because you do not deal in logic and you do not deal in facts. You deal in half facts and half truths rumors. I have had it with your and your homophobic, racist buddy. I have tried to treat you with respect and dignity. However, you have forfeited that privilege. I just don't have the time to spoon feed you.

Now you know why I don't waste time with them. There are tree stumps out there with more intellectual ability. I don't know how they find their way around a computer keyboard.

God bless Bill Clinton!

DJC

Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:08 am

This thread has become rather nasty. However, I wonder how some of you can concede that there's a difference between stealing a paper clip and stealing $75,000 and not seeing how lying about a consentual sexual escapade is different from lying about going to war in which thousands of our men and women are killed or sent home maimed? How we are now, as a result of that war in an oil crisis because the Arab world hates us for this war that we started for no good reason. Yes, Afghanistan; no, Iraq. Yes, I am a liberal who wishes peace and tranquility, which we had more of when we had a Democratic president, the aforementioned (in other threads), Bill Clinton.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY BILL!!!

Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:17 am

silver wrote:This thread has become rather nasty.


On this board? Never!

Surely your imagination is getting the best of you.

Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:17 am

Rob wrote:
On this board? Never!

Surely your imagination is getting the best of you
.

Oh, good! So you can tell my husband that I am not a lesbian, adulterer, stoner and narcotic drug-user? Also that I could be considered a straight, faithful, clean-living person who praises Clinton ? Actually I am an educator (who desperately hopes her students aren't on this particular part of the message board). I am taking the chance of revealing this because it is off topic and I don't think they would be over here. They DO KNOW that I love E, so I have kept that in wraps on the Elvis part of any board.

Oh, and yes, I am a feminist. So why do you think GG thinks that is so wrong?

BTW, Rob, you're not a 3rd grade student, are you? Nor the parent of one?

Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:38 am

silver wrote:BTW, Rob, you're not a 3rd grade student, are you? Nor the parent of one?


Used to be, on both counts.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Do not let things on this board get the best of you. Not everyone is going to see your point of view no matter what you do. Everyone sure isn't going to see yours (not you personally.)

State your opinion, argue it a few times if you must, then move on.

There are other much more important things in this world to worry about other than someone's opinion on this board. The already mentioned war, the hurricane in New Orleans, starving people in Africa, Elvis On Tour outtakes, etc.

Good luck with those 3rd graders. I had one mean teacher when I was in 3rd grade. We showed her one day. We all got together and........

I better not finish this in case one of your students is reading this.

Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:52 am

Oh, No, I am one of the REALLY NICE ones!! They would never do that! As a matter of fact, on Valentine's Day, they give me Elvis Chocolates (without the laxatives in them)!

However, I do have some mischievous ones like you who almost put my eyes out with your flashing sign. LOL
:lol: :lol: :lol:
sue silver

Mon Aug 29, 2005 4:20 pm

Silver,

Though I am sure only reading some of the ramblings will make you prejudice....I find it funny how you overlook the Doc's postings toward the one you think has gone too far.

BUT it scares me to think that children are being taught the way you have just spoken.

Your damn right that there is a difference between stealing a paper clip and 75,000. I would teach that to a child in a second, as so should you.
You will never be prosecuted for taking a paperclip..nor should you. Don't be rediculous.

Plus if you are going to teach a child about a consensual excapade....you first are a f*cked up person...but second will you say that it is ok to screw around on your significant other in the work place(the oval office) and then lie about it to a grand jury under oath during a civil case(ltb :wink: ) of which you are accused of sexually harrasing a co-worker????

Peace and tranquility???? Where the hell were you when Clinton was responsible for soldiers being murdered...which was REALLY for no good reason.

Let see he bombed Africa and committed troops to a slaughter in Somalia and Kosovo Serbia.

We fought with Haiti as well, but hey..this is peaceful right?

But most importantly he repeatedly bombed Iraq and put economic sanctions that have led to this war to begin with.

Oh and and as far as Osama Bin Laden...yeah we gotta thank your man Clinton for that one as well. He let him slip and the victims paid the price while he was having his fun with Monica.

"Mr. bin Laden used to live in Sudan," Clinton told the Long Island Association on Feb. 15, 2002.


"He was expelled from Saudi Arabia in 1991, then he went to Sudan. And we'd been hearing that the Sudanese wanted America to start dealing with them again.


"They released him. At the time, 1996, he had committed no crime against America so I did not bring him here because we had no basis on which to hold him, though we knew he wanted to commit crimes against America.


"So I pleaded with the Saudis to take him, 'cause they could have. But they thought it was a hot potato and they didn't and that's how he wound up in Afghanistan."

Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:27 am

My Dearest Gen,

So you DO attack everyone who disagrees with you! I’m wondering which planet you came from where third graders are taught about the sexual escapades of their president or about war and who is to blame. The subjects taught in the third grade are: Reading, Writing, Math, Science, Health (including drug education, but not the STDs), Social Studies (up to Our Neighborhood, and including the holidays: Abraham Lincoln, George Washington, Christmas Around the World, Martin Luther King, Jr., and I’m sure you wouldn’t want me to continue here), Physical Education, cursive Handwriting, correct study habits and how to get along peacefully with your fellow students.

I suppose you missed the part of my post which said that I specifically went to the off topic portion in order to avoid having them read my opinions. I do not speak harshly about President Bush. I tell them that he is doing the best he can, when THEY ask. I say nothing about President Clinton, not did I when he was president.

I am not a novice teacher. I have taught for over 30 years, and they are MY KIDS that are laying down their lives. I just met one of my students today who is 28, and whom I remember with great affection. I’m thinking that you could be about the age of someone I could have taught, but I know you aren’t, because if you were, you would have better manners. I have had kids who came to me like you, but left with a different attitude. Most of my kids are like Rob who are concerned, sympathetic, and like to joke around a bit. He’s my favorite kind of kid, because I don’t have to expend a lot of time correcting him (gently) and with whom I can have some fun while teaching (which is a VERY difficult job - You wouldn’t be able to do it.).

By the way, who said that just because you are a teacher you can’t have opinions? Most of my colleagues are VERY opinionated, but not in their classrooms. They stick to the subject matter, as do I. I teach in a National Exemplary School. My principal went to Washington D.C in 1990 to receive the plaque from the Department of Education. The then President Bush (the first) and his wife, Barbara, sat 6 rows in front of him. BTW, I wrote the winning application which was 36 pages of single spaced text. There were 241 schools in the entire country, including our territories who won this that year. My principal and I and the group who attended were told not to expect to win as we won the California Distinguished School Award, because it was not just a formality, but a really difficult award to obtain.

I realize that I haven’t addressed your concerns about my answers to others who are in agreement with you. However, they haven’t attacked me. (No, this is NOT an invitation to come back and attack me, the rest of you!)


By the way, Happy Birthday Again, Bill!!
sue[/b]

Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:42 am

Gen,
I just checked your profile. You post over 5 times each day? It's time for you to get a life, my dear!!

sue

Tue Aug 30, 2005 5:38 am

Sue -

Nicely put response. Notice how he's suddenly "disappeared"?

You might find ironic his shopworn claim that he's the one who's always "attacked" without reason.

Please be assured that "genesim"'s rhetoric and decorum is in the minority on this MB.

DJC

Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:37 am

Silver did you even bother reading my post? I said exactly as you said???

Plus if you are going to teach a child about a consensual excapade....you first are a f*cked up person


That is a quote of myself! I didn't speak about you specifically, but the kind that would do that is. As far as the attacks. No I merely spoke up in response to staments that came from you.

When I see someone speaking about the "peace and tranquility" of President Clinton, that seems to me someone that is speaking from ignorance.

As far as your teaching. I am glad that you have answered me the way you have. That is the correct way to be and whole heartedly am glad for it. I urge you to actually take some time and read my posts as opposed to breezing through and picking out a few tats here and there. I admit that this an assumption on my part, but rest assured some things seem to be skewed.

Most on this board know my style and don't let the few speak for the rest. I do not make it a habit to "attack" people as you say. I have a long history with Doc and Jeff D. I have a bigger beef with. Your opinion about me is unfounded.

As far as me getting a life. I think a couple of posts a day is hardly everything. I enjoy writing, and I enjoy debating. Sometimes it gets annoying, but it is all in good fun.

Take some time to check on my history, and perhaps you will change your opinion. Pollitics aside, there is no reason to make judgements. If you look at what I wrote, I leveled nothing at you and only stated possibilities. I use facts to debate and other then said people, I do not get personal.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Doc me dissapearing??? Again, I went to spend time with my family and enjoy a day off. No big deal. As far as my views being in the minority, I will leave others to judge that...as they have before.

Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:52 am

silver wrote:Gen,
I just checked your profile. You post over 5 times each day? It's time for you to get a life, my dear!!


Sue -

I just checked mine as well. I have just over 4 posts a day. However, I'm living it up. Life is great!

Do I need to ease off a little?

Thanks in advance. :wink:

Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:03 am

Gen, Dearheart,

You said:


Silver did you even bother reading my post? I said exactly as you said???

Quote:
Plus if you are going to teach a child about a consensual excapade....you first are a f*cked up person


That is a quote of myself! I didn't speak about you specifically, but the kind that would do that is.


Now, I don't know about anyone else, but I read ..if YOU are going to teach a child... as referring to ME! I, being the teacher. Sorry to have misunderstood you.

I do understand the enjoyment of writing. I write well, myself. Hope to hear from you again (maybe more pleasantly?).

XXXXXX000XXX BACK TO YOU!!

sue

Doc: I do wish I had YOU in my class! What a splendid class with both you and Rob and Little Bad Gen!!
sue
Last edited by Silver on Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:08 am

Rob, my darling,

You can never write enough!! Keep it up! I will look forward to hearing what you have to say. But, wouldn't it be lovely to be in class all over again; this time NOT with your mean third grade teacher, but one to whom you would bring Elvis music boxes, and be in a class with Dr. John and mean Little Gen?


sue

Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:15 am

silver wrote:Doc: I do wish I had YOU in my class! What a splendid class ...

Thank you for the kind words. Of course, you might get tired of giving me nothing but "A"s all the time.

DJC

Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:18 am

OK Doc, ease up just a little.

You're not even in her class and you are trying to become "teacher's pet."

Sue -

Don't let him fool ya!

Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:36 am

Rob,
Anyone in my classes can tell you, NO ONE fools me!!

sue


Doc, dearest,
Not even YOU!!

sue

Teacher's Pet?? LOL :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'm leaving the room. Pretty soon, someone is going to tell me to get a life!!
sue

Tue Aug 30, 2005 8:22 am

Bill Clinton As A Child
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