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Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:19 pm

WHO decided to record Elvis' very 1st appearance on the Hayride in october 1954? HOW was it recorded and WHY is it so much better quality than all the other recordings even tho it's the earliest? WHERE was the tape kept for over 30 years and HOW COME the bootleggers got to it first?
WHY weren't other shows recorded in this way?
WHY were other songs recorded onto acetate, WHO made the decision to record them at WHAT time and WHO ended up with these discs at the end of the broadcasts?
Did someone at The Hayride give instructions to record certain performances or were the ones we have recorded 'off air'?
NONE of this is made clear in "A boy from Tupelo" or any other publication to my knowledge.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 6:31 pm

OMG... that's 11 questions in one post!!! And I don't have the answer to a single one!!! :cry:

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:24 pm

Tony, there are more than one answer to many of these questions, but one answer sticks out in my mind about a few of the recordings. Some of these performances were recorded to give proof to the sponsors of the shows that their product was promoted. A well known sponsor was Lucky Strike cigarettes (you can see their advertising banner on stage above Elvis and band in some of the photos of the Hayride) and these sponsors requested proof their product was being advertised.

There is a rumor running that all Hayride shows were recorded, there are also rumors that Elvis's perormances were all recorded and filmed...some...if not all, in color.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:47 pm

Tim C wrote:
There is a rumor running that all Hayride shows were recorded, there are also rumors that Elvis's perormances were all recorded and filmed...some...if not all, in color.


That would be a dream come true. Can you imagine?

And that is an interesting theory about the advertising.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:25 pm

Answers in-line. Enjoy!

Tony.. wrote:WHO decided to record Elvis' very 1st appearance on the Hayride in october 1954?
The engineer running the audio at KWKH Radio.

HOW was it recorded and WHY is it so much better quality than all the other recordings even tho it's the earliest?
It was recorded on reel-to-reel tape, thus better quality than an acetate dub. Note the August 20, 1955 Hayride performance survives on tape, and is in the same quality.

WHERE was the tape kept for over 30 years and HOW COME the bootleggers got to it first?
The tape was kept for 24 years (first bootlegged on a 7" single in 1978) and probably in the KWKH archives, or at one of the radio stations that got a copy of the reel for rebroadcast. How did bootleggers get it first? They actually did not get it first, but they released it first.

WHY weren't other shows recorded in this way?
Tape is more expensive. The 10-16-1954 tape may have been for the hour that would be syndicated, it was not necessarily done to capture a teenaged guest singing his debut single.

WHY were other songs recorded onto acetate, WHO made the decision to record them at WHAT time and WHO ended up with these discs at the end of the broadcasts?
Acetate dubs were a quicker and cheaper way to save a performance for rebroadcast elsewhere. The decision was made by Hayride management at the time, and they knew which affiliated stations wanted or needed them. Again, these were not "Elvis acetates" but "Hayride show acetates."

Did someone at The Hayride give instructions to record certain performances or were the ones we have recorded 'off air'?
See above.

NONE of this is made clear in "A boy from Tupelo" or any other publication to my knowledge.
There may be a book on KWKH radio history, but A Boy From Tupelo was not created to detail radio broadcast minutiae.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:34 pm

An interesting interview with Joey Kent is on this site under "interview with. . ." Among many interesting things he said was:

"[A] local photographer named Glen Graham . . . loved country music and approached KWKH for permission to tape the shows on his Wollensock tape recorder. He was given permission to do so in exchange for making his professional services available to Hayride artists as an unofficial staff photographer of sorts. Mr. Graham taped the show many Saturday nights from the start back in 1948 but his studio was broken into in 1960 and most of the tapes were stolen at that time along with photo equipment, never to be seen or heard of again. Fortunately, Graham had run out of storage room for the tapes at his office and, beginning in the late fifties, began storing tapes at his residence. Those tapes, over 40 reels, survive today and comprise over 1500 of the 2200+ tracks I have in the Hayride archives. Artist performances by Johnny Cash, Roy Acuff, George Jones, Johnny Horton, Bob Luman, Jimmy Davis, Tex Ritter and countless others were preserved in this way."

MT

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:19 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:Answers in-line. Enjoy!

Tony.. wrote:WHO decided to record Elvis' very 1st appearance on the Hayride in october 1954?
The engineer running the audio at KWKH Radio.

HOW was it recorded and WHY is it so much better quality than all the other recordings even tho it's the earliest?
It was recorded on reel-to-reel tape, thus better quality than an acetate dub. Note the August 20, 1955 Hayride performance survives on tape, and is in the same quality.

WHERE was the tape kept for over 30 years and HOW COME the bootleggers got to it first?
The tape was kept for 24 years (first bootlegged on a 7" single in 1978) and probably in the KWKH archives, or at one of the radio stations that got a copy of the reel for rebroadcast. How did bootleggers get it first? They actually did not get it first, but they released it first.

WHY weren't other shows recorded in this way?
Tape is more expensive. The 10-16-1954 tape may have been for the hour that would be syndicated, it was not necessarily done to capture a teenaged guest singing his debut single.

WHY were other songs recorded onto acetate, WHO made the decision to record them at WHAT time and WHO ended up with these discs at the end of the broadcasts?
Acetate dubs were a quicker and cheaper way to save a performance for rebroadcast elsewhere. The decision was made by Hayride management at the time, and they knew which affiliated stations wanted or needed them. Again, these were not "Elvis acetates" but "Hayride show acetates."

Did someone at The Hayride give instructions to record certain performances or were the ones we have recorded 'off air'?
See above.

NONE of this is made clear in "A boy from Tupelo" or any other publication to my knowledge.
There may be a book on KWKH radio history, but A Boy From Tupelo was not created to detail radio broadcast minutiae.



As far as question number five goes, I have another theory.

If they were just "hayride" acetates, then why do many of the acetates that were preserved of Elvis' songs,
only include Elvis and not other performers.
Just looking at the discs and handwritten labels, they make the notation to say, "Elvis Presley".

I would not think it to be out of the question that some of his performances were preserved because he was really
making waves in the industry and someone took upon themselves to preserve this young upstart.

When Wink Martindale decided to preserve Elvis' tv appearance on Dance Party, that was precisely the
reasoning he had.
He didn't make kinoscopes of every show he did, but he wanted to preserve Elvis' appearance
for future reference because he thought Elvis was going to be really big in the entertainment industry.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:36 am

I love that Wink Martindale footage. Elvis just radiated 1950's cool in that little interview. He was polite but had that Elvis attitude, humor, and nonchalance.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:02 am

stevelecher wrote:I love that Wink Martindale footage. Elvis just radiated 1950's cool in that little interview. He was polite but had that Elvis attitude, humor, and nonchalance.

So far I've only seen bits and pieces of that appearance. Where can I find it in its more complete form?

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:38 am

JimmyCool wrote:
stevelecher wrote:I love that Wink Martindale footage. Elvis just radiated 1950's cool in that little interview. He was polite but had that Elvis attitude, humor, and nonchalance.

So far I've only seen bits and pieces of that appearance. Where can I find it in its more complete form?


Martindale claimed in an interview it was not returned when loaned out.
So, someone stole it. The audio exists in full form though.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:52 am

very interesting topic, I love the Hayride recordings!!

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:05 am

MysteryTrain wrote:An interesting interview with Joey Kent is on this site under "interview with. . ." Among many interesting things he said was:

"[A] local photographer named Glen Graham . . . loved country music and approached KWKH for permission to tape the shows on his Wollensock tape recorder. He was given permission to do so in exchange for making his professional services available to Hayride artists as an unofficial staff photographer of sorts. Mr. Graham taped the show many Saturday nights from the start back in 1948 but his studio was broken into in 1960 and most of the tapes were stolen at that time along with photo equipment, never to be seen or heard of again. Fortunately, Graham had run out of storage room for the tapes at his office and, beginning in the late fifties, began storing tapes at his residence. Those tapes, over 40 reels, survive today and comprise over 1500 of the 2200+ tracks I have in the Hayride archives. Artist performances by Johnny Cash, Roy Acuff, George Jones, Johnny Horton, Bob Luman, Jimmy Davis, Tex Ritter and countless others were preserved in this way."

His statement does not ring true.

1 song = ~ 3 minutes
1500 songs = ~ 4,500 minutes
~ 4,500 minutes = ~ 40 reels

~ 112 minutes per reel? No way.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:52 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:Answers in-line. Enjoy!

Tony.. wrote:WHO decided to record Elvis' very 1st appearance on the Hayride in october 1954?
The engineer running the audio at KWKH Radio.

HOW was it recorded and WHY is it so much better quality than all the other recordings even tho it's the earliest?
It was recorded on reel-to-reel tape, thus better quality than an acetate dub. Note the August 20, 1955 Hayride performance survives on tape, and is in the same quality.

WHERE was the tape kept for over 30 years and HOW COME the bootleggers got to it first?
The tape was kept for 24 years (first bootlegged on a 7" single in 1978) and probably in the KWKH archives, or at one of the radio stations that got a copy of the reel for rebroadcast. How did bootleggers get it first? They actually did not get it first, but they released it first.

WHY weren't other shows recorded in this way?
Tape is more expensive. The 10-16-1954 tape may have been for the hour that would be syndicated, it was not necessarily done to capture a teenaged guest singing his debut single.

WHY were other songs recorded onto acetate, WHO made the decision to record them at WHAT time and WHO ended up with these discs at the end of the broadcasts?
Acetate dubs were a quicker and cheaper way to save a performance for rebroadcast elsewhere. The decision was made by Hayride management at the time, and they knew which affiliated stations wanted or needed them. Again, these were not "Elvis acetates" but "Hayride show acetates."

Did someone at The Hayride give instructions to record certain performances or were the ones we have recorded 'off air'?
See above.

NONE of this is made clear in "A boy from Tupelo" or any other publication to my knowledge.
There may be a book on KWKH radio history, but A Boy From Tupelo was not created to detail radio broadcast minutiae.


Doc you just answered 7 Topics of questions with all those HOW's, WHY's, and WHO's. You deserve a few extra "THANK YOU's" from Tony. :wink:

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:40 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:His statement does not ring true.

1 song = ~ 3 minutes
1500 songs = ~ 4,500 minutes
~ 4,500 minutes = ~ 40 reels

~ 112 minutes per reel? No way.


If the Hayride had 1,500 songs in its archive by this time there would have been numerous good quality releases by those artists. It makes a nice story though, albeit one, as you point out, with some holes in it.

MT

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:18 pm

JimmyCool wrote:
stevelecher wrote:I love that Wink Martindale footage. Elvis just radiated 1950's cool in that little interview. He was polite but had that Elvis attitude, humor, and nonchalance.

So far I've only seen bits and pieces of that appearance. Where can I find it in its more complete form?


Nowhere. As per usual, we only get to see bits and pieces scattered about here and there. The audio does exist on a CD which includes a very over the top, almost embarassing appearance by Dewey Phillips.

Re: Hayride recordings - Unanswered mysteries and questions.

Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:23 pm

promiseland wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:Answers in-line. Enjoy!

Tony.. wrote:WHO decided to record Elvis' very 1st appearance on the Hayride in october 1954?
The engineer running the audio at KWKH Radio.

HOW was it recorded and WHY is it so much better quality than all the other recordings even tho it's the earliest?
It was recorded on reel-to-reel tape, thus better quality than an acetate dub. Note the August 20, 1955 Hayride performance survives on tape, and is in the same quality.

WHERE was the tape kept for over 30 years and HOW COME the bootleggers got to it first?
The tape was kept for 24 years (first bootlegged on a 7" single in 1978) and probably in the KWKH archives, or at one of the radio stations that got a copy of the reel for rebroadcast. How did bootleggers get it first? They actually did not get it first, but they released it first.

WHY weren't other shows recorded in this way?
Tape is more expensive. The 10-16-1954 tape may have been for the hour that would be syndicated, it was not necessarily done to capture a teenaged guest singing his debut single.

WHY were other songs recorded onto acetate, WHO made the decision to record them at WHAT time and WHO ended up with these discs at the end of the broadcasts?
Acetate dubs were a quicker and cheaper way to save a performance for rebroadcast elsewhere. The decision was made by Hayride management at the time, and they knew which affiliated stations wanted or needed them. Again, these were not "Elvis acetates" but "Hayride show acetates."

Did someone at The Hayride give instructions to record certain performances or were the ones we have recorded 'off air'?
See above.

NONE of this is made clear in "A boy from Tupelo" or any other publication to my knowledge.
There may be a book on KWKH radio history, but A Boy From Tupelo was not created to detail radio broadcast minutiae.


Doc you just answered 7 Topics of questions with all those HOW's, WHY's, and WHO's. You deserve a few extra "THANK YOU's" from Tony. :wink:

It appears Tony dot-dot has not gotten around to reading them yet... ;-)