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Re: Painful viewing

Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:46 pm

midnightx wrote:
stevelecher wrote:For the record, one more time, he may have been unwell in June 1977 but he wasn't dying. If he had gone for treatment after these shows he may have lived for many years to come. He was killing himself, not dying. There is a difference.

You are correct Steve. However, there are some fans that want to believe Elvis was a seriously sick man in 1977 and that the drug abuse was secondary, and happening because Elvis needed treatment. The reality is that the vast majority of Elvis' health problems stemmed from the drug use - not the other way around. Yes, technically Elvis was "sick" -- and that was because he was a drug addict.


perhaps I didn't make the above clear in my post which said that he was dying, but I agree with this - although I think to say he wasn't "dying" in June 1977 would be incorrect. Or, to put it another way, anyone seeing Elvis at that point would have known that disaster would strike if something wasn't done to help him fast. He may not have been dying in the terminal illness sense, but it all amounts to pretty much the same thing, albeit at his own hands.

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:42 pm

poormadpeter wrote:He may not have been dying in the terminal illness sense, but it all amounts to pretty much the same thing, albeit at his own hands.

Thus my statement, he wasn't dying, he was killing himself. We do agree.

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:18 pm

Maybe a silly question: what if the CBS filmed the Indianapolis 26 June show? I bet that a lot of critics would praised Elvis for that live performance (the best of the tour). Regarding drugs: like Red and Sonny wrote in EWH: tke real problem started in 1972-1973 when Elvis began himself to use syringes to inject Demerol and also use the strongest painkiller ever-the Dilaudid. That became very dangereous.

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:39 pm

jurasic1968 wrote:Maybe a silly question: what if the CBS filmed the Indianapolis 26 June show? I bet that a lot of critics would praised Elvis for that live performance (the best of the tour).


The best of that tour would still, frankly, have been an embarassment for most self-respecting artists. Yes, he was in better form, but he wasn't on good form, only good form for 1977, which isn't saying much. When comparing this to all of the professionally recorded concerts that we have had, this would still be by far the weakest and least professional.

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:07 pm

This has been discussed hundreds of times before. And I will keep it short. If they put the EIC together the right way it certainly would be a very good release. Why? Because the image people around the world have of Elvis the last years is so bad already; many don't even think he could sing - and that his weight was 200 kilo's. And Elvis did sing several great versions; Hurt, Unchained Melody, How Great Thou Art, I Really Don't Wanna Know, My Way, It's Now or Never, Trying to Get to You etc...I'll bet a properly released version of these songs in 5.1 DTS audio would impress most people.

There is nothing to hide anymore, everybody knows what happened to Elvis. But give the man some credit - he still could sing.
A great EIC release should not try to show Elvis in great shape; it should show his downfall in many ways, people love stories like that, but it should also show that he still, under such tragic circumstances, was a great singer.

Thank you and Merry Christmas!

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:17 pm

Xaykev wrote:This has been discussed hundreds of times before. And I will keep it short. If they put the EIC together the right way it certainly would be a very good release. Why? Because the image people around the world have of Elvis the last years is so bad already; many don't even think he could sing - and that his weight was 200 kilo's. And Elvis did sing several great versions; Hurt, Unchained Melody, How Great Thou Art, I Really Don't Wanna Know, My Way, It's Now or Never, Trying to Get to You etc...I'll bet a properly released version of these songs in 5.1 DTS audio would impress most people.

There is nothing to hide anymore, everybody knows what happened to Elvis. But give the man some credit - he still could sing.
A great EIC release should not try to show Elvis in great shape; it should show his downfall in many ways, people love stories like that, but it should also show that he still, under such tragic circumstances, was a great singer.

Thank you and Merry Christmas!


i think the bad setlist contributed to what image people had, i mean most of the special was made out of Teddy Bear-Dont Be Cruel, Hound Dog etc. They showed mostly the worst songs of those concerts while this would be a better setlist

2001 Theme/See See Rider (With the fun mistake, rapid city)
I Got A Woman/Amen (As on the album version, edited to 1 divebomb).
That's Allright Mama
Are You Lonesome Tonight
Trying To Get To You
You Gave Me A Mountain
O Sole Mio-It's Now Or Never
Teddy Bear-Don't Be Cruel (From rapid city, which is a bit better then omaha)
The Hawaiian Wedding Song
Fairytale
And I Love You So
Jailhouse Rock (Omaha, which doesnt include elvis mixing up the lyrics, Could be edited together with rapid city)
How Great Thou Art
If You Love Me (Let Me Know)
Little Sister
Unchained Melody
My Way
Can't Help Falling In Love

This would clock around the 50 minutes in total, and showcase more of elvis from those 2 days then the original cbs special

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:34 pm

Love the set list
Johnny2523 wrote:
Xaykev wrote:This has been discussed hundreds of times before. And I will keep it short. If they put the EIC together the right way it certainly would be a very good release. Why? Because the image people around the world have of Elvis the last years is so bad already; many don't even think he could sing - and that his weight was 200 kilo's. And Elvis did sing several great versions; Hurt, Unchained Melody, How Great Thou Art, I Really Don't Wanna Know, My Way, It's Now or Never, Trying to Get to You etc...I'll bet a properly released version of these songs in 5.1 DTS audio would impress most people.

There is nothing to hide anymore, everybody knows what happened to Elvis. But give the man some credit - he still could sing.
A great EIC release should not try to show Elvis in great shape; it should show his downfall in many ways, people love stories like that, but it should also show that he still, under such tragic circumstances, was a great singer.

Thank you and Merry Christmas!


i think the bad setlist contributed to what image people had, i mean most of the special was made out of Teddy Bear-Dont Be Cruel, Hound Dog etc. They showed mostly the worst songs of those concerts while this would be a better setlist

2001 Theme/See See Rider (With the fun mistake, rapid city)
I Got A Woman/Amen (As on the album version, edited to 1 divebomb).
That's Allright Mama
Are You Lonesome Tonight
Trying To Get To You
You Gave Me A Mountain
O Sole Mio-It's Now Or Never
Teddy Bear-Don't Be Cruel (From rapid city, which is a bit better then omaha)
The Hawaiian Wedding Song
Fairytale
And I Love You So
Jailhouse Rock (Omaha, which doesnt include elvis mixing up the lyrics, Could be edited together with rapid city)
How Great Thou Art
If You Love Me (Let Me Know)
Little Sister
Unchained Melody
My Way
Can't Help Falling In Love

This would clock around the 50 minutes in total, and showcase more of elvis from those 2 days then the original cbs special

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:42 pm

WMarkJ wrote:Love the set list
Johnny2523 wrote:
Xaykev wrote:This has been discussed hundreds of times before. And I will keep it short. If they put the EIC together the right way it certainly would be a very good release. Why? Because the image people around the world have of Elvis the last years is so bad already; many don't even think he could sing - and that his weight was 200 kilo's. And Elvis did sing several great versions; Hurt, Unchained Melody, How Great Thou Art, I Really Don't Wanna Know, My Way, It's Now or Never, Trying to Get to You etc...I'll bet a properly released version of these songs in 5.1 DTS audio would impress most people.

There is nothing to hide anymore, everybody knows what happened to Elvis. But give the man some credit - he still could sing.
A great EIC release should not try to show Elvis in great shape; it should show his downfall in many ways, people love stories like that, but it should also show that he still, under such tragic circumstances, was a great singer.

Thank you and Merry Christmas!


i think the bad setlist contributed to what image people had, i mean most of the special was made out of Teddy Bear-Dont Be Cruel, Hound Dog etc. They showed mostly the worst songs of those concerts while this would be a better setlist

2001 Theme/See See Rider (With the fun mistake, rapid city)
I Got A Woman/Amen (As on the album version, edited to 1 divebomb).
That's Allright Mama
Are You Lonesome Tonight
Trying To Get To You
You Gave Me A Mountain
O Sole Mio-It's Now Or Never
Teddy Bear-Don't Be Cruel (From rapid city, which is a bit better then omaha)
The Hawaiian Wedding Song
Fairytale
And I Love You So
Jailhouse Rock (Omaha, which doesnt include elvis mixing up the lyrics, Could be edited together with rapid city)
How Great Thou Art
If You Love Me (Let Me Know)
Little Sister
Unchained Melody
My Way
Can't Help Falling In Love

This would clock around the 50 minutes in total, and showcase more of elvis from those 2 days then the original cbs special


thanks :smt002

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:53 pm

2001 Theme/See See Rider (With the fun mistake, rapid city)


Fun???

Geoff

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:02 pm

stevelecher wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:He may not have been dying in the terminal illness sense, but it all amounts to pretty much the same thing, albeit at his own hands.

Thus my statement, he wasn't dying, he was killing himself. We do agree.


Educate me. Someone who is killing himself isn't dying? I believe that is exactly what someone who is killing themself is doing. If the body is beginning to shut down--however slowly or quickly, and particularly if it's by ones own hand--that equals dying. No?

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:49 pm

tupelo_boy wrote:
2001 Theme/See See Rider (With the fun mistake, rapid city)


Fun???

Geoff


Yes i think its fun..

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:56 pm

KHoots wrote:
stevelecher wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:He may not have been dying in the terminal illness sense, but it all amounts to pretty much the same thing, albeit at his own hands.

Thus my statement, he wasn't dying, he was killing himself. We do agree.


Educate me. Someone who is killing himself isn't dying? I believe that is exactly what someone who is killing themself is doing. If the body is beginning to shut down--however slowly or quickly, and particularly if it's by ones own hand--that equals dying. No?

Really KHoots? You can't see the difference? A man dying of cancer is dying. He's wasting away and there's nothing he can do to stop it. Elvis, seeing how terribly he performed and knowing how crappy he felt, could have put himself in the hospital and prevented his death. Instead, he kept up and increased his daily regimen of dangerous medications until one day his body and heart quit. He wasn't dying on June 21, he was overmedicated. He died on August 16 after taking numerous packs (attacks) of dangerous and powerful pharmaceuticals that could have killed an elephant. That he would ultimately die if he didn't change his behavior does not mean he was dying.

Also, the idea that the Indy concert would have provided a satisfactory EIC special is ludicrous. IMO, the Rapid City Show is the better of those two shows anyway and Elvis was just as lumbering (maybe more so) in Indy as he was there. Painful versions of Bridge, I Can't Stop Loving You, Release Me, and And I Love You So would have made this special worse, not better. And the Omaha version of Teddy Bear/Don't Be Cruel was used to highlight the audience reaction to Elvis, which was more important overall than featuring the slightly better, but still unacceptably bad performance of the same medley from RC. They did what they could with EIC, though I would have found a way to include Tryin' To Get To You.

Re: Painful viewing

Sun Dec 23, 2012 11:02 pm

how it could be.. part 1
phpBB [video]

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:02 am

jurasic1968 wrote:Maybe a silly question: what if the CBS filmed the Indianapolis 26 June show? I bet that a lot of critics would praised Elvis for that live performance (the best of the tour).


Great this has been revived. As to your question, it's pretty clear that no show CBS-TV chose to videotape on this tour would have led to posthumous praise. Elvis was miles away from how he sang and looked the last time America tuned in, the "Aloha From Hawaii" rebroadcast, Wednesday, November 14, 1973. The contrast -- less than four years later -- was startling enough with "Elvis In Concert," seen on Monday, October 3, 1977.



Xaykev wrote:This has been discussed hundreds of times before. And I will keep it short. If they put the EIC together the right way it certainly would be a very good release. Why? Because the image people around the world have of Elvis the last years is so bad already; many don't even think he could sing - and that his weight was 200 kilo's. And Elvis did sing several great versions; Hurt, Unchained Melody, How Great Thou Art, I Really Don't Wanna Know, My Way, It's Now or Never, Trying to Get to You etc...I'll bet a properly released version of these songs in 5.1 DTS audio would impress most people.

There is nothing to hide anymore, everybody knows what happened to Elvis. But give the man some credit - he still could sing.
A great EIC release should not try to show Elvis in great shape; it should show his downfall in many ways, people love stories like that, but it should also show that he still, under such tragic circumstances, was a great singer.


Why in the world, with all the beautiful, unreleased Presley footage in existence, would EPE want to craft a project showing his downfall? How would it be sold to the public? It's depressing to consider such circumstances.

It is delusional to think a re-edit with improved sound "would impress most people." Elvis' singing is uneven at best on the June tour, and his voice control is very poor overall. To be in strong voice a singer must be in good health. Presley is in poor health and, of the performances you call great, most watching 35 years later will only give credence to "I Really Don't Want To Know" or "My Way." Even if most of his set had been well-sung it would be overshadowed by his shocking appearance.

1977. Not a good year.

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:21 am

We have disagreed on a few things over the years, Doc, but your EIC comments are spot on.

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:27 am

JerryNodak wrote:We have disagreed on a few things over the years, Doc, but your EIC comments are spot on.


Thank you, JerryNodak. Like anyone, I wish things could have been different.

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:36 am

jurasic1968 wrote:Maybe a silly question: what if the CBS filmed the Indianapolis 26 June show? I bet that a lot of critics would praised Elvis for that live performance (the best of the tour).

IMO Indianapolis was not a better show than Rapid City... perhaps Omaha. Regardless, his last tour held nothing to be praised about... he looked horribly disfigured and slurred and stammered through much of his speech between numbers. Your talking about one of the best looking and talented men of the 20th century being reduced to an over-worked, over-medicinized, over-eating shell of his former self. I love Elvis but his appearance and performances during the last couple of tours are, at times, unbearable.

Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 9:40 am

elvis-fan wrote:
jurasic1968 wrote:Maybe a silly question: what if the CBS filmed the Indianapolis 26 June show? I bet that a lot of critics would praised Elvis for that live performance (the best of the tour).

IMO Indianapolis was not a better show than Rapid City... perhaps Omaha. Regardless, his last tour held nothing to be praised about... he looked horribly disfigured and slurred and stammered through much of his speech between numbers. Your talking about one of the best looking and talented men of the 20th century being reduced to an over-worked, over-medicinized, over-eating shell of his former self. I love Elvis but his appearance and performances during the last couple of tours are, at times, unbearable.


Im sorry but by June 26, elvis lost alot of weight, And looked actually alot better since several months...
His vocal sounds in comparison to rapid city, Just a bit better.. Bridge Over Troubled Water and Release Me, are a good Example of that.
I think more people would have prefered to see elvis sing Bridge, Release Me, and I Can't Stop Loving You live. then to see what they eventually made out of the cbs special...
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Re: Painful viewing

Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:27 pm

stevelecher wrote:
KHoots wrote:
stevelecher wrote:
poormadpeter wrote:He may not have been dying in the terminal illness sense, but it all amounts to pretty much the same thing, albeit at his own hands.

Thus my statement, he wasn't dying, he was killing himself. We do agree.


Educate me. Someone who is killing himself isn't dying? I believe that is exactly what someone who is killing themself is doing. If the body is beginning to shut down--however slowly or quickly, and particularly if it's by ones own hand--that equals dying. No?

Really KHoots? You can't see the difference? A man dying of cancer is dying. He's wasting away and there's nothing he can do to stop it. Elvis, seeing how terribly he performed and knowing how crappy he felt, could have put himself in the hospital and prevented his death. Instead, he kept up and increased his daily regimen of dangerous medications until one day his body and heart quit. He wasn't dying on June 21, he was overmedicated. He died on August 16 after taking numerous packs (attacks) of dangerous and powerful pharmaceuticals that could have killed an elephant. That he would ultimately die if he didn't change his behavior does not mean he was dying.

Also, the idea that the Indy concert would have provided a satisfactory EIC special is ludicrous. IMO, the Rapid City Show is the better of those two shows anyway and Elvis was just as lumbering (maybe more so) in Indy as he was there. Painful versions of Bridge, I Can't Stop Loving You, Release Me, and And I Love You So would have made this special worse, not better. And the Omaha version of Teddy Bear/Don't Be Cruel was used to highlight the audience reaction to Elvis, which was more important overall than featuring the slightly better, but still unacceptably bad performance of the same medley from RC. They did what they could with EIC, though I would have found a way to include Tryin' To Get To You.


agree there.......he needed a kick up the a*s......(bless him)

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:34 am

Johnny2523 wrote:Im sorry but by June 26, elvis lost alot of weight, And looked actually alot better since several months...
His vocal sounds in comparison to rapid city, Just a bit better.. Bridge Over Troubled Water and Release Me, are a good Example of that.
I think more people would have prefered to see elvis sing Bridge, Release Me, and I Can't Stop Loving You live. then to see what they eventually made out of the cbs special...


He lost a lot of weight? Not really. Elvis looked no better than on June 21, which is one reason why CBS footage that might have been shot went unused.

Bottom line here is June 1977 should never have been a tour or a TV show. But money talks. And you know what walks.

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 3:05 am

Painful viewing
for sure.

But as in the circumstances there was nothing after, the few nuggets that there were do have some value.

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:09 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Johnny2523 wrote:Im sorry but by June 26, elvis lost alot of weight, And looked actually alot better since several months...
His vocal sounds in comparison to rapid city, Just a bit better.. Bridge Over Troubled Water and Release Me, are a good Example of that.
I think more people would have prefered to see elvis sing Bridge, Release Me, and I Can't Stop Loving You live. then to see what they eventually made out of the cbs special...


He lost a lot of weight? Not really. Elvis looked no better than on June 21, which is one reason why CBS footage that might have been shot went unused.

Bottom line here is June 1977 should never have been a tour or a TV show. But money talks. And you know what walks.


Elvis can clearly be seen thinner than on Rapid City.... On footage as well as photo graphs on this show doc.
Elvis lost 18 lbs if i remember right.
CBS probably didnt even film te last show.. they filmed his arrival yes. But the show itself i really doubt it as nowhere in pictures, or footage any camera's can be seen.

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:13 pm

Johnny2523 wrote:Elvis can clearly be seen thinner than on Rapid City.... On footage as well as photo graphs on this show doc.
Elvis lost 18 lbs if i remember right.
CBS probably didnt even film te last show.. they filmed his arrival yes. But the show itself i really doubt it as nowhere in pictures, or footage any camera's can be seen.


Elvis lost 18 pounds in 4 and a half days? Did he cut off a limb?

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:15 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
Johnny2523 wrote:Elvis can clearly be seen thinner than on Rapid City.... On footage as well as photo graphs on this show doc.
Elvis lost 18 lbs if i remember right.
CBS probably didnt even film te last show.. they filmed his arrival yes. But the show itself i really doubt it as nowhere in pictures, or footage any camera's can be seen.


Elvis lost 18 pounds in 4 and a half days? Did he cut off a limb?


Wasn't there something called a speed-diet?

Re: Painful viewing

Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:20 pm

@Doc, This looks like a overweight, rapid city elvis to you??
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