Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:There ...
Move on. Ten visits to this topic is more than you deserve. Thank you.
You count my posts? Dear God. Oops. That mention of Him will get the topic deleted according to your calculations.



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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poormadpeter wrote:You count my posts?
Not posts. Visits. You know little about the forum tools available to members. Move on. Thank you.


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:You count my posts?
Not posts. Visits. You know little about the forum tools available to members. Move on. Thank you.
And my visits to read your work is bothering you why, exactly?



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

Here's a very nice look at songwriter Ben Weisman that I just found. It covers a lot of bases, and with a touch of humor along the way.

"… like a tailor, I started writing for Elvis."



Ken Emerson: Remembering Ben Weisman

Heinz met its match in Ben Weisman, who wrote with a variety of lyricists an astounding 57 songs recorded by Elvis Presley and died on May 20 at the age of 85. Although "Clambake," "Rock-A-Hula Baby" and "He's Your Uncle, Not Your Dad" can't hold a candle to the quality of Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller's "Hound Dog" and "Jailhouse Rock" or Doc Pomus and Mort Shuman's "Viva Las Vegas" and "Little Sister," Weisman far surpassed in quantity more famous contributors to the Presley songbook. Few of them are remembered today, but Weisman racked up more than 60 gold records and sales of 75 million. Not only Elvis but everyone else, from Jackie Gleason, Lefty Frizzell and Frankie Lymon and the Teenagers to Barbra Streisand, the Beatles, Bruce Springsteen and Reba McIntyre, recorded his songs.

If time had pretty much forgotten Weisman well before his death, he was ahead of it in at least one regard. He was among the first pop songwriters of his and the following generation to sense the power shift in the music business from the East to the West Coast and to light out for Los Angeles. When I spent an afternoon with him in 2001, he was as modest as his home in Marina Del Rey, though disappointed and puzzled that his work did not command more respect.

Born in 1921, the same year as Hal David (with whom he would write a few songs), Weisman grew up in Brooklyn, studied classical piano, and switched to swing when he wrote arrangements for military dance bands as a member of the Army Air Force Special Services during World War Two.

By 1950 he was writing songs and pitching them at the Brill Building, Manhattan's legendary citadel of popular music publishing at 1619 Broadway. Dean Martin was the first performer to record one of his compositions, which soon caught the ear of Jean Aberbach, the dapper Viennese co-owner, with his brother Julian, of Hill and Range Songs. The Aberbachs, then quartered a couple of blocks away at 1650 Broadway, a few flights above Irving Berlin, signed Weisman to an exclusive contract.

In 1956, Jean Aberbach told Weisman to watch Presley's first nationally televised appearance on the Dorsey Brothers' Stage Show. "Okay," he said, "now write for him." "I went through the usual procedure," Weisman recalled. "I studied his range--how high he could go, what kind of lyrics he wanted to hear--and, like a tailor, I started writing for Elvis."

Presley used to call Weisman "the Mad Professor" ("'cause I didn't look like a rock 'n' roll guy"), but Weisman considered himself "a dissector." He could pick apart and simulate any style. When Jean Aberbach asked him to write country music, Weisman balked, but only for a second. "I said, 'Jean, I don't write country music.' He said, 'Weisman, you see this check? You're going to write country music. Go out and buy the top ten country albums and come back a few weeks from now.' So I went home and listened to them until finally it came out my ears and I was loaded with country music. Because I was able to adapt to it, I immediately got records by the Sons of the Pioneers, Hank Snow, Jim Reeves--I got 'em all."

Weisman arranged for and occasionally sat in with Noro Morales's Latin band ("Doc" Severinsen played fourth trumpet). He even wrote a popular gospel song, "The Robe of Cavalry," though under a pseudonym because Hill and Range didn't want to attach a Jewish name to a gospel song.

Such journeyman versatility left little room for personality, and most of Weisman's generic tunes could easily be attributed to Anon. That was fine by the Aberbachs. Cranking out as many as four Presley movies a year was assembly-line work, and most of the songs were as formulaic as the films. Besides, the Aberbachs never wanted songwriters to get too big for their britches and threaten Hill and Range's strangle-hold over Presley's publishing.

Yet it was Jean Aberbach himself who warned Weisman that "publishers are losing a lot of their power" and suggested he move to California, where film, television and music were consolidating into the entertainment industry. Weisman made his move in 1962, in advance of a mass migration from Manhattan that included Burt Bacharach, Hal David, Gerry Goffin, Carole King, Barry Mann, Cynthia Weil, Jeff Barry, and a slew of other songwriters. "Suddenly you found that everybody you wanted to talk to was three hours earlier than you were," Cynthia Weil explained. In 1964, even Dick Clark's American Bandstand pulled up its stakes in Philadelphia and trekked across country.

His new surroundings inspired Weisman to write his most memorable song. He met Dorothy Wayne, who came up with a catchy title he couldn't wait to set to music. Weisman had yet to acquire a piano for his new apartment, so he snuck into UCLA, borrowed a piano, and worked out the melody. "The Night Has a Thousand Eyes" became one of Bobby Vee's -- and Ben Weisman's -- greatest hits.


Ken Emerson is the author, most recently, of Always Magic in the Air: The Bomp and Brilliance of the Brill Building Era.

Huffington Post - June 8, 2007
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ken-emerson/remembering-ben-weisman_b_51292.html
Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Sat Dec 17, 2022 11:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by promiseland »

poormadpeter wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:You count my posts?
Not posts. Visits. You know little about the forum tools available to members. Move on. Thank you.
And my visits to read your work is bothering you why, exactly?
Because you are doing what you always do, and that's trying to always troll on Docs topics because of your jealousy and envy you have always had for him, so why don't you go crawl back under your rock and stop causing trouble before you get reported for your trolling behavior.
Enough is enough - troublemaker move on!.



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

Thanks.

Back on topic, it seems one must conclude Ben Weisman's "Elvis oeuvre" totals ... 56 songs.

Still, landing nearly five dozen titles with one major artist ain't too shabby for a confident songwriter with a dream!

It never hurts to actually tally the songs on any fabled "list." ;-)


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by Blue River »

drjohncarpenter wrote:It never hurts to actually tally the songs on any fabled "list." ;-)
:wink:


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

I just updated the image found in the opening post, a "new" shot to my eyes. Check it out!


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by Jaime1234 »

Heres a theoretical album of his songs which anyone of us could point to a non Elvis fan as an album of good to great Elvis songs and NOT be thought of as totally out of it, in terms of being passe. Here Elvis delivers these 20 with a certain gusto. They are tracked chronologically

Got A Lot O' Livin' To Do, 1957
Crawfish, 1958
It Feels So Right, 1960
Fame and Fortune, 1960
Wooden heart, 1960
Moonlight swim, 1961
Stepping out of line, 1961
Follow that dream, 1962
This Is Living, 1962
I got lucky, 1962
Beyond the bend 1962
It Won't Be Long, 1965
Frankie and Johnny, 1965
Hard Luck, 1965
There Is So Much World To See, 1967
How Can You Lose What You Never Had, 1967
All I needed was the rain, 1968
Let Us Pray, 1969
Almost, 1969
Twenty Days And Twenty Nights, 1970




r&b

Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by r&b »

Jaime1234 wrote:Heres a theoretical album of his songs which anyone of us could point to a non Elvis fan as an album of good to great Elvis songs and NOT be thought of as totally out of it, in terms of being passe. Here Elvis delivers these 20 with a certain gusto. They are tracked chronologically

Got A Lot O' Livin' To Do, 1957
Crawfish, 1958
It Feels So Right, 1960
Fame and Fortune, 1960
Wooden heart, 1960
Moonlight swim, 1961

Stepping out of line, 1961
Follow that dream, 1962
This Is Living, 1962
I got lucky, 1962
Beyond the bend 1962
It Won't Be Long, 1965
Frankie and Johnny, 1965
Hard Luck, 1965
There Is So Much World To See, 1967
How Can You Lose What You Never Had, 1967
All I needed was the rain, 1968
Let Us Pray, 1969
Almost, 1969
Twenty Days And Twenty Nights, 1970
Nooo - these songs define out of it & passe to a tee! I once was listening to a radio station (FM - forgot which one) and they played Thunder Road by Springsteen and said this is how to be a relevant rock star, then played 10 seconds of Moonlight Swim and said this is how not to. Wimpy, terrible song.



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

r&b wrote:Nooo - these songs define out of it & passe to a tee! I once was listening to a radio station (FM - forgot which one) and they played Thunder Road by Springsteen and said this is how to be a relevant rock star, then played 10 seconds of Moonlight Swim and said this is how not to. Wimpy, terrible song.
It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
r&b wrote:Nooo - these songs define out of it & passe to a tee! I once was listening to a radio station (FM - forgot which one) and they played Thunder Road by Springsteen and said this is how to be a relevant rock star, then played 10 seconds of Moonlight Swim and said this is how not to. Wimpy, terrible song.
It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?
Here it is, to save time and trouble:


Image

With songwriters Sid Wayne and Ben Weisman, MGM Studios in Culver City - March 1966


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r&b

Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by r&b »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
r&b wrote:Nooo - these songs define out of it & passe to a tee! I once was listening to a radio station (FM - forgot which one) and they played Thunder Road by Springsteen and said this is how to be a relevant rock star, then played 10 seconds of Moonlight Swim and said this is how not to. Wimpy, terrible song.
It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?
Yes, very nice, thanks



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

r&b wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?
Yes, very nice, thanks
Thanks. I have never seen a photo of Wayne, who co-wrote more songs for Elvis than almost anyone.


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by jurasic1968 »

Thanks, Doc, for this beautiful picture. The plaque represents a gift from the 2 composers to Elvis with their songs recorded by Presley until 1966? To me it's possible after I saw the list.




r&b

Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by r&b »

drjohncarpenter wrote:
r&b wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?
Yes, very nice, thanks
Thanks. I have never seen a photo of Wayne, who co-wrote more songs for Elvis than almost anyone.
Its a shame Elvis never met Otis Blackwell or Pomus/Shuman writers of some of his biggest and best hits. The way the Col shut him out from within the industry is just not right. Then again, I think it was up to Elvis to maybe try & meet them and thank them in person.



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

jurasic1968 wrote:Thanks, Doc, for this beautiful picture. The plaque represents a gift from the 2 composers to Elvis with their songs recorded by Presley until 1966? To me it's possible after I saw the list.
It's kind of amazing, and yet saddening. Those guys made a lot of money with movie soundtrack submissions that were more often than not mediocre, or worse. Elvis deserved so much better.



r&b wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:Thanks. I have never seen a photo of Wayne, who co-wrote more songs for Elvis than almost anyone.
Its a shame Elvis never met Otis Blackwell or Pomus/Shuman writers of some of his biggest and best hits. The way the Col shut him out from within the industry is just not right. Then again, I think it was up to Elvis to maybe try & meet them and thank them in person.
Yes, if either one had made more of an effort, such meetings would have taken place. But no way did management want creative people hanging around their talent.


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by brian »

r&b wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
r&b wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:It was better done in 1957:
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65355&p=972061&&#p972061

Did you check out the photo of Sid Wayne on page 1?
Yes, very nice, thanks
Thanks. I have never seen a photo of Wayne, who co-wrote more songs for Elvis than almost anyone.
Its a shame Elvis never met Otis Blackwell or Pomus/Shuman writers of some of his biggest and best hits. The way the Col shut him out from within the industry is just not right. Then again, I think it was up to Elvis to maybe try & meet them and thank them in person.
I recall Otis Blackwell saying something about turning down an opportunity to meet Elvis because he was superstitious and considered it bad luck.

I'm positive there are other singers past and present who don't meet every songwriter that writes them a hit.



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by Mike Windgren »

Hi there!! :D :D :D.

Sid Wayne & Ben Weisman are two of my favourite Elvis movie songs composers :smt020. Bye for now :smt006.


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

On the official Wiseman site is this image:


Hit List_from Weisman site.jpg


It seems that it shows "Chataqua" [sic] as one of the songs on Elvis' "Hit List."

Sorry, he never recorded that one, Ben. In the MGM film "The Trouble With Girls" there is a marching band instrumental version of Weisman's "Almost," which Elvis did record, and you see it on this hit list.

But you cannot count it twice, and Elvis' voice isn't even on "Chautauqua."

56 is the correct total.

https://www.benweismanmusic.com/

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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by DarkShade »

There was a book several years ago that was done by Ben Weisman called The Hollywood Years. It featured sheet music for many of Ben's songs. It also featured a list of 57 songs that he wrote or co-wrote that Elvis recorded. The only anomaly on the list in the book is Chautauqua.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/264111070243


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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

DarkShade wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:57 am
There was a book several years ago that was done by Ben Weisman called The Hollywood Years. It featured sheet music for many of Ben's songs. It also featured a list of 57 songs that he wrote or co-wrote that Elvis recorded. The only anomaly on the list in the book is Chautauqua.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/264111070243

Yup. Ben Weisman yet again fudges his song tally to "57" by including that variant.

The book appeared in January 1988. I love how the back cover sports the shot of him with Elvis, seen on page 1 of this topic, that eliminates his main co-writer, Sid Wayne, who was also there.

But if one looks closely at the plaque the singer's holding, it clearly shows:


With deep appreciation for ... over 40 of our songs ...

THANKS ELVIS

Sid Wayne and Ben Weisman




And each man's name has exactly 21 titles underneath, for a total of 42 songs. This meeting was circa March 1966.


880100_Elvis Presley The Hollywood Years_Weisman_01.jpg
880100_Elvis Presley The Hollywood Years_Weisman_02.jpg
660300_w Wayne_Weisman_Plaque_DETAIL.jpg
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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by Jokerlola »

I forgot an important part of my memories of August 16, 1977; About 6 to 8 weeks before Elvis died I ordered the silent Super 8 film of Elvis in Anaheim 76. These were the days when the only "moving pictures" you could buy of Elvis was film. VCR's were out by now but very expensive and there was no pre recorded tapes of Elvis. The main Elvis bootlegger "Vic Colonna" advertised in his little newsletter that I got once a month about the new "Anaheim 76" and I just had to have it so I ordered it and had to wait the excruciatingly long time 6 to 10 weeks for delivery.

I got back home from visiting several record stores after the announcement of Elvis' death on August 16 and the doorbell rang and when I answered it, it was the mail man with my copy of the "Elvis in Anaheim 76" film! It was a total bittersweet moment! I had been waiting all summer for the film and it finally comes on the afternoon the Elvis dies!!!

Of course I immediately screened the film after it got delivered and it was a very sad experience that would have been a happy experience had it arrived a day earlier!



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Re: Songwriter Ben Weisman --> 57 Varieties?

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Post by drjohncarpenter »

Jokerlola wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:27 am
I forgot an important part of my memories of August 16, 1977; About 6 to 8 weeks before Elvis died I ordered the silent Super 8 film of Elvis in Anaheim 76. These were the days when the only "moving pictures" you could buy of Elvis was film. VCR's were out by now but very expensive and there was no pre recorded tapes of Elvis. The main Elvis bootlegger "Vic Colonna" advertised in his little newsletter that I got once a month about the new "Anaheim 76" and I just had to have it so I ordered it and had to wait the excruciatingly long time 6 to 10 weeks for delivery.

I got back home from visiting several record stores after the announcement of Elvis' death on August 16 and the doorbell rang and when I answered it, it was the mail man with my copy of the "Elvis in Anaheim 76" film! It was a total bittersweet moment! I had been waiting all summer for the film and it finally comes on the afternoon the Elvis dies!!!

Of course I immediately screened the film after it got delivered and it was a very sad experience that would have been a happy experience had it arrived a day earlier!


Nice story, but what does it have to do with songwriter Ben Weisman?


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