Anything about Elvis
More than 30 Million visitors can't be wrong

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Thu Aug 22, 2013 9:38 pm

Fairchild1171 wrote:Any performer...I don't care who you are...Elvis, Michael Jackson, Frank Sinatra, The Beatles...do NOT stay on top forever..unless something tragic happens...like they die or disband. Don't want to get into all "He's alive crap" but any smart manager see's into the future and knows that one day "their" artist will no longer be on top. Music changes, taste changes...so as bad as this sounds...death is the best thing that happened to Elvis and Michael Jackson as far as "Living on" and "staying" on top. The Beatles knew this, even though there were other factors that came into play on why they never got back together...they quit on top of their game...they didn't let "changes in music" catch up with them.


It isn't really about Elvis staying on top.

It's about what Elvis would have done and if you think he would have achieved some more things if he hadn't died.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Thu Aug 22, 2013 9:43 pm

I realize what the OP was asking...I was saying that I don't think Elvis would have achieved that much more, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm not. What I am saying as far as being an entertainer, there comes a time when you are not reləvənt anymore. Maybe he would have gone into producing other artist, song writing? Who knows. Too bad we won't ever know the answer to these questions.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:18 am

brian wrote:
r&b wrote:Very tough to answer. How do you know he would have achieved anything more at all. His career was stalled and he could have kept on going that route until he totally faded into oblivion and became one of many other oldies acts playing smaller & smaller venues.


That never would have happened.

Elvis had enough fans and was always more popular than the artists that had to play oldies package tours to earn a living.

Elvis played and routinely sold out the arena's in the United States and was always getting offered millions to play all over the world.

If nothing else Elvis would have continued to sell out shows and be a highly profitable touring act.

The thing about touring is you don't have to be relevant at all musically to sell out shows and make a lot of money from it.



Really? I doubt Elvis would have still sold out MSG for 4 shows in 1977. I think his career was now mostly relegated to less major cities and suburbs which, he was still selling out, but he was no longer the star he was a few years earlier. His name and past rep sold out shows those last 2 years, not the product he was putting out. If he didn't change course soon, I think the venues would have gotten smaller as the older faithful fans would have eventually stopped going and newer younger fans would not have been drawn to his show with no new hit records, and the reviews the shows were getting. Plus, the whole jumpsuit thing did not appeal to younger people. It didn't look like things were about to change. He didn't even want to record new material in 1977. But it seemed like Elvis was content to let things continue as they were. Another listless tour was about to start.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:40 am

r&b wrote:
brian wrote:
r&b wrote:Very tough to answer. How do you know he would have achieved anything more at all. His career was stalled and he could have kept on going that route until he totally faded into oblivion and became one of many other oldies acts playing smaller & smaller venues.


That never would have happened.

Elvis had enough fans and was always more popular than the artists that had to play oldies package tours to earn a living.

Elvis played and routinely sold out the arena's in the United States and was always getting offered millions to play all over the world.

If nothing else Elvis would have continued to sell out shows and be a highly profitable touring act.

The thing about touring is you don't have to be relevant at all musically to sell out shows and make a lot of money from it.



Really? I doubt Elvis would have still sold out MSG for 4 shows in 1977. I think his career was now mostly relegated to less major cities and suburbs which, he was still selling out, but he was no longer the star he was a few years earlier. His name and past rep sold out shows those last 2 years, not the product he was putting out. If he didn't change course soon, I think the venues would have gotten smaller as the older faithful fans would have eventually stopped going and newer younger fans would not have been drawn to his show with no new hit records, and the reviews the shows were getting. Plus, the whole jumpsuit thing did not appeal to younger people. It didn't look like things were about to change. He didn't even want to record new material in 1977. But it seemed like Elvis was content to let things continue as they were. Another listless tour was about to start.


Yes, really r&b.

That's what I'm telling you Elvis was always going to consistently be able to sell out tours.

According to Billboard in 1977 Elvis was the #1 concert attraction for venues 6,000 to 20,000 seats and was still packing them in Vegas.

I just got thru telling you that to sell out shows you don't have to have hit records or be a contemporary force in music.

There are numerous examples of people not having a big hit record for years and they still pack them in.

You keep harping on the jumpsuits and perhaps Elvis should have ditched them by 1977 but it was a completely different era.

The 1970s was a horrible decade for fashion and many of the top music performers wore really ugly clothes on stage.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:50 am

I agree with Brian that Elvis was indeed the number 1 arena box office attraction in 1977.
I have attached an article from the local press in Rapid City and it does confirm how much revenue for the city Elvis Presley could generate.
In comparison to a modern new act such as "Heart" just look at the figures they generated for the city.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:32 am

A world tour by one of the biggest musical icons/entertainers in history would not have been an achievement. It was a glaring omission from Elvis' resume, but had international touring taken place, no one would have viewed it as an achievement.

Elvis had barely touched the surface as an actor. Had Elvis segued into non-musical roles during the late-'70s and into the '80s, that would have been an achievement had he been a success at it.

Had Elvis fulfilled his ambition to create a karate documentary or film as a producer/director/actor; that certainly would have been an achievement.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:40 am

Elvis achieved about as much as you can in the music business. I wish he had achieved inner peace and comfort and maybe achieved a 2nd career as a producer.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:40 am

Elvis would have drifted into country music which he was allready doing near the end. He would have been big in that field and the 80's started a country boom. In the 90's he would have been back to his roots in sourthern gospel as it boomed with the Gaither video's and so fourth. I think as usual his timing would have been just right for country and then southern gospel and his career would hav boomed. I don't know if he would have ever become a great actor though, he seemed rather limited in that field.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:43 am

Fairchild1171 wrote:I realize what the OP was asking...I was saying that I don't think Elvis would have achieved that much more, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm not. What I am saying as far as being an entertainer, there comes a time when you are not reləvənt anymore. Maybe he would have gone into producing other artist, song writing? Who knows. Too bad we won't ever know the answer to these questions.


None of this happened with Sinatra or Michael Jackson, so why would it have happened with Elvis? BTW, look at Neil Diamond. He has been consistently one of the top concert draws in the last 30 years.

Sure, their record sales trailed off but they were always in demand as performers playing the biggest venues. So they did stay on top. For Elvis it would have been the same.

Elvis still had foreign countries to conquer. He had serious films to conquer the way Sinatra did. He could have explored new musical territory, working with those artists that he influenced and loved him so much like Robert Plant and Paul McCartney

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:39 am

Fairchild1171 wrote:Any performer...I don't care who you are...Elvis, Michael Jackson, Frank Sinatra, The Beatles...do NOT stay on top forever..unless something tragic happens...like they die or disband. Don't want to get into all "He's alive crap" but any smart manager see's into the future and knows that one day "their" artist will no longer be on top. Music changes, taste changes...so as bad as this sounds...death is the best thing that happened to Elvis and Michael Jackson as far as "Living on" and "staying" on top. The Beatles knew this, even though there were other factors that came into play on why they never got back together...they quit on top of their game...they didn't let "changes in music" catch up with them.


True. But there is more to life, much more than being "an icon." I mean, if the choice is between being less of an icon, or death, it would be madness to choose death. And, when you mess around with drugs in the manner of Elvis or Michael, you are asking for it. I mean, Elvis was aware of the sudden iconic status of other dead rock stars by the end of 1970 and certainly by '71. He knew that if he died, he'd be a bigger star than ever and for keeps. Now, he did not kill himself, but in letting it happen, there must have been something in the back of his mind that if anything happened, there was a "silver lining."

Jon Landau addresses this in his '71 review of Elvis in Boston, but praised Elvis for not going down that road, to his knowledge, of course. But it clearly wasn't enough - it wasn't a strong enough statement.

And that sort of thinking must end. Dead is just dead; nobody gets to watch their own funerals. Someone has to really make a statement of some kind condemning the icon-ization of death in the music and entertainment fields. I don't know how, or what they should say, but they should. Because these musicians usually start this when they are still quite young, and somebody has to say "no. This is wrong! And when you die, there will be no rewards, except perhaps for those others who profit from this death industry."

Maybe it's better to put a bleeping terrorist on the cover of Rolling Stone, than one that says "He's Hot, He's Sexy, and He's Dead." (Jim Morrison, 1981)

I guess we don't help much.

rjm

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:47 am

luckyjackson1 wrote:Hook up with Rick Rubin in the 90's and make better films.


I have been thinking about that since I heard Cash´American recordings for the first time. Elvis would have been perfect for that.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:56 am

IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:14 am

samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:11 pm

eligain wrote:
Fairchild1171 wrote:I realize what the OP was asking...I was saying that I don't think Elvis would have achieved that much more, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm not. What I am saying as far as being an entertainer, there comes a time when you are not reləvənt anymore. Maybe he would have gone into producing other artist, song writing? Who knows. Too bad we won't ever know the answer to these questions.


None of this happened with Sinatra or Michael Jackson, so why would it have happened with Elvis? BTW, look at Neil Diamond. He has been consistently one of the top concert draws in the last 30 years.

Sure, their record sales trailed off but they were always in demand as performers playing the biggest venues. So they did stay on top. For Elvis it would have been the same.


That's part of Fairchild's point.

In the music business if you are one of the lucky ones you sell a lot of records and are very popular for a while but then at some point you stop selling as much.

At that point you are no longer considered #1 in the music business and you are usually replaced by someone else.

That did happen to Sinatra, Jackson and Diamond.

Yes, they still had a lot of fans and were still able to sell out concerts but it's not the same thing.

As I've already mentioned in this thread I have no doubt Elvis would have sold out concerts even when his record sales have dried up.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:13 pm

luckyjackson1 wrote:
samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:


If Elvis had survived that August morning I'm sure something would have been done and a change would have been forced on him, the differences from other times was that EWH had just been published and people now had a insight into the possible causes to Elvis' failing health, so I think there would have been too many questions and accusations and as Joe Louis once said "You can run but you can't hide." And Elvis would, for the first time, have to face the fact that he had a problem.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:24 pm

Pink&Black wrote:I try not to ask 'what if' too often, there seem to be so many 'what ifs' in Elvis' life. i think it takes away from the wonderful legacy he left. Still it's tempting, so here goes: I think it would not be too far-fetched to think that, had Elvis cleaned up his act, Bruce Springsteen would've written and produced an Elvis album. He did so for one of his other boyhood heroes Gary US Bonds. There actually is a short story written about how Bruce and Elvis team up and become good friends. I think it's either on Brucebase or Backstreets.


Bruce originally wrote Fire for Elvis...if you listen to the original demo tape the E Stree Band is playing/sounding like the Stax sessions and Bruce is trying to sound like the Sun sessions. i still liked it, but thought it abit odd that he would attempt it like that. The arrangement with the Stax influence is great...
phpBB [video]

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:33 pm

ML4EP wrote:
Pink&Black wrote:I try not to ask 'what if' too often, there seem to be so many 'what ifs' in Elvis' life. i think it takes away from the wonderful legacy he left. Still it's tempting, so here goes: I think it would not be too far-fetched to think that, had Elvis cleaned up his act, Bruce Springsteen would've written and produced an Elvis album. He did so for one of his other boyhood heroes Gary US Bonds. There actually is a short story written about how Bruce and Elvis team up and become good friends. I think it's either on Brucebase or Backstreets.


Bruce originally wrote Fire for Elvis...if you listen to the original demo tape the E Stree Band is playing/sounding like the Stax sessions and Bruce is trying to sound like the Sun sessions. i still liked it, but thought it abit odd that he would attempt it like that. The arrangement with the Stax influence is great...
phpBB [video]




What a perfect song for Elvis as was Bruce's Pink Cadillac. He could have written some great songs for Elvis.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:05 pm

elvis-fan wrote:
Liverbobs wrote:Lennon was a worse addict than Elvis, taking much harder drugs...

I'm not exactly sure how you would measure such a thing but a couple observations...

- Demerol, Dilaudid, Placidyl, Methaqualone, Morphine, Pentobarbital, Dexedrine, Valium (just to name a few)... were favorites of Elvis'
- between 1975 and 1977, Elvis was prescribed more than 18,000 doses of prescription drugs - "in the first eight months of 1977 alone,
- Nichopoulos had written 199 prescriptions totalling more than 10,000 doses of sedatives, amphetamines and narcotics (That's 40 doses a day!)"
- while no cause of death has ever been confirmed, it is not unreasonable to believe that Elvis' chronic abuse of drugs in the last few years of his life played a role

Definitely signs of abuse with some seriously powerful drugs... but Lennon was worse than that???


No, he wasn't. It's just another example of this "us versus them" problem some can never let go of.

Also note: only one of the two died from problems with drug addiction.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:22 pm

jacob wrote:
luckyjackson1 wrote:
samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:


If Elvis had survived that August morning I'm sure something would have been done and a change would have been forced on him, the differences from other times was that EWH had just been published and people now had a insight into the possible causes to Elvis' failing health, so I think there would have been too many questions and accusations and as Joe Louis once said "You can run but you can't hide." And Elvis would, for the first time, have to face the fact that he had a problem.


Elvis would have bounced back, had he survived August 16th. I have no doubt!

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:38 pm

Joe Car wrote:
jacob wrote:
luckyjackson1 wrote:
samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:


If Elvis had survived that August morning I'm sure something would have been done and a change would have been forced on him, the differences from other times was that EWH had just been published and people now had a insight into the possible causes to Elvis' failing health, so I think there would have been too many questions and accusations and as Joe Louis once said "You can run but you can't hide." And Elvis would, for the first time, have to face the fact that he had a problem.


Elvis would have bounced back, had he survived August 16th. I have no doubt!


Who know's its hard to say, and I only say this because he had a few near death encounters before August 16th 1977 and he just shrugged them off like nothing.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:30 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
elvis-fan wrote:
Liverbobs wrote:Lennon was a worse addict than Elvis, taking much harder drugs...

I'm not exactly sure how you would measure such a thing but a couple observations...

- Demerol, Dilaudid, Placidyl, Methaqualone, Morphine, Pentobarbital, Dexedrine, Valium (just to name a few)... were favorites of Elvis'
- between 1975 and 1977, Elvis was prescribed more than 18,000 doses of prescription drugs - "in the first eight months of 1977 alone,
- Nichopoulos had written 199 prescriptions totalling more than 10,000 doses of sedatives, amphetamines and narcotics (That's 40 doses a day!)"
- while no cause of death has ever been confirmed, it is not unreasonable to believe that Elvis' chronic abuse of drugs in the last few years of his life played a role

Definitely signs of abuse with some seriously powerful drugs... but Lennon was worse than that???


No, he wasn't. It's just another example of this "us versus them" problem some can never let go of.

Also note: only one of the two died from problems with drug addiction.


Right. Lennon got away from the spotlight for 5 years, and cleaned up his life with help from his wife. He took control, then came back in 1980. Think Elvis had the same desire and/or support? Not the Col. for sure, and with no wife or other form of support system, it would never have happened. But then again, he has to be the one to take the first step.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:32 am

Joe Car wrote:
jacob wrote:
luckyjackson1 wrote:
samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:


If Elvis had survived that August morning I'm sure something would have been done and a change would have been forced on him, the differences from other times was that EWH had just been published and people now had a insight into the possible causes to Elvis' failing health, so I think there would have been too many questions and accusations and as Joe Louis once said "You can run but you can't hide." And Elvis would, for the first time, have to face the fact that he had a problem.


Elvis would have bounced back, had he survived August 16th. I have no doubt!


I do. The warning signs were there and he almost died on one previous occasion. There was no desire on Elvis' part after that to get clean & healthy.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:40 am

r&b wrote:
Joe Car wrote:
jacob wrote:
luckyjackson1 wrote:
samses wrote:IF Elvis had lived through "the tour that never was", I think something should have happened. The new book and the media attention would have forced Parker or someone else to take Elvis out of business. Elvis should have been treated for his addiction and his other problems. After some years off, he could have made his third comeback in new format. New management, new backing, new producer, world tour. I also think could have done quality movies. It´s a shame he never say the 90´s - they would have been great for him.

Yes, something should have happened and he should have done something.
But I think NOTHING would have changed. It unfortunately would have just put off the unstoppable/unavoidable. :cry:


If Elvis had survived that August morning I'm sure something would have been done and a change would have been forced on him, the differences from other times was that EWH had just been published and people now had a insight into the possible causes to Elvis' failing health, so I think there would have been too many questions and accusations and as Joe Louis once said "You can run but you can't hide." And Elvis would, for the first time, have to face the fact that he had a problem.


Elvis would have bounced back, had he survived August 16th. I have no doubt!


I do. The warning signs were there and he almost died on one previous occasion. There was no desire on Elvis' part after that to get clean & healthy.


Yes, but that was before when everything was hush- hush. Once the cat was out of the bag so to speak, he would have had to make a conscious effort to change his lifestyle. I also think that there would have been repercussions with some new changes, like getting rid of the Colonel.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:50 am

brian wrote:
r&b wrote:
brian wrote:
r&b wrote:Very tough to answer. How do you know he would have achieved anything more at all. His career was stalled and he could have kept on going that route until he totally faded into oblivion and became one of many other oldies acts playing smaller & smaller venues.


That never would have happened.

Elvis had enough fans and was always more popular than the artists that had to play oldies package tours to earn a living.

Elvis played and routinely sold out the arena's in the United States and was always getting offered millions to play all over the world.

If nothing else Elvis would have continued to sell out shows and be a highly profitable touring act.

The thing about touring is you don't have to be relevant at all musically to sell out shows and make a lot of money from it.



Really? I doubt Elvis would have still sold out MSG for 4 shows in 1977. I think his career was now mostly relegated to less major cities and suburbs which, he was still selling out, but he was no longer the star he was a few years earlier. His name and past rep sold out shows those last 2 years, not the product he was putting out. If he didn't change course soon, I think the venues would have gotten smaller as the older faithful fans would have eventually stopped going and newer younger fans would not have been drawn to his show with no new hit records, and the reviews the shows were getting. Plus, the whole jumpsuit thing did not appeal to younger people. It didn't look like things were about to change. He didn't even want to record new material in 1977. But it seemed like Elvis was content to let things continue as they were. Another listless tour was about to start.


Yes, really r&b.

That's what I'm telling you Elvis was always going to consistently be able to sell out tours.

According to Billboard in 1977 Elvis was the #1 concert attraction for venues 6,000 to 20,000 seats and was still packing them in Vegas.

I just got thru telling you that to sell out shows you don't have to have hit records or be a contemporary force in music.

There are numerous examples of people not having a big hit record for years and they still pack them in.

You keep harping on the jumpsuits and perhaps Elvis should have ditched them by 1977 but it was a completely different era.

The 1970s was a horrible decade for fashion and many of the top music performers wore really ugly clothes on stage.

Always an apologist! Elvis could not have gone on forever touring the way he was, same songs and venues etc, it would have all eventually dried up. Elvis' popularity was waning. As r&b says, fans were still lining up to see him because of his past reputation. Most fans seeing him for the first time, in say, 74 to 77, were probably expecting to see the TTWII Elvis and the fans were screaming for what he once was and not for the performance he was giving at the time. As r&b says, he had no current new/hit records to keep the public interested. His career was in need of a desperate change. At the age if 42 it was too late, his young years were over.

Re: What more would Elvis have achieved...

Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:57 am

Just because he was at the age of 42 does not mean the man couldn't had recorded another hit record.

If he had gotten himself clean and life straightened out, maybe even a different Manager, theres no doubt in my mind he could've been at the top of the charts again.

He wasn't 21, anymore, but that don't mean he couldn't make great music anymore.

Such a pessimistic view.