Was Elvis really inspired by the original artist?

Elvis recorded at the famous memphis sessions Hank Snow's
Hit” I’m Moving On”, but Was Elvis really inspired by the version of Hank Snow?.

Listing to the version of ‘The Box Tops” also recorded at the American Sounds Studio’s in Memphis in 1968. I strongly think Elvis sung the Box Top version.
The version of Elvis was almost the same as the version of The Box Tops

Thanks to Richard

Last edited by stayawayjoe001 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Based on the demos I've heard, Elvis did this many times during his recording career. Always having the ability to make it his own, but none the less taking something from the demos he listened to. As pointed out by DJC last season, listen to the influence this 1954 Drifters recording of White Christmas had on Elvis' 1957 track.

I never knew the Box Tops did "I'm Movin' On" - clearly Elvis was influenced by this version. Very interesting. Thank you.

Elvis recorded at the famous memphis sessions Hank Snow's
Hit” I’m Moving On”, but Was Elvis really inspired by the version of Hank Snow?.

Listing to the version of ‘The Box Tops” also recorded at the American Sounds Studio’s in Memphis in 1968. I strongly think Elvis sung the Box Top version.
The version of Elvis was almost the same as the version of The Box Tops

Thanks to Richard

IIRC, the Box Tops cut this at American Sound with Chips Moman at the helm, and many of the same core musicians that Elvis used, so it's not a surprise they offered up the same arrangement for Elvis just months later. The band was from Memphis and had scored some big hits, so it's pretty likely Elvis was aware of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Box_Tops

Lead singer Alex Chilton would go on in the '70s to form Big Star and create some of the best rock 'n' roll of the decade.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Star

All that said, Elvis probably knew the Hank Snow recording, too.

As Elvis played qpening act to Hank Snow many times, he would have been very familiar with the "i'm M

I agree with drjohncarpenter. Elvis wanted to record I'm Movin' On for a long time. When it was time to cut his version he probably agreed on a suggestion made by the American Sound band to use the arrangment they used for the Box Tops' version. Same thing happened with Suspicious Minds. Also, Elvis sings a different set of lyrics.

He also copied Jerry Butler version (1968), but i like elvis version more
By the the time Elvis recorded "Only The Strong Survice" Jerry Butler has a hit with this song.

Last edited by stayawayjoe001 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

Elvis' version of Long Black Limousine doesn't sound anything like the first released version of this great song by Vern Stovall or the covers by other country artists, but was based on O.C. Smith's soulful rendition.

Vern Stovall - Long Black Limousine (1961)

[b]O.C. Smith - Long Black Limousine (1968)

Elvis' version of Long Black Limousine doesn't sound anything like the first released version of this great song by Vern Stovall or the covers by other country artists, but was based on O.C. Smith's soulful rendition.

Vern Stovall - Long Black Limousine (1961)

[b]O.C. Smith - Long Black Limousine (1968)

I didn,t know that thank you for your input
I'll hope we find more of these

He also copied Jerry Butler version, but i like elvis version more
By the the time Elvis recorded "Only The Strong Survice" Jerry Butler has a hit with this song.

This is not quite correct. Butler's song came out on an November 1968 LP called The Iceman Cometh, and was the third 45 issued from the LP, on February 15, 1969. Elvis cut his version on February 20, 1969.

Butler's "Only The Strong Survive" (Mercury 72898) made Billboard US R&B #1 on April 5, 1969, Pop #4 on April 19, 1969.

690215_Mercury 72898_Butler.JPG

---

Interesting to imagine an entire Presley LP produced by the legendary team of Gamble and Huff, since Chips Moman did indeed use their sparkling arrangement (by Martin and Bell) for the Presley recording. What could have been!

Jerry Butler, "Only The Strong Survive" (Mercury 72898, February 15, 1969)
Note: Billboard US R&B #1 on April 5, 1969, Pop #4 on April 19, 1969.

Elvis Presley, "Only The Strong Survive" From Elvis In Memphis (RCA LSP 4155, June 7, 1969)


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Elvis recorded at the famous memphis sessions Hank Snow's
Hit” I’m Moving On”, but Was Elvis really inspired by the version of Hank Snow?.

Listing to the version of ‘The Box Tops” also recorded at the American Sounds Studio’s in Memphis in 1968. I strongly think Elvis sung the Box Top version.
The version of Elvis was almost the same as the version of The Box Tops

Thanks to Richard

Thats a great version, and one I've not heard before.

The more of these covers that we find in which Elvis copies an earlier (often obscure) arrangement, the more one starts to ponder about what Elvis himself brought to the table as an artist other than that voice of his. Prior to hearing this version of I'm Movin' On, one would be forgiven for thinking that Elvis's version rethought the song with a fresh, soul-tinged new arrangement and brought it kicking and screaming (literally) into the late 60s. On hearing the version posted here, we now know that yet again Elvis took a previous arrangement and fine-tuned it - and there is a vast difference when it comes to down to creativity between rethinking a song and finetuning an arrangement.

As Elvis played qpening act to Hank Snow many times, he would have been very familiar with the "i'm M

Sam Phillips says as much in the excellent "Sun Days with Elvis" documentary.

As Elvis played qpening act to Hank Snow many times, he would have been very familiar with the "i'm M

Sam Phillips says as much in the excellent "Sun Days with Elvis" documentary.

Even, Presley's is miles away in style from Snow's. His version clearly is based on the in the opening post.

The backing was all about the Memphis Boys (and the production of Dan Penn). I think Chilton was the only member of the Box Tops who was even on the recording. It's impossible to say whether Elvis had heard the Box Tops recording or just wanted to do the song and then let the Memphis Boys loose on it. If the latter, hopefully Elvis was aware that they were pretty much reproducing what they had done the previous year. In any case, Elvis' vocal does take it to another level. He really lives the song. Tommy Cogbill's busy bass work is also a major highlight of both recordings.

The backing was all about the Memphis Boys (and the production of Dan Penn). I think Chilton was the only member of the Box Tops who was even on the recording. It's impossible to say whether Elvis had heard the Box Tops recording or just wanted to do the song and then let the Memphis Boys loose on it. If the latter, hopefully Elvis was aware that they were pretty much reproducing what they had done the previous year. In any case, Elvis' vocal does take it to another level. He really lives the song. Tommy Cogbill's busy bass work is also a major highlight of both recordings.

Nailed it. It's a Memphis Boys recording, and Elvis generally did not arrange at these particular sessions. First of all, Chips' method of doing things in pieces, doing all these repairs, separating out the parts - all those things were not Elvis's customary way of recording. But they were the way of the studio.

Since it's the same musicians, same studio, same producer, same arranger, all he had to do was jump on in. He could have told them "no, no, no: you're doing it all wrong!" But they weren't doing it wrong. Why screw them up? At times, like on his jamming on certain songs, they'd get out of his way, and let him do what he wanted, and other times, he clearly got out of their way. The results speak for themselves.

If you heard the outtakes of this particular song, Elvis plays around with different lyrical approaches now and again (one major change, that didn't make it). And he brought his voice to the table, his excitement, his energy - but did he have a major say in the arranging of a song they had already done? I don't think so. This was a band that knew itself, and a also a hard-headed producer. (With a nod here to Dan Penn, of course, who also knew himself.) Still Elvis enjoyed himself, and in the outtakes, did much experimentation, within the limitations provided.

What did he bring to the table? Heard any other versions of "I'll Hold You In My Heart ("till I Can Hold You In My Arms)" that even come anywhere NEAR Elvis's version? The guy did hundreds of recordings, in every conceivable genre, and with many different production/arranging philosophies.

How can you listen to his Sun recordings, knowing how they came together, and say he didn't bring much to the table? Sam never suggested that blues, that Elvis had ALREADY worked out, to an extent, on the lawn of the Courts, with Johnny Black. Surprised the heck out of everybody!

What did he bring to, say, "Danny Boy"? Something no other singer I've ever heard. Maybe some people don't dig it, but I do, all versions, by the way. His versions of "Silent Night" and "Oh Little Town of Bethlehem" are so extraordinary, and so ELVIS - meaning, they're his, all the way, that when those women try to "duet" with him, I find it very irritating. (And I'm not very picky at Christmastime, but on those things, I want them to can it.)

If he liked something, he went with it, because he liked it so much. I think it was sometimes, not at American, but in some cases, of too much adoration of a recording. Sometimes, he'd copy an outright mistake on a cover, because he loved the record so much. And then you hear an outtake without the mistake. But he would pick the one with the "original mistake" in it! He just wanted it that way.

Ask Bruce Springsteen where he got the idea to do a song called "Pink Cadillac." As him "what did Elvis really bring to the table, anyway?" (I forget the exact way it was put about not bringing much to the table.)

That one there, pmp, got under my skin a bit. I'll fight for Elvis! (If he deserves it.) I mean, I fight like a mama bear. He made these choices, and sometimes he'd love a record to death, and you'd hear that, and other times, he'd go completely somewhere else, and you couldn't even hear the record at all. The outtakes give you a chance to hear the process, which is why they're invaluable.

Look at his pastiche that became "My Baby Left Me." Different pieces of Crudup, put together in a unique way. The way of the bluesman. Bluesmen - the older fellas, "copied," if you will, each other AS A RULE. It was a shared language, and you'll hear the same things, sometimes in the exact same way, in song after song. This ultra-moderne concept of continuously re-inventing the wheel didn't apply to some musicians with certain backgrounds.

rjm
P.S. -- Regarding Long Black Limo, I read the post about Smith's version while I was still FECC'ing on that little Kindle: I could NOT hear the song! Not 'till later. I thought it was an exact copy, and that it really sounded EXACTLY like Elvis. Well, then I got the tablet, and could hear it, and well, here's the link to the first of the two posts where I expressed what I thought: http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=62972&p=937032#p974384

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I wonder if Elvis has heard this 1968 version of Bambolina ( Any Day Now)by Mal dei Primitives.

Mal dei Primitives - BAMBOLINA (1968)
(Any day now)
(Panesis - Hilliard,B / Bacharach,B)

The backing was all about the Memphis Boys (and the production of Dan Penn). I think Chilton was the only member of the Box Tops who was even on the recording. It's impossible to say whether Elvis had heard the Box Tops recording or just wanted to do the song and then let the Memphis Boys loose on it. If the latter, hopefully Elvis was aware that they were pretty much reproducing what they had done the previous year. In any case, Elvis' vocal does take it to another level. He really lives the song. Tommy Cogbill's busy bass work is also a major highlight of both recordings.

Nailed it. It's a Memphis Boys recording, and Elvis generally did not arrange at these particular sessions. First of all, Chips' method of doing things in pieces, doing all these repairs, separating out the parts - all those things were not Elvis's customary way of recording. But they were the way of the studio.

Since it's the same musicians, same studio, same producer, same arranger, all he had to do was jump on in. He could have told them "no, no, no: you're doing it all wrong!" But they weren't doing it wrong. Why screw them up? At times, like on his jamming on certain songs, they'd get out of his way, and let him do what he wanted, and other times, he clearly got out of their way. The results speak for themselves.

If you heard the outtakes of this particular song, Elvis plays around with different lyrical approaches now and again (one major change, that didn't make it). And he brought his voice to the table, his excitement, his energy - but did he have a major say in the arranging of a song they had already done? I don't think so. This was a band that knew itself, and a also a hard-headed producer. (With a nod here to Dan Penn, of course, who also knew himself.) Still Elvis enjoyed himself, and in the outtakes, did much experimentation, within the limitations provided.

What did he bring to the table? Heard any other versions of "I'll Hold You In My Heart ("till I Can Hold You In My Arms)" that even come anywhere NEAR Elvis's version? The guy did hundreds of recordings, in every conceivable genre, and with many different production/arranging philosophies.

How can you listen to his Sun recordings, knowing how they came together, and say he didn't bring much to the table? Sam never suggested that blues, that Elvis had ALREADY worked out, to an extent, on the lawn of the Courts, with Johnny Black. Surprised the heck out of everybody!

What did he bring to, say, "Danny Boy"? Something no other singer I've ever heard. Maybe some people don't dig it, but I do, all versions, by the way. His versions of "Silent Night" and "Oh Little Town of Bethlehem" are so extraordinary, and so ELVIS - meaning, they're his, all the way, that when those women try to "duet" with him, I find it very irritating. (And I'm not very picky at Christmastime, but on those things, I want them to can it.)

If he liked something, he went with it, because he liked it so much. I think it was sometimes, not at American, but in some cases, of too much adoration of a recording. Sometimes, he'd copy an outright mistake on a cover, because he loved the record so much. And then you hear an outtake without the mistake. But he would pick the one with the "original mistake" in it! He just wanted it that way.

Ask Bruce Springsteen where he got the idea to do a song called "Pink Cadillac." As him "what did Elvis really bring to the table, anyway?" (I forget the exact way it was put about not bringing much to the table.)

That one there, pmp, got under my skin a bit. I'll fight for Elvis! (If he deserves it.) I mean, I fight like a mama bear. He made these choices, and sometimes he'd love a record to death, and you'd hear that, and other times, he'd go completely somewhere else, and you couldn't even hear the record at all. The outtakes give you a chance to hear the process, which is why they're invaluable.

Look at his pastiche that became "My Baby Left Me." Different pieces of Crudup, put together in a unique way. The way of the bluesman. Bluesmen - the older fellas, "copied," if you will, each other AS A RULE. It was a shared language, and you'll hear the same things, sometimes in the exact same way, in song after song. This ultra-moderne concept of continuously re-inventing the wheel didn't apply to some musicians with certain backgrounds.

rjm
P.S. -- Regarding Long Black Limo, I read the post about Smith's version while I was still FECC'ing on that little Kindle: I could NOT hear the song! Not 'till later. I thought it was an exact copy, and that it really sounded EXACTLY like Elvis. Well, then I got the tablet, and could hear it, and well, here's the link to the first of the two posts where I expressed what I thought: http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=62972&p=937032#p974384

Of course no-one can deny that Elvis did all those things you name, RJM, but with the wonders of youtube and access to more songs and music than we have ever had before we learn that what we thought were Elvis's arrangements (especially in the post-1950s era) are not. I'm Movin' On is an example of that (whether he knew it or not), and Tomorrow is a Long Time is another. The Doc posted the original version of Reach Out To Jesus a couple of months back and, again, exactly the same arrangement. Fools Rush In is exactly the same as Rick Nelson's. Of course there are some where Elvis did do all the work, but the numbers are considerably less than we first thought.

The backing was all about the Memphis Boys (and the production of Dan Penn). I think Chilton was the only member of the Box Tops who was even on the recording. It's impossible to say whether Elvis had heard the Box Tops recording or just wanted to do the song and then let the Memphis Boys loose on it. If the latter, hopefully Elvis was aware that they were pretty much reproducing what they had done the previous year. In any case, Elvis' vocal does take it to another level. He really lives the song. Tommy Cogbill's busy bass work is also a major highlight of both recordings.

Nailed it. It's a Memphis Boys recording, and Elvis generally did not arrange at these particular sessions. First of all, Chips' method of doing things in pieces, doing all these repairs, separating out the parts - all those things were not Elvis's customary way of recording. But they were the way of the studio.

Since it's the same musicians, same studio, same producer, same arranger, all he had to do was jump on in. He could have told them "no, no, no: you're doing it all wrong!" But they weren't doing it wrong. Why screw them up? At times, like on his jamming on certain songs, they'd get out of his way, and let him do what he wanted, and other times, he clearly got out of their way. The results speak for themselves.

If you heard the outtakes of this particular song, Elvis plays around with different lyrical approaches now and again (one major change, that didn't make it). And he brought his voice to the table, his excitement, his energy - but did he have a major say in the arranging of a song they had already done? I don't think so. This was a band that knew itself, and a also a hard-headed producer. (With a nod here to Dan Penn, of course, who also knew himself.) Still Elvis enjoyed himself, and in the outtakes, did much experimentation, within the limitations provided.

What did he bring to the table? Heard any other versions of "I'll Hold You In My Heart ("till I Can Hold You In My Arms)" that even come anywhere NEAR Elvis's version? The guy did hundreds of recordings, in every conceivable genre, and with many different production/arranging philosophies.

How can you listen to his Sun recordings, knowing how they came together, and say he didn't bring much to the table? Sam never suggested that blues, that Elvis had ALREADY worked out, to an extent, on the lawn of the Courts, with Johnny Black. Surprised the heck out of everybody!

What did he bring to, say, "Danny Boy"? Something no other singer I've ever heard. Maybe some people don't dig it, but I do, all versions, by the way. His versions of "Silent Night" and "Oh Little Town of Bethlehem" are so extraordinary, and so ELVIS - meaning, they're his, all the way, that when those women try to "duet" with him, I find it very irritating. (And I'm not very picky at Christmastime, but on those things, I want them to can it.)

If he liked something, he went with it, because he liked it so much. I think it was sometimes, not at American, but in some cases, of too much adoration of a recording. Sometimes, he'd copy an outright mistake on a cover, because he loved the record so much. And then you hear an outtake without the mistake. But he would pick the one with the "original mistake" in it! He just wanted it that way.

Ask Bruce Springsteen where he got the idea to do a song called "Pink Cadillac." As him "what did Elvis really bring to the table, anyway?" (I forget the exact way it was put about not bringing much to the table.)

That one there, pmp, got under my skin a bit. I'll fight for Elvis! (If he deserves it.) I mean, I fight like a mama bear. He made these choices, and sometimes he'd love a record to death, and you'd hear that, and other times, he'd go completely somewhere else, and you couldn't even hear the record at all. The outtakes give you a chance to hear the process, which is why they're invaluable.

Look at his pastiche that became "My Baby Left Me." Different pieces of Crudup, put together in a unique way. The way of the bluesman. Bluesmen - the older fellas, "copied," if you will, each other AS A RULE. It was a shared language, and you'll hear the same things, sometimes in the exact same way, in song after song. This ultra-moderne concept of continuously re-inventing the wheel didn't apply to some musicians with certain backgrounds.

rjm
P.S. -- Regarding Long Black Limo, I read the post about Smith's version while I was still FECC'ing on that little Kindle: I could NOT hear the song! Not 'till later. I thought it was an exact copy, and that it really sounded EXACTLY like Elvis. Well, then I got the tablet, and could hear it, and well, here's the link to the first of the two posts where I expressed what I thought: http://www.elvis-collectors.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=62972&p=937032#p974384

Great post, RJM!

What Elvis brought to this song was his marvelous vocal which has nothing to do with what Chilton laid down. Elvis' improvs at the end of the song are some of the best parts about it. Also his energy as group leader is evident as well pushing the song into a faster tempo and frankly the band plays with much more intensity on his version . As RJM states Elvis probably came up with the idea to do the Snow song and the Memphis boys fell right in with their arrangement.

More "thanks" button-hits! Really, thank you. (You too, pmp! {I can't call you "Pete" anymore, 'cause you have a real name on your blog, but I don't think you want it used here, so it's confusing!})

It's just that he had several personality traits that accounted for some of this: he was not just an artist, but a real FAN of certain music. He would just adore something, and I think he felt it wrong to mess with it, sometimes. It's a case-by-case basis. Sometimes it was the singers on the earlier record that he liked, or who were on his record. In this case, he didn't have all that much to say about it, unless he wanted to stop them. (Although if you throw it into Gold Wave, and try to abstract the vocal as much as you can, it does sound quite a bit different. Those horns (for which the singers were not present, I'm sure) are so dominant, and the picking, and the piano playing -- all pretty much the same on both tracks. But Elvis kicks it up into a higher gear, because he's moving at a faster clip, changing up lyrics, not pronouncing lyrics, so that kicked it up, too. But some of the licks, they just replicated.

As for Tomorrow, we had a misunderstanding about that, so I don't wanna go there! But on that recording, I would agree she was doing the "creating," and he was strictly interpreting that time. And he definitely made it more downbeat, more morose. I think he took the song to the place where Dylan originally wanted to go, in his mind. But it took until Odetta started messing with it, with a really good, adventurous band, to get the melody into a better place. I still stand that she sounded like she was having a good time with the song, BECAUSE of the creative process. Elvis just wanted to draw as much blood out of it as he could. He had her album, apparently loved it, so knowing some of how he thought, he wasn't going to stray very far from it. Except that he had a despairing feeling which he imparted to it.

It's a song-by-song basis thing. I mean, I think he was also a fan of Crudup, but he also saw Crudup mixing and matching lyrics, changing them at different times, and I guess he thought that was cool - in context. In other words, he might have had too much respect for other artists. (As I said "Writing For The King" is a necessary book, and in it, you'll see that he apologized to Johnny Tillotson for changing a lyric! Who else would do that? {Tillotson said he could change ALL the lyrics, for all he cared: the money was good! And he didn't need an apology. } )

Thanks again! (It's still okay to say it, I think, even with the button.)

Best,
rjm
P.S. -- thermoking: where's the "cool" button? For "Bambolina"? I like that! (He may or may not have heard it, but it has a definite "soul" sound. What Elvis did was so wonderfully economical, and yet desperate at the same time. A year later, he might gone all over the map with the emotion, but in early '69, he reigned himself in, and yet sounded so desperate, and finally hopeless. An amazing find there!)

Based on the demos I've heard, Elvis did this many times during his recording career. Always having the ability to make it his own, but none the less taking something from the demos he listened to. As pointed out by DJC last season, listen to the influence this 1954 Drifters recording of White Christmas had on Elvis' 1957 track.

Wow! I don't think I had ever heard this version before. I certainly see the influence it had on Elvis's version. I wonder if Irving Berlin had any comments about the Drifters version?

Based on the demos I've heard, Elvis did this many times during his recording career. Always having the ability to make it his own, but none the less taking something from the demos he listened to. As pointed out by DJC last season, listen to the influence this 1954 Drifters recording of White Christmas had on Elvis' 1957 track.

Wow! I don't think I had ever heard this version before. I certainly see the influence it had on Elvis's version. I wonder if Irving Berlin had any comments about the Drifters version?

It;s useful that was posted again. The vocal is certainly what Presley based his one. I now realise it was this version that was used on Glee this week - the vocal line was the same as Presley's but the backing I didn't recognise, but of course it was the Drifters version as I now realise it. Makes sense - which is more than the show did I might add. The writers were on acid. Or perhaps I'm getting old.