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Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:28 am

EP
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Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:29 am

EP
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Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:15 am

I've got the Prince set and love the remix. How's the sound on the regular Legacy edition Barry? I'm about to get it since I didn't go for the CM set.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:18 am

bajo wrote:I've got the Prince set and love the remix. How's the sound on the regular Legacy edition Barry? I'm about to get it since I didn't go for the CM set.

In my opinion the sound is great.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:42 am

I was really disappointed in the remix. Felt like i waited 40years for this. On the evening show the second side of what was the old LP sounded so much better than the first in this remix which seemed odd. Sound is very muffled to me. The complete masters mix struck me as superior which surprised me. Didn't notice any new dialogue of consequence-a few grunts here and there. Video was great except having to hear my wife complain with every fade to black. Hell who expected that quality video would ever surface. Worth the price alone.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:01 am

fn2drive wrote:I was really disappointed in the remix. Felt like i waited 40years for this. On the evening show the second side of what was the old LP sounded so much better than the first in this remix which seemed odd. Sound is very muffled to me. The complete masters mix struck me as superior which surprised me. Didn't notice any new dialogue of consequence-a few grunts here and there. Video was great except having to hear my wife complain with every fade to black. Hell who expected that quality video would ever surface. Worth the price alone.

Brings back great memories, Elvis looked great, man I was 29 years old.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:30 pm

fn2drive wrote:I was really disappointed in the remix. Felt like i waited 40years for this. On the evening show the second side of what was the old LP sounded so much better than the first in this remix which seemed odd. Sound is very muffled to me. The complete masters mix struck me as superior which surprised me. Didn't notice any new dialogue of consequence-a few grunts here and there. Video was great except having to hear my wife complain with every fade to black. Hell who expected that quality video would ever surface. Worth the price alone.

Could you post what speakers and sound system you are using?

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:10 pm

promiseland wrote:
fn2drive wrote:I was really disappointed in the remix.....Sound is very muffled to me

Could you post what speakers and sound system you are using?

In the meantime perhaps I can oblige as my conclusions are identical.

Harman Kardon HK6300 Amp
Harman Kardon HD7600 II CD Player
Kef Concorde III Speakers

Another poster (on the Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant thread) wrote that the end result sounded like the work of an amateur. In my view he has a fair point. Perhaps it will excite the ipod generation, but hi-fi it most certainly isn't.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:29 pm

Mike S wrote:
promiseland wrote:
fn2drive wrote:I was really disappointed in the remix.....Sound is very muffled to me

Could you post what speakers and sound system you are using?

Another poster (on the Prince From Another Planet - Brilliant thread) wrote that the end result sounded like the work of an amateur. In my view he has a fair point. Perhaps it will excite the ipod generation, but hi-fi it most certainly isn't.


Mike, do you appreciate the vocals at all which are much clearer? To me Brauer has done an excellent job on them. Elvis sounds sublime which wasn't always clear on the originals. Likewise JB's guitar on the afternoon show stands out much better - Never Been To Spain showcases this combination perfectly. It certainly isn't an audiophile recording but when have you ever heard great hi fi at an actual concert? Having first watched the documentary and press conference which captures the scale of the event and the buzz in New York for Elvis appearing there. I think Brauer took that vibe and captured the raw excitement and energy really well. It transports you back to that magical day imo.

We have plenty of dry studio like recordings from Vegas to keep us happy from an audiophile point of view so I'm quite happy to have a different presentation to this release. Although the soundstage is quite narrow and the noise full on, Elvis is still clear as a bell and that's what counts surely? I think to rate Brauer as worse than an amateur is ridiculous just because you dont like the way he has chosen to present the music. He has a very good reputation in the music business which was why he was chosen and I am sure he has applied himself to this with the same rigour he would any other project. Sony hasn't skimped on this release and I am grateful that they still see fit to invest in a package of this nature. A great DVD with some rare and fantastic footage, 2 cd's mixed by a contemporary producer and a wonderful booklet. I am more than happy with this release.

cheers Jamie (Rotel pre/power amp, Audiolab 8200CD/DAC, Quad 22l speakers).

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:37 pm

I bought the deluxe editon of this set and was very happy that I got it on date of release - Its been a while since we have had some thing great like this - It was worth waitn for -
may be since we have this we can soon expect EOT as a deluxe edition -
I hope we dont have to wait another 20 yrs before this one is out -lets all keep our fingers crossed and pray for its release -

As for -PFAP - I just lov it - The Lp version of MSG way back in 70s - was speeded up by Colonel who wanted to exceed Record sales at the time - I am told by various sources -
Lets all enjoy this new release and put Elvis back in sales charts at Number 1 where he belongs - AMEN -

::rocks
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Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:54 pm

For me I feel like I am at the concerts. I like the sound, not muffled, but everyone has to say decide for themselves.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:14 am

promiseland wrote:Could you post what speakers and sound system you are using?



Marantz PM 8004 Amplifier
Wharfedale 10.2 Diamond Series Speakers
Marantz CD 6004 CD Player


Both shows sound good to me on the PFAP release, although I am tempted to also buy the Legacy 2 CD release.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:56 am

I am going to take the plunge (they sure know how we think and also get the Legacy) if not the vinyl as well.

It's nice to have options!

I think it captures the excitement of a big ticket New York event and yes, as someone said somewhere on FECC, it's as if the band is crowded into yoru living room.

I don't think this was meant as a compliment but to my ears I felt like I was at the show.

Normally, I keep the volume down but I was so into it, I cranked it, wife, kids and neighbors not withstanding. :

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:42 am

Jamie wrote:Mike, do you appreciate the vocals at all which are much clearer?

Which release of this material are you comparing it to?

My go-to releases covering this material are: Operation Big Apple CD1 and the Madison Sq. Gdn. 24 bit papersleeve which both sound pretty damn good on my hi-fi set up. These recordings do lack the ambiance of the event admittedly but the instrumentation and Elvis' vocals sound great.

Jamie wrote:It certainly isn't an audiophile recording but when have you ever heard great hi fi at an actual concert?

At a concert, you have the distraction of visuals in particular, as well as the excitement of participating in a communal experience where something is happening in real time right before your eyes, therefore hi fi sound is not a priority. You would not want to replicate that exact sound in your living room though or you will end up with a headache soon enough.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:57 am

I've played it on 2 systems def techs marantz combo and sunfire/mk's. Very muddy on both and almost nothing is ever muddy on the mk's.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:20 am

I have the Japanese version and TCM version. I have never had an issue with the clarity around the core band on these releases. But it sounds like you are miles away from the stage and Elvis voice sounds thin and strained. On the new release it has a full sound, it captures his tone better and I hear things I didn't before. I don't mean new words but slight phrasing changes or emotion in his voice. Never been to Spain is a great example of this.

I think we agree that live events don't sound like hifi. I was happy to get a more live version when compared to the distant presentation in the original and it's variations. I might not have been as happy if his vocals didn't sound so dam good.


Cheers Jamie

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:20 am

Jamie fair enough you can hear Elvis voice better, but he isn't the only person on the stage. I like to hear everything on the stage and this release does more to shut down the sound of band members than it does to give them a fair hearing. Why should any instruments and vocals be muted just to make Elvis' voice clearer when all you have to do is bring his voice up in the mix.

Last time I remember, I didn't need to have things muted in a real concert to feel as if I were 4 rows away, and muting or reducing levels of some in the mix to highlight others could have been done with l much less aggression. As I said in the other thread if he wanted to make it feel as if one were in the 4th row experiencing the concert as if you were there feeling the music as well as hearing it, all he had to do was use the Afternoon mix, add subharmonics, and increase the level and attack of Tutts bass drum and it would have sounded one helluva lot better than this. But this imo was a cheap gimmick bordering on disastrous, and after waiting since 1972 for a better mix on the evening show!!! Inexcusable...Period. What a disappointment this is. Sometimes I wonder if these guys listen to what they put out prior to it's release. It smacks of the over hype they used on the terrible echo ridden Alternate Aloha release. Speaking of which, I hope they keep the person who "remastered" these two shows well clear of the upcoming Legacy release of the Hawaii shows.

Were it not for the unreleased video on this release, I would have returned this and asked for my money back. Sorry for being so harsh, but I think after all the hype of this release dies down, those of us who have been critical of this release will be proven correct as people will start to look at this release objectively, they will study it and come to the unbiased conclusion that certain areas sound flat/muffled and that this is an inferior product. They could have set history with this set. It could have been a benchmark release, a masterpiece, but they blew it. In the end it will be noteworthy for having the footage, good artwork, but clearly noted for going in the opposite direction of an audiophile release. In the end, it would almost have sounded better if they made it a mono track and used the old electronically reprocessed stereo on it!!!

How many more decades will we have to wait to actually get a decent remix of the Evening show now!!! What a pisser.

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:36 pm

Barry, don't get me wrong, but do you really have to have a separate thread for every new Elvis CD you've added to your collection? Perhaps one regularly updated topic (let's call it "New at Barry's") would be a better way to showcase your evergrowing collection? Think about it...

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:49 pm

hm80ep wrote:Barry, don't get me wrong, but do you really have to have a separate thread for every new Elvis CD you've added to your collection? Perhaps one regularly updated topic (let's call it "New at Barry's") would be a better way to showcase your evergrowing collection? Think about it...

His Topic make me Barry Happy! :D

Re: Elvis PFAP--MSG

Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:26 pm

Tim C wrote:Jamie fair enough you can hear Elvis voice better, but he isn't the only person on the stage. I like to hear everything on the stage and this release does more to shut down the sound of band members than it does to give them a fair hearing. Why should any instruments and vocals be muted just to make Elvis' voice clearer when all you have to do is bring his voice up in the mix.

Excellent point.

Tim C wrote:Last time I remember, I didn't need to have things muted in a real concert to feel as if I were 4 rows away,.....But this imo was a cheap gimmick bordering on disastrous, and after waiting since 1972 for a better mix on the evening show!!! Inexcusable...Period. What a disappointment this is. It smacks of the over hype they used on the terrible echo ridden Alternate Aloha release. Speaking of which, I hope they keep the person who "remastered" these two shows well clear of the upcoming Legacy release of the Hawaii shows.

Me too, which is why it is important to speak out now, in case the powers that be mistakenly assume everyone is happy with this shoddy approach.

Tim C wrote:Were it not for the unreleased video on this release, I would have returned this and asked for my money back. Sorry for being so harsh, but I think after all the hype of this release dies down, those of us who have been critical of this release will be proven correct as people will start to look at this release objectively, they will study it and come to the unbiased conclusion that certain areas sound flat/muffled and that this is an inferior product.

Agreed.

Whilst it is always great to have unreleased material, equal consideration should always be given to create a quality product. Unfortunately this release does not fit into that category. The cheap card inlay with its ill fitting space to house the discs unwittingly provides a major clue regarding the level of care and attention that has gone into the presentation of this set. What a shame.