Anything about Elvis
More than 30 Million visitors can't be wrong

Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 6:44 am

I saw this clip on youtube the other day and have been meaning to ask around about it. At the 1:24 mark of the home movie there's a young African American female sitting in the chair with Elvis' grandmother Minnie Mae Presley. The women is NOT a maid or caretaker as she is in street clothes. Elvis' house keepers always wore white work clothes. She looks to be making herself at home in the clip.

Could this be Elvis' cousin Bobbie Wren who would later hang out at Graceland during the Stax sessions?

Image

phpBB [video]

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:13 am

SuspiciousMind wrote:I saw this clip on youtube the other day and have been meaning to ask around about it. At the 1:24 mark of the home movie there's a young African American female sitting in the chair with Elvis' grandmother Minnie Mae Presley. The women is NOT a maid or caretaker as she is in street clothes. Elvis' house keepers always wore white work clothes. She looks to be making herself at home in the clip.

Could this be Elvis' cousin Bobbie Wren who would later hang out at Graceland during the Stax sessions?

Image

phpBB [video]



That's probably Elvis' cook/maid, Nancy Rooks, hired that month, May 1967.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 11:11 am

Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?

rjm

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 1:36 pm

rjm wrote:Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?


Bobbie Wren was Elvis's cousin, the daughter of Gladys' sister Lillian. She was not African-American.



730200_w cousin Bobbie Wren_Las Vegas.JPG


730800_w cousin Bobbie Wren.jpg



Sadly, she was the family cousin who died from a pill overdose at the time of Presley's December 1976 tour, but everyone waited until Elvis finished his Pittsburgh performance on December 31 before telling him. This is also why he did not join the after-show party at the hotel that night.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Wed May 08, 2013 7:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 6:21 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
rjm wrote:Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?


Bobbie Wren was Elvis's cousin, the daughter of Gladys' sister Lillian. She was not African-American.


730200_w Bobbi Wren in Las Vegas.JPG


730700_w Bobbi Wren in Memphis_Stax.jpg



Sadly, she was the family cousin who died from a pill overdose at the time of Presley's December 1976 tour, but everyone waited until Elvis finished his Pittsburgh performance on December 31 before telling him. This is also why he did not join the after-show party at the hotel that night.


Actually, Bobbie was bi-racial. Her dad was said to be African-American and met Glady's sister in Florida back in the late 30's and they had an affair and a baby (Bobbie) was the result from it.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 6:40 pm

Gosh, so much tragedy in Elvis family and extended family.

It must have been devastating for him following the good tours of October, November, and late December, to hear of this tragedy. Perhaps another piece of the puzzle as to why he was so different from late December 76 to February 77(?)

rlj

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 6:44 pm

SuspiciousMind wrote:Actually, Bobbie was bi-racial. Her dad was said to be African-American and met Glady's sister in Florida back in the late 30's and they had an affair and a baby (Bobbie) was the result from it.


Glad you appreciated my input. Where exactly may we learn what you mention here?

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:03 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
rjm wrote:Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?


Bobbie Wren was Elvis's cousin, the daughter of Gladys' sister Lillian. She was not African-American.


730200_w Bobbi Wren in Las Vegas.JPG


730700_w Bobbi Wren in Memphis_Stax.jpg



Sadly, she was the family cousin who died from a pill overdose at the time of Presley's December 1976 tour, but everyone waited until Elvis finished his Pittsburgh performance on December 31 before telling him. This is also why he did not join the after-show party at the hotel that night.

Are we sure the last pic is from Stax? The background looks a lot like the upper left photo in the link, only with the doors closed.
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/candid- ... ish72.html

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:13 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:Actually, Bobbie was bi-racial. Her dad was said to be African-American and met Glady's sister in Florida back in the late 30's and they had an affair and a baby (Bobbie) was the result from it.


Glad you appreciated my input. Where exactly may we learn what you mention here?


There was a book put out years ago, back in the 90's that talked about it. I believe it was called The Real Elvis Presley or Shake Rag or something like that. There's been so many written that I can't keep up with titles of which is which. I do not own the book. I read that part in the beginning of it one day at Books-A-Million. I didn't have the money to get it at that time. Wish I did now.

Anyway, the story goes that Glady's sister left Tupelo for South Florida in the mid 30's, around the time that Elvis was born. While there, she met a young black man who she began to have a secret affair with. She then got pregnant by this man and because of southern laws in those days, she had to raise it on her own. I would assume that Bobbie is that child since Gladys only had one sister. But by looking at those pics of Elvis and Bobbie, it's too obvious that she is NOT a white woman from the south. She definitely is darker complected and has non white features.

That's about all I can remember from it.
Last edited by SuspiciousMind on Wed May 08, 2013 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:18 pm

egilj wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
rjm wrote:Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?


Bobbie Wren was Elvis's cousin, the daughter of Gladys' sister Lillian. She was not African-American.


730200_w Bobbi Wren in Las Vegas.JPG


730700_w Bobbi Wren in Memphis_Stax.jpg



Sadly, she was the family cousin who died from a pill overdose at the time of Presley's December 1976 tour, but everyone waited until Elvis finished his Pittsburgh performance on December 31 before telling him. This is also why he did not join the after-show party at the hotel that night.

Are we sure the last pic is from Stax? The background looks a lot like the upper left photo in the link, only with the doors closed.
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/candid- ... ish72.html



Good eyes. I have never noticed that before. But you are correct, it is NOT Stax where the pics of Elvis and Bobbie are made, it's in Las Vegas at the old Hilton Hotel. Possibly Elvis' suite.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:21 pm

SuspiciousMind wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:Actually, Bobbie was bi-racial. Her dad was said to be African-American and met Glady's sister in Florida back in the late 30's and they had an affair and a baby (Bobbie) was the result from it.


Glad you appreciated my input. Where exactly may we learn what you mention here?


There was a book put out years ago, back in the 90's that talked about it. I believe it was called The Real Elvis Presley or Shake Rag or something like that. There's been so many written that I can't keep up with titles of which is which. I do not own the book.


Maybe when or if you find it we can confirm what you wrote. Otherwise it is just unfounded rumour, not fact.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:24 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:Actually, Bobbie was bi-racial. Her dad was said to be African-American and met Glady's sister in Florida back in the late 30's and they had an affair and a baby (Bobbie) was the result from it.


Glad you appreciated my input. Where exactly may we learn what you mention here?


There was a book put out years ago, back in the 90's that talked about it. I believe it was called The Real Elvis Presley or Shake Rag or something like that. There's been so many written that I can't keep up with titles of which is which. I do not own the book.


Maybe when or if you find it we can confirm what you wrote. Otherwise it is just unfounded rumour, not fact.


Then explain her African features. The woman is NOT white as say Billy Smith or Patsy Presley was. She is most certainly mixed of some other race. I've seen many different pics of her in different lighting, and she always appears darker than the others in the pics with her, including Elvis.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:30 pm

I'm not sure, but this might be the book that I read that in. If it is, and anyone has it, it would be in the first part, or chapter of the book.

Image

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:52 pm

SuspiciousMind wrote:
egilj wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
rjm wrote:Ok. But who is Bobbie Wren?

The story on that?


Bobbie Wren was Elvis's cousin, the daughter of Gladys' sister Lillian. She was not African-American.


730200_w Bobbi Wren in Las Vegas.JPG


730700_w Bobbi Wren in Memphis_Stax.jpg



Sadly, she was the family cousin who died from a pill overdose at the time of Presley's December 1976 tour, but everyone waited until Elvis finished his Pittsburgh performance on December 31 before telling him. This is also why he did not join the after-show party at the hotel that night.

Are we sure the last pic is from Stax? The background looks a lot like the upper left photo in the link, only with the doors closed.
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/candid- ... ish72.html



Good eyes. I have never noticed that before. But you are correct, it is NOT Stax where the pics of Elvis and Bobbie are made, it's in Las Vegas at the old Hilton Hotel. Possibly Elvis' suite.

Yes, and the pics from this meeting could be from the August/September 1973.

But when did the other meeting take place? In the link below there's an "Elvis Now"-shopping bag on the table, which means August/September 1972, granted that the bag was around for only one Las Vegas season.
http://www.elvis-collectors.com/candid- ... lax73.html

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 7:57 pm

SuspiciousMind wrote:Then explain her African features. The woman is NOT white as say Billy Smith or Patsy Presley was. She is most certainly mixed of some other race. I've seen many different pics of her in different lighting, and she always appears darker than the others in the pics with her, including Elvis.


You probably don't understand how incredibly bad these comments make you look. Elvis had "African features," too. Were either of his parents non-white?

Let's move on from this sub-point, please.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 8:06 pm

egilj wrote:Are we sure the last pic is from Stax? The background looks a lot like the upper left photo in the link, only with the doors closed.

http://www.elvis-collectors.com/candid- ... ish72.html


Nice observation. Here's the image you cite:



720904_w British fan club_Las Vegas.JPG



All of the shots of Elvis with the red scarf pinned around his jacket have long been attributed to Stax in 1973.

However, Memphis musician Wayne Jackson not only worked in the studio with Elvis but also saw him open shows in Las Vegas, with Bobbie Wren. See the interview excerpt below.

Looking at Wayne's dressed-up attire, as well as Bobbie's dress in her photo, adds great weight to the possibility that these all come from August 1973 at the Hilton, just after the July Stax sessions:



730800_w Wayne Jackson.JPG


730800_w cousin Bobbie Wren.jpg



How did you get to see so many of Elvis’ performances in Las Vegas?

It just happened that I am a qualified pilot. Elvis’ cousin Bobbie Ayers [sic] was married to a wealthy real estate developer and I was the co-pilot of his Lear jet. So when Elvis would open in Las Vegas I would fly their Lear jet down there and we’d all go and see Elvis’ opening show. We would all sit in the big booth right in the front and we’d end up going back stage after every show for the whole week! We went every time Elvis opened. Since I had played on all the records, and Elvis had known me since I was a kid, we had a natural connection for talking and he’d also like to see Bobbie, so we would just party for the week. That went on once or twice a year for several years. They were the best times.

http://www.elvisinfonet.com/interview_waynejackson.html




In 1994, author Vera Jane Goodwin published her book, Elvis & Bobbie: Memories of Linda Jackson. We see Wren with Elvis on two occasions in Las Vegas, probably February and August 1973.


940902_Elvis & Bobbie_Vera Jane Goodwin_01.JPG


940902_Elvis & Bobbie_Vera Jane Goodwin_02.JPG
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Wed May 08, 2013 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 8:26 pm

Thank you for verifying and give additonal info, doc. Giving the Jackson qoute, it's very tempting to date it to August 6.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 8:28 pm

egilj wrote:Thank you for verifying and give additonal info, doc. Giving the Jackson qoute, it's very tempting to date it to August 6.


You're welcome. Wish I had a copy of that book, details may be inside.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 8:34 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
egilj wrote:Thank you for verifying and give additonal info, doc. Giving the Jackson qoute, it's very tempting to date it to August 6.


You're welcome. Wish I had a copy of that book, details may be inside.

Do you have an opinion when the other meeting took place (see my post above)?

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 9:02 pm

egilj wrote:Do you have an opinion when the other meeting took place (see my post above)?


Yes, I made note of it in my post with the Wayne Jackson photo.

My guess is the other meeting is circa February 1973. Elvis apparently got that crazy coat around that time, and he does not have the look of summer 1972 (no tan). The "Elvis Now" stuff is a bit of a mystery, given the release of the album in early 1972. Knowing Tom Parker, it was another example of him dumping leftover promo material.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 9:36 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
egilj wrote:Do you have an opinion when the other meeting took place (see my post above)?


Yes, I made note of it in my post with the Wayne Jackson photo.

My guess is the other meeting is circa February 1973. Elvis apparently got that crazy coat around that time, and he does not have the look of summer 1972 (no tan). The "Elvis Now" stuff is a bit of a mystery, given the release of the album in early 1972. Knowing Tom Parker, it was another example of him dumping leftover promo material.

Sorry, I missed that. Judging by his looks I lean against february 1973 as well, but the shopping bag confuses me. Maybe someone on this forum was in Vegas in february 1973 and can tell us what kind of bag they put their newly bought Elvis records in.

By the the way I quickly scanned the Wren book a couple of months ago visiting a friend of mine, but it didn't get me any closer in dating the meetings.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Wed May 08, 2013 9:54 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:Then explain her African features. The woman is NOT white as say Billy Smith or Patsy Presley was. She is most certainly mixed of some other race. I've seen many different pics of her in different lighting, and she always appears darker than the others in the pics with her, including Elvis.


You probably don't understand how incredibly bad these comments make you look. Elvis had "African features," too. Were either of his parents non-white?

Let's move on from this sub-point, please.


How does what I said make me look bad? All I said was that she had African features. The pic that you posted (below) shows that she was most definitely a biracial woman. There's no denying that. I just brought up the story from the book that I read years ago about Elvis' aunt having an affair with a black man and a baby from it. And Bobbie being that woman's daughter fit the description perfectly. She's actually dark complected to be the daughter a white woman.
Image

But you still did not answer my question.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:03 am

SuspiciousMind wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
SuspiciousMind wrote:Then explain her African features. The woman is NOT white as say Billy Smith or Patsy Presley was. She is most certainly mixed of some other race. I've seen many different pics of her in different lighting, and she always appears darker than the others in the pics with her, including Elvis.


You probably don't understand how incredibly bad these comments make you look. Elvis had "African features," too. Were either of his parents non-white?

Let's move on from this sub-point, please.


How does what I said make me look bad? All I said was that she had African features. The pic that you posted (below) shows that she was most definitely a biracial woman. There's no denying that. I just brought up the story from the book that I read years ago about Elvis' aunt having an affair with a black man and a baby from it. And Bobbie being that woman's daughter fit the description perfectly. She's actually dark complected to be the daughter a white woman.


Again, I ask you to leave this sub-point alone. You are not coming off in a good light.

And, as I already wrote, there is nothing credible to support your statement about the late Bobbie Wren.

Below are two examples of a "dark complected" Elvis that clearly underscores what I suggested to you earlier.



571206_w WalterBailey_JuniorParker_BobbyBland_WDIA Benefit at Ellis.JPG

With Walter Bailey, Junior Parker, and Bobby Bland - Friday, December 6, 1957
WDIA Goodwill Revue, Memphis, TN

Photo: Ernest C. Withers



690610_w Tom Jones_Flamingo_Las Vegas_Borsasi.JPG

With Tom Jones - Tuesday, June 10, 1969
Flamingo Hotel, Las Vegas, NV

Photo: Peter C. Borsari
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:05 am

egilj wrote:By the the way I quickly scanned the Wren book a couple of months ago visiting a friend of mine, but it didn't get me any closer in dating the meetings.


So Elvis & Bobbie: Memories of Linda Jackson is mostly a photo book, with no real details?

Re: Who is this lady with Elvis' grandmother?

Thu May 09, 2013 3:26 am

The home movie depicts the Graceland den in its first iteration. Priscilla opens her gifts in front of the south wall, between the side door and the staircase to the roof.

I concur with John that we see Nancy Rooks sitting with Dodger. Again, it's shot in the den, just to the left of the stairs that lead to the basement.

Note the familiar waterfall in the background, as Joe accepts his slab of cake.