qubuz - high def downloads of Elvis Albums - fake?

[Scoobie]

Well, I took a chance and bought one of the albums from the site in question. I chose "King Creole" as the only digital copy I have at the moment is one of those CD realeases from the 1990's that have inferior sound and mix.
My opinion? The one I selected is definitely a needrop made from a mono vinyl. I can hear the needle drop on the record and the stylus noise at quiet moments and at the start and end of tracks.

However it is in original mono and apart from the vinyl noise floor, it sounds OK, but it is not what paid for. If I wanted a needle drop made at 24 bit 96khz I would have done it myself (as I have done better than this with my 180 gram vinyl of "From Elvis In Memphis").
So, overall, a rip off pure and simple.

I thought it was too good to be true, but at least it only cost me £4.67 to find out...

[Claus]

King Creole on HDTracks is definitely not a needledrop.

There are many King Creole titles on that site. Which one did you choose?

[Scoobie]

I chose BNF Soundtrack version. I probably chose the wrong one....

[Claus]

I think the ones from RCA - Legacy are genuine, but one should probably stay away from the others.

[Scoobie]

Yes, probably right... Bought the wrong one never mind... I was thinking, if these were not the genuine article they would surely be in deep sh*t legally speaking. On the other hand would not SonyBMG have made a big deal of these being made available? How is it they managed to be made available without huge fanfare a push from Sony?

[Claus]

Hi-res is still very much a niche market. They are geared towards a very small group of consumers.

[When In Rome]

It seems the same albums have appeared on iTunes as being 'Mastered for iTunes' probably from the same 24bit/96khz masters, these same albums also appear in the complete album series which also appear on both Amazon and iTunes -

The Complete 50's Albums Collection.jpg

The Complete 60's Album Collection, Vol. 1 1960-1965.jpg

What is 'Mastered For Itunes'?

This may help...
http://www.npr.org/blogs/therecord/2012/02/24/147379760/what-mastered-for-itunes-really-means

This snippet is interesting though -
...the company is asking bands and their labels to submit songs to the store that are encoded as AAC files directly from the original, 24-bit studio recordings.

In Apple's calculation, mastering a song or album "for iTunes" means that it'll sound better while remaining just as portable as the encoded files we're accustomed to packing by the thousands onto our phones and mobile devices. For Bob Ludwig, a mastering engineer who remastered Coldplay's latest album, Mylo Xyloto, for the new "Mastered for iTunes" store, this makes sense. "From a technical viewpoint, there are cases where the lossy 24-bit AAC file would be superior to the lossless CD," Ludwig wrote in an email. "I did an early demonstration for some engineer friends of mine and the difference between the 'Mastered for iTunes' file I created and the one that was ripped from a 16-bit CD was easily heard on the little speakers on my MacBook Pro. I listened to the two versions of Coldplay's single, "Every Teardrop Is A Waterfall," to test the difference. (I can't post audio samples of the two versions of the track here because the encoding process a file goes through in any audio editor obscures those subtle differences, but if you have a CD version of any of the albums in the "Mastered for iTunes" section of the store, you can compare easily by ripping the tracks at "iTunes Plus" quality.) Played over decent headphones, I could hear subtle differences, especially where the mix was denser and more complicated. Ludwig's "Mastered for iTunes" version sounds slightly less crowded, with clearer distinctions between similar tones in acoustic guitar and piano and sharper, less distorted drums."

Seemingly then, if I deduce correctly, Elvis' albums are being offered, or have been mastered, both lossless and lossy, utilising 24bit/96 kHz masters?

Interestingly, the version of 'Elvis Presley' (LPM 1254) that turned up from Sony on Amazon in 2013 (?) included 'Just Because' with the intro fixed, as on 'A Boy From Tupelo' ...

[Scoobie]

It is unclear to me just what is being offered by itunes. I would like to think they are offering 24 bit 96 kHz lossless files, but I suspect these will be 24 bit, 96 kHz lossy files. Still they will be better than the 16 bit versions we have had up to now.
A shame then that this format has already been superseded by DSD.
They might be worh a punt seeing as you seem to be able to buy the whole collection or individual albums or sons therein.
I might get a itunes gift card later today and give it a go, just to see if they are any good...

[When In Rome]

It is unclear to me just what is being offered by itunes. I would like to think they are offering 24 bit 96 kHz lossless files, but I suspect these will be 24 bit, 96 kHz lossy files. Still they will be better than the 16 bit versions we have had up to now.
A shame then that this format has already been superseded by DSD.
They might be worh a punt seeing as you seem to be able to buy the whole collection or individual albums or sons therein.
I might get a itunes gift card later today and give it a go, just to see if they are any good...

The iTunes files are definitely lossy AAC files but I assume they have been mastered from 24 bit 96 kHz masters as opposed to, as you say, 16 bit masters prepared for CD.
Gee, it gets complicated doesn't it?
I got the iTunes 'Elvis Christmas Album', 'For LP Fans Only, 'A Date With Elvis' and 'Golden/Gold records 1 & 2', all 'Mastered For itunes'. I can't fault the sound on them, they are obviously the recent remasters, do they sound better than the CD's in 'The Complete Masters'? I don't know, but part of my doubt comes from the fact I know they are lossy files and not lossless, so I just feel that I'm missing something rather than hearing it. Maybe with high end gear the difference would be noticeable but I don't own that kind of stuff, I just downloaded them for my 'iPod'-u-lator...
Just a few notes here - The finger snap is missing on 'White Christmas' as per 'The Complete Masters' but 'Any Way You Want Me' isn't the same as appears on 'The Complete Masters' appearing here without the strange edit to the 'D' in darling, 'I Want To Be Free' isn't the original spliced master on 'A Date With Elvis' and 'Doncha Think It's Time' is the single master.

[Will]

Guys you need to buy the Sony Legacy 24bit......these are the only ones that are the real deal.....straight from the masters Example Elvis Is Back,Pot Luck,Elvis At Stax,Something For Everybody.G I Blues Blue Hawaii......... enjoy they are brilliant

[Scoobie]

Will.. Do you mean the legacy ones available on Qobuz? Or the mastered for itunes on the iTunes Store?

[matilda]

Very interesting! Ha, it is funny in retrospect. They were afraid of near perfect copies! Now the cat is out of the bag, I think the best way for the music industry to save themselves now is to offer near perfect physical media. Er whatever happened to CD's slogan "perfect sound forever"? What a crock.

my cd's from 25 years ago sound exactly the same they did 25 years ago.
so whats your point?

[Will]

I go to Qobuz because they are cheaper than HDTracks........what you are also going to find out guys is that depending on the region of the company they only have rights to certain albums and labels.......I've also been collecting Dino and Frank Sinatra stuff too but having to jump from site to site..........another site is hi res audio where i got the double album essential elvis for £9........the 68 stuff on that was amazing Memories and If I Can Dream...........if anyone wants to email me private happy to sort something out with my collection.........Im up to ver 120 Elvis tracks in this quality ......and loving it...........if you have a spare £14 grab Elvis Is Back and play on a nice system.........be warned theres no going back

[Will]

http://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/album/elvis-is-back-elvis-presley/0886445009743

[Will]

As you can see its worth shopping around................think Ive heard a song called that from somewhere

http://www.hdtracks.co.uk/elvis-is-back

[Scoobie]

Will... Oh! I did not know HD tracks had opened a uk shop! here we go then...

[Will]

Hi buddy............HDTracks have been in the UK for about 8 months........but they are more expensive than the French Site Qobuz........its the same product.......also check for the first download you usually get 15% off.........plus HDTracks do a free sample album

[Claus]

Why not buy from the U.S. shop?

[Will]

In the uk its restricted from us..

[Claus]

Really? It works in some European countries.

[Will]

Can you post the link and I will try............thats why we were happy to get HDTracks UK last year because we were unable to get anything at all............now up to 400 albums and counting

[Claus]

Not all albums are available for non-us customers due to license restrictions, but the Elvis albums are available.

http://www.hdtracks.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=elvis+presley

[Will]

Thank you for that but it took me to the UK site............if you try the album Essential Elvis you will see that its restricted.......go figure lol.........I'm sure moving forward and as HD sound takes hold all these restrictions will fade away..thanks again If you have some of these albums it would be interesting to hear your observations on them.

[Scoobie]

Oh boy... Great stuff! Now I am conflicted, should I buy Elvis Is Back (again) just to be able to compare to the SACD or get something else.... Hmmm.. Are these the same quality as the DSD files that are on the SACD?

[Will]

Few albums on there I wish I could get but can't because of restrictions