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Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:23 pm

GuitarKing wrote:I will quote Sonny West's book,"In late January, he opened his eighth Las Vegas engagement at the Hilton. It was around then that some reviewers noted that his energy level was low an that his shows lacked zip. But there was a personal high for Elvis not long after that, when he met boxing great Muhammad ali. Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283.

Thanks for that quote from Sonny West.
Fascinating.

::rocks

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:25 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:We're done here!

That's a shame. Take care.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:45 pm

GuitarKing wrote:I will quote Sonny West's book,"In late January, he opened his eighth Las Vegas engagement at the Hilton. It was around then that some reviewers noted that his energy level was low an that his shows lacked zip. But there was a personal high for Elvis not long after that, when he met boxing great Muhammad ali. Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283
Sonny's memory may be a little fuzzy, but i tend to believe he wouldn't mess that up. But to those who say its probably not so i can understand you case for no pics or recordings of this...Or reviews mentioning Ali in the audience. You would think it would show by now. But, Sonny says he saw him perform. I just hope he gave him a good performance...



Thanks Guitar King, interesting information.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:01 pm

Joe Car wrote:I'll say this, in 1973, Elvis and Ali ,were the two most famous people in the world. Had Ali attended Elvis' show, it would have been a big deal in my opinion. Not saying it didn't happen, but leaning towards no.

Am I right in thinking you have never been asked to be a juror in a court of law ?

The evidence Ali saw Elvis perform live in Las Vegas on the evening of February 1, 1973 is now even more overwhelming - you may want to lean the other way now.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:05 pm

elvisalisellers wrote:
GuitarKing wrote:I will quote Sonny West's book,"In late January, he opened his eighth Las Vegas engagement at the Hilton. It was around then that some reviewers noted that his energy level was low an that his shows lacked zip. But there was a personal high for Elvis not long after that, when he met boxing great Muhammad ali. Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283.

Thanks for that quote from Sonny West.
Fascinating.

::rocks


But there is a problem with this. Sonny West has the same initials as Stuart Whitman, meaning we have to ignore his evidence as it simply is not good enough. ;)

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:01 pm

Joe Car wrote:I'll say this, in 1973, Elvis and Ali ,were the two most famous people in the world. Had Ali attended Elvis' show, it would have been a big deal in my opinion. Not saying it didn't happen, but leaning towards no.
so do i. there seems to be not enough evidence to assume otherwise.


GuitarKing wrote:I will quote Sonny West's book, ... "Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283 ... Sonny says he saw him perform. I just hope he gave him a good performance...
no, sonny does not. he just wrote, that "he (ali) came to see elvis perform at the hilton". he does not state, ali did (in the end).
that does make a difference to me.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:10 pm

Christopher wrote:

GuitarKing wrote:I will quote Sonny West's book, ... "Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283 ... Sonny says he saw him perform. I just hope he gave him a good performance...
no, sonny does not. he just wrote, that "he (ali) came to see elvis perform at the hilton". he does not state, ali did (in the end).
that does make a difference to me.

Man, with respect, you are clutching at straws now.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:31 pm

elvisalisellers wrote:Man, with respect, you are clutching at straws now.
just stating the obvious, buddy.
i don´t know, if ali ever visited an elvis concert. neither do you.
don´t be no fool, cato! :wink:

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:34 pm

You would have thought that Elvis would have introduced him to the audience.

Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:11 pm

He introduced Bill Cosby once, and he wasn't even there.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:10 am

GuitarKing wrote:But there was a personal high for Elvis not long after that, when he met boxing great Muhammad ali. Ali came to town to fight British champion Joe Bugner on February 14. He was staying and training at the Caesars Palace, but he came to see Elvis perform at the Hilton."-Sonny,p.283
Sonny's memory may be a little fuzzy ...

Yes, maybe just a smidge.

How amazing is it that the most popular athlete in the world, Muhammad Ali, went to see the #1 draw on the Las Vegas trip, mere days before a major heavyweight fight in the same city, and not a single newspaper, magazine, tip sheet, biography, photo journal, diary, photo, videotape or audio tape captured this moment, then or now?

I'd say overwhelmingly amazing.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sat Oct 01, 2011 3:11 am

elvisalisellers wrote:Training for an up coming fight [2 weeks away] would not preclude Ali from catching his childhood hero's 8:15pm show that same day.

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Ali sounds pretty darn busy to be attending a dinner or midnight show on February 1, 1973.

There was no midnight show on February 1, 1973.

Quote:
"This Vegas season proved to be very professional and well performed for the most part. But soon into it, on February 1, Priscilla and Lisa Marie arrived for Lisa's fifth birthday celebrations. It had been just twenty-three days short of Elvis and Priscilla's first anniversary as a separated couple. Photographs from this day exist showing Elvis wearing one of his navy blue flying suits and his lion's claw necklace. In the photos, a healthy looking Elvis poses for "happy" family snaps with Priscilla, Lisa, and Vernon. There is a better known photograph from this day of Elvis standing with boxer Muhammad Ali".

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j& ... D5hTE0vORQ

::rocks

Well, this story starts out with one fact that may be in question: "This Vegas season proved to be very professional and well performed for the most part." I prefer the 1976 Season to this one. This season finds Elvis very bored and lackluster.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sat Oct 01, 2011 5:18 pm

He's a little tinker is Sonny West in making up stories of Muhammad Ali coming to see Elvis perform live at the Hilton.
Someone needs to have a word with him. It's not on.

::rocks

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:20 pm

stevelecher wrote: I prefer the 1976 Season to this one. This season finds Elvis very bored and lackluster.


I second this..perhaps this season showcases the most bored Elvis of all of them..towards the end of this stand..the shows became better, though....

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 1:18 am

elvisalisellers wrote:He's a little tinker is Sonny West in making up stories of Muhammad Ali coming to see Elvis perform live at the Hilton.

It's clear while in Las Vegas for his fight, Ali came to see Elvis. We have at least three known photos to underscore that Sonny is correct. What we have no evidence of is Ali attending a performance.

Facts: they are irrefutable. I love them. I wish you did.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 3:04 am

In Muhammad Ali: His Life and Times [1991], the definitive oral-history biography by Thomas Hauser, there is a revealing quotation from the champ, who says,

All my life I admired Elvis Presley. When I was in Las Vegas, I heard him sing, and it was a thrill to meet him.... But I felt sorry for Elvis, because he didn't enjoy life the way he should. He stayed indoors all the time. I told him he should go out and see people. He said he couldn't, because everywhere he went, they mobbed him. He didn't understand. No one wanted to hurt him. All they wanted was to be friendly, and tell him how much they loved him.

::rocks

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 8:49 am

elvisalisellers wrote:In Muhammad Ali: His Life and Times [1991], the definitive oral-history biography by Thomas Hauser, there is a revealing quotation from the champ, who says,

All my life I admired Elvis Presley. When I was in Las Vegas, I heard him sing, and it was a thrill to meet him.... But I felt sorry for Elvis, because he didn't enjoy life the way he should. He stayed indoors all the time. I told him he should go out and see people. He said he couldn't, because everywhere he went, they mobbed him. He didn't understand. No one wanted to hurt him. All they wanted was to be friendly, and tell him how much they loved him.

::rocks

Now you're getting somewhere, with a nice touch of research. However, that quote could easily be applied to his visit with Elvis, not attendance at a show. It is a fact that Presley often sang in his suite, and it would play well into the known facts and your "revealing quotation." Let's revisit them, shall we?

Elvis Presley and Muhammad Ali, 1973: Known Facts
- Presley opened at the Hilton in Las Vegas on 1-26-1973 (Fri).
- Lisa Marie turned five on 2-01-1973 (Thu).
- Ali was scheduled to fight British-Australian heavyweight Joe Bugner at the Las Vegas Convention Center on 2-14-1973 (Wed).
- Ali has never stated he saw Elvis in concert.
- There is no known audience tape where Elvis introduces Ali to the crowd.
- Ali worked out on 2-01-1973 and held a press conference afterwards.
- Ali had not one but two sparring bouts scheduled for the next day (2-02-1973).
- We have at least three known photos to underscore that Ali came to see Elvis.

What we have no evidence of is Ali attending a performance.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 1:02 pm

Which would you say was the more likely occurrence ?

1. On the date of his daughters 5th birthday Elvis put on an informal performance in his suite for Ali.

or....

2. Ali saw Elvis live in performance at the Hilton Hotel and visited with him backstage.

Whilst mulling it over please keep in mind this brilliant quote:

"You need to understand that some things are a matter of opinion; others are not. Education helps you distinguish between the two. That's not complicated."

::rocks

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:22 pm

Interesting that I have laid out almost a dozen facts, across two pages, and you have avoided them.

Most will assume it is because if you do address them, your argument is demolished.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:10 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:Interesting that I have laid out almost a dozen inconsequential facts....

It appears you made an error in your last post, so to save you the trouble, I filled in the missing blank.

Feel free to marvel at my decisive and detailed investigation, in order to establish the facts, and reach a definitive conclusion.

It's been fun. Adios.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:04 am

Doc you're like a lawyer who never gives up.
Elvisalisellers has produced two pieces of written evidence that indicates Ali did indeed see Elvis sing in Vegas. It's not that big a deal.
You're still showing signs of Icanneverbewrongamitis...maybe seek some professional help to bring you down to earth. It would make our our time on this board much more enjoyable.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Mon Oct 03, 2011 4:08 am

Doesn't calling someone a moron come under the heading of "personal attack?" I thought they were banned?

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:25 am

maybe IF? a recording from an previously unreleased show from Las Vegas 1st Feb Dinner Show 1973 might clear up the doubt IF? Ali was introduced AUDABLY by Elvis??? :roll: :wink: :lol:

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:30 am

poormadpeter wrote:Doesn't calling someone a moron come under the heading of "personal attack?" I thought they were banned?

Not this time poopandpeter.

Re: Ali at an Elvis show,1973

Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:47 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:
elvisalisellers wrote:It's been fun. Adios.

Sorry to see you admit defeat, but facts are irrefutable.

It would be fantastic to see and or hear Muhammad Ali in the Hilton Showroom back in 1973, rockin' out to "Until It's Time For You To Go" or "Sweet Caroline," but all the credible evidence indicates this is not so. Calling these facts "inconsequential" or simply being a moron does not change reality.

Perhaps someday a photograph or a tape recording will turn the story around, but until then, the facts I have presented over and over again must rule the day. Sorry!

::rocks

When did life become so complicated for you ? Take extra care.

PS. I'm off on vacation to California [the city of Berkeley] this week, so I may not be able to respond immediately to any future posts.