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Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:57 am

C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:06 am

Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


I agree, in the 70's Elvis sang songs he liked or related too. I guess we should be sorry he was drawn to dramatic ballands and songs like that, but hey he liked them so thats good enough for me.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:51 am

elvis-fan wrote: but he's a big boy...


That's just a rumour.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:59 am

I'm so sick of people not recognizing the frequent brilliance of Elvis' vocal abilities just because he's not singing rock and roll.

Give me a break. There's more than one style of music, you know.

Stop being snobs and expand your musical horizons and open your ears.

You'll be glad that you did!

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:09 am

Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


Yes he was.

Well, he's a earthquakin', hip shakin'
Soul breakin', love makin' machine

Hey, hey, hey.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:17 am

Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

phpBB [video]



American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:21 am

Elvis was not looking like "a Greek God". He was human. I don't like this expression and I thing it's meaningless. Elvis was not Apollo, Zeus, or Poseidon.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:26 am

Telly Savalas was the only Greek God of our lifetime.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:28 am

poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

phpBB [video]



American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.

Interesting observations. I thought the Aloha Renditions of What Now My Love, Trilogy, I'll Remember You were pretty damned good. Maybe you should just skip everything past 1970, because Elvis couldn't sing right? :facep: :wtf:

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:35 am

poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

phpBB [video]



American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.


I think Elvis was always experimenting with his voice, trying different things. I believe when he sang with an operatic tone, it's because he wanted to, because that's how he felt it. I disagree about the rehearsal version of Trilogy, I thought it was outstanding. Look at both versions of What Now My Love from the Aloha, two excellent performances, two different endings. It's like when James or somebody tried a "different lick" on a guitar, to mix it up a bit.

jurasic1968 wrote:Elvis was not looking like "a Greek God". He was human. I don't like this expression and I thing it's meaningless. Elvis was not Apollo, Zeus, or Poseidon.


He looked phenomenal then.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:38 am

HoneyTalkNelson wrote:Telly Savalas was the only Greek God of our lifetime.


Who loves you baby! ::rocks

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:47 am

memphisound wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

phpBB [video]



American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.


Interesting observations. I thought the Aloha Renditions of What Now My Love, Trilogy, I'll Remember You were pretty damned good. Maybe you should just skip everything past 1970, because Elvis couldn't sing right? :facep: :wtf:


Well, since I never mentioned American Trilogy and I'll Remember You at Aloha, your comment makes no sense. What's more, I also said that What Now My Love was "impressive". American Trilogy was praised prior to the trumpet arrangement, which I think came in during late 1974 or 1975. Once again, someone who refuses to read what I write.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:49 am

Joe Car wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

phpBB [video]



American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.


I think Elvis was always experimenting with his voice, trying different things. I believe when he sang with an operatic tone, it's because he wanted to, because that's how he felt it. I disagree about the rehearsal version of Trilogy, I thought it was outstanding. Look at both versions of What Now My Love from the Aloha, two excellent performances, two different endings. It's like when James or somebody tried a "different lick" on a guitar, to mix it up a bit.



I never mentioned the rehearsal version of Trilogy, just What Now My Love. Listened to side by side, the rehearsal version of WNML sounds like Elvis is half asleep until that final section. In Aloha itself, he has much more vocal control, and holds the long notes during the quieter sections without them wandering off.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:55 am

He doesn't sound half asleep to me. Maybe you should clean out your ears. Or upgrade your sound system.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:20 am

He was not half asleep, The big problem of Aloha was he neglected Love Me, Hound Dog, Blue Suede Shoes, Johnny B. Goode (even this is not his song), Can't Help Falling in Love and did average versions of My Way, Something, Suspicious Minds and Fever. And I don't think the version of Welcome to My World it's great, either.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:37 am

jurasic1968 wrote:He was not half asleep, The big problem of Aloha was he neglected Love Me, Hound Dog, Blue Suede Shoes, Johnny B. Goode (even this is not his song), Can't Help Falling in Love and did average versions of My Way, Something, Suspicious Minds and Fever. And I don't think the version of Welcome to My World it's great, either.


Once again, I spoke specifically of the rehearsal show and specifically of What Now My Love.

So, I write a post that explains my position in detail, and yet all the replies have seemingly not read or understood it. It's going well.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:44 am

As I'm sure many of you would agree, Elvis' voice went through huge changes over the years. But for me, it's especially evident over the last two years of his life. From the recordings we have left, it seems like he was never quite able to get a handle on the vocal changes of that latter period...for various reasons. Would he have, over time? We'll never know the answer to that one. It still amazes me when I listen to his March 1975 studio vocals compared to his February '76 offerings. What the hell happened? A lot, I suppose. The poor guy.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:53 am

poormadpeter wrote:
jurasic1968 wrote:He was not half asleep, The big problem of Aloha was he neglected Love Me, Hound Dog, Blue Suede Shoes, Johnny B. Goode (even this is not his song), Can't Help Falling in Love and did average versions of My Way, Something, Suspicious Minds and Fever. And I don't think the version of Welcome to My World it's great, either.


Once again, I spoke specifically of the rehearsal show and specifically of What Now My Love.

So, I write a post that explains my position in detail, and yet all the replies have seemingly not read or understood it. It's going well.


You often do the same, so you are in no position to complain about others. ;-)

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:03 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:
jurasic1968 wrote:He was not half asleep, The big problem of Aloha was he neglected Love Me, Hound Dog, Blue Suede Shoes, Johnny B. Goode (even this is not his song), Can't Help Falling in Love and did average versions of My Way, Something, Suspicious Minds and Fever. And I don't think the version of Welcome to My World it's great, either.


Once again, I spoke specifically of the rehearsal show and specifically of What Now My Love.

So, I write a post that explains my position in detail, and yet all the replies have seemingly not read or understood it. It's going well.


You often do the same, so you are in no position to complain about others. ;-)


On the contrary, I reply to what's written on the forum. If you want to play semantics, that's not my problem.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:20 am

poormadpeter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:You often do the same, so you are in no position to complain about others. ;-)


On the contrary, I reply to what's written on the forum. If you want to play semantics, that's not my problem.


Many times over you reply without reading the full post your are replying to. It's not "semantics" --- it's fact.

So calling out someone else for the same egregious error is just a wee bit hypocritical. ;-)

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:36 am

poormadpeter wrote:
jurasic1968 wrote:He was not half asleep, The big problem of Aloha was he neglected Love Me, Hound Dog, Blue Suede Shoes, Johnny B. Goode (even this is not his song), Can't Help Falling in Love and did average versions of My Way, Something, Suspicious Minds and Fever. And I don't think the version of Welcome to My World it's great, either.


Once again, I spoke specifically of the rehearsal show and specifically of What Now My Love.

So, I write a post that explains my position in detail, and yet all the replies have seemingly not read or understood it. It's going well.


I just watched What Now My Love from the rehearsal show, imo, he paces the song magnificently, then the incredible finish. His voice was phenomenal.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:38 am

poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:
Joe Car wrote:C'mon you guys, seriously. Are we going to turn this into another thread like the Aloha one where it got to the point where his physical appearance was even dissected, despite looking like a greek god. We are talking about Elvis here, not some frickin hack singer. This is the man that everybody wanted to sing there songs, even well into the seventies. What Now My Love is a build up song, as was The Impossible Dream, It's Over is another song that comes to mind. How about American Trilogy, where he finesses the hell out of that song in the middle, then nails the ending incredibly. He was doing different material in 1972 as opposed to 1970, his tastes changed. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and said to himself, hmm, my voice isn't as good as 1970, let me change my style. Maybe in 1971 he wasn't singing as well as in 1970, or 1972, that happens. He was human, not a machine.


The problem wasn't that his voice got worse, but he simply misused it for the most part. He was capable of doing much more with his voice than singing at full pelt and singing softly, but there is very little "inbetween" in 1971-77. He would quite clearly use his more powerful voice for effect because (a) it's easier to sing at full voice and (b) the dramatic effect meant there was no need for a thoughtful approach to a song. It was ideal during this period on stage when doing show after show. Autopilot. It's Over is a key point. What does the song gain by that loud ending? He doesn't build up to it, he just suddenly starts yelling. Up to that point, the song is beautiful, a lovely performance in Aloha, but the ending just ruins it.

As for What Now My Love, yes, it is a build up song. But he doesn't build up. He goes from normal, relatively quiet, singing to belting the hell out of it. It's just a switch from one to the other. Compare that to Bassey's hit single from the early 1960s, where she starts off quietly and builds up throughout the 3 minutes of the song. There isn't a sudden switch, it's carefully planned and paced, with a wonderful Nelson Riddle arrangement. Sadly the youtube clip has rather a thin sound, but it still makes the point. Elvis's version in comparison doesn't have that build up, it's simply a volume switch being shoved up for the final section. Yes, that ending is mightily impressive, as is the vocal range, but it has no subtlety whatsoever. This isn't all Presley's fault - the arrangement is, for sure, not of the standard of Riddle's. But then we need to ask ourselves why that is the case - no doubt Elvis could have got himself a decent arranger if he wanted to.

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American Trilogy, which you also mention, sees Elvis singing in a completely different way. The arrangement and the vocal are well-thought out, and because of that it has tremendous power. But when the arrangement got "dumbed down", and the trumpet solo replaced the flute solo, it all turned into pathos and cheapened the whole thing.

So what am I saying here? Basically, that Elvis stopped caring. Trilogy, in it's earliest incarnation, showed just how Presley could put that new powerful voice to good use, and the effects are stunning. But, for the most part, he used it for easy effect. What Now My Love could be easily sleepwalked through in Vegas for two and a half minutes providing the ending was dramatic - and he does just that in the Aloha rehearsal show where his vocal for the main section of the song is pretty awful, with him seemingly unable to hold a note in tune for more than a second or so (check out the end of each line). But it doesn't matter providing he belts out the end, because that's what people remember.

It's not anything to do with genre in this case (although I agree with HoneyTalkNelson on that point), but simply losing the ability to use his instrument with the care and attention it deserved. Not every ballad had to end with a big note - unless you wanted to divert attention from deficiencies in your performance.


I think Elvis was always experimenting with his voice, trying different things. I believe when he sang with an operatic tone, it's because he wanted to, because that's how he felt it. I disagree about the rehearsal version of Trilogy, I thought it was outstanding. Look at both versions of What Now My Love from the Aloha, two excellent performances, two different endings. It's like when James or somebody tried a "different lick" on a guitar, to mix it up a bit.



I never mentioned the rehearsal version of Trilogy, just What Now My Love. Listened to side by side, the rehearsal version of WNML sounds like Elvis is half asleep until that final section. In Aloha itself, he has much more vocal control, and holds the long notes during the quieter sections without them wandering off.


He made some subtle changes for the main show, for this particular song. Most notably the ending.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 6:11 am

I love you Joe, you are such a "fan" !

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 6:29 am

poormadpeter wrote:
elvis-fan wrote:
InheritTheWind wrote:After 1970 it mostly alternated between thin/tremulous and the Tarzan bellow.

Right... he certainly couldn't sing after 1970... :shock:


That's not what he said.

The word "mostly" is key here. MSG, while effective, lacks most of the subtleties in the singing that were present in August 1970, for example. Never Been To Spain is effective, but the whole thing is a set up for that final verse, and What Now My Love in Aloha is set up in the same way. It's effective, but it is as subtle as a brick. Alternatively, take a listen at Just Pretend in 1970 where, yes, there is a powerful, loud chorus but that's not what the song is all about. It's not set up just to hear that ending, the verses are brilliantly sung, infused with virtually every genre of music Elvis covered, and avoid that simple soft-loud dynamic change. While some of those big, belting numbers might be fun to sing and listen to, Elvis isn't working to produce anything as great as what he had done before. As for the thin/tremulous voice, well we have that for the most part in May 1971 and July 1973.


Exactly. You completely nailed it. And Just Pretend is a perfect example. Elvis had many, many moments of greatness after 1970 but I think he relied way too much on the big Tarzan bellow. That became his ace in the hole. I'm a sucker for it, too: What Now My Love sends chills down my spine every time I hear it. But he didn't rely on that bellow in 1968-1970. It happened sometimes (Without Love, Just Pretend, etc.) but he didn't rely on it.

As far as the thin/tremulous voice that's just what I hear in his post-1970 vocals. People seem to get very upset or overly defensive when I say that but there's a handful of other members who hear it, too. The drastic change in his voice after 1970 is something that I clearly heard when I was ten years old! But just because I hear that physical change in his voice does not mean that I think he "couldn't sing" after 1970. In fact, one of my favorite vocals by him is Rags to Riches from the 1976 New Year's show. And I love the MSG album. But nothing matches what he did between 1968 and 1970.

Re: Examples of Elvis using his "rock" voice after 1969?

Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:19 am

I think the bar was just set so high by Elvis at his very best. I don't have a problem with his voice on anything much pre College Park. Sure there were some duff vocals in the early seventies, but his voice itself seems to be less a problem than the quality of some of the songs. College Park on...well 1975 saw a recovery, and to be fair select 1976-77 vocals are on point. Still the last 1974 tour and 1976-77 there was real problems.