Anything about Elvis
More than 30 Million visitors can't be wrong

Controversial footage July 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 2:08 am

Not found on YouTube this time, but in the Historic Films Footage Archive on the net itself.

Haven't seen this 20 min. film in this format before (only in bits on the June Juanico DVD).

Description as on the site:
"Elvis Presley on vacation in Biloxi, Mississippi, color home movies, June 1956.
Among pals are Red West, longtime bodyguard (actor and member of so-called Memphis Mafia); Junior Smith,
Cousin; And Elvis' girlfriend, June Juanico, of Biloxi, Mississippi. Later sequences feature Elvis's parents,
Gladys and Vernon Presley."

The link to the website where this 20 min. clip can be found:

http://www.historicfilms.com/tapes/13406

And three screen caps:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by MikeFromHolland on Sat Jan 31, 2015 10:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Re: Complete footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 2:34 pm

Added a third screen cap to my original post, image.jpg. A controversial one, see text to the right of it (00:11:11)

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:08 pm

Mike, watching elvis do the nazi salute with a gestapo hat on his head makes me feel sick. It's shocked me deeply. Either Elvis was totally ignorant of what the Germans did during WW2 or he wasn't intelligent enough to understand how bad this behaviour really is. Anyway, it's changed my ideas about who Elvis Presley was. Not in a good way, sadly enough.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:20 pm

Is this new or old footage? Im assuming recently found because it hasn't hit the news yet. I hope it doesn't but if it does..woah boy...

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:20 pm

I'd caution folks not to overreact. Though not appropriate, and certainly not an excuse, it was a different time. Plus, two sides to every story. I'm 100% positive Elvis' intentions were not to glorify, or in any way, make light of the Nazi regime.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:21 pm

DGRYAN1977 wrote:Is this new or old footage? Im assuming recently found because it hasn't hit the news yet. I hope it doesn't but if it does..woah boy...



Not new.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:31 pm

Sometimes people dress in a cape and talk like Bela Lugosi, that does not mean they are vampires, want to be vampires or agree with a vampire's culture and politics. He is just goofing around. Goofing around without fear of being over analyzed, criticized or worrying about the PC police making a deal about it, does anyone remember those days? We have constructed our own prison.

If someone were to hand me a prop of some kind, I would pantomime whatever that prop suggests, just goofing around.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:43 pm

Elvis was not that. Impossible. What is possible is that a post like this, is found by sleaze tabloid(s) and make an (potentially damaging) issue out of this.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:45 pm

Shocking, to say the least.

I've done some Google Images search, and I've found those are probably not Gestapo caps, but they are certainly Nazi caps, with the eagle and the swastika on top.

They are clowning around, that's clear. There's even a very brief moment, after they do the Nazi salute, where we can see Elvis giving the finger to the camera operator (see screen cap below).

The question is not why are they doing the Nazi salute. Anybody can do that for fun, as noted above. The question is, what were four damn Nazi caps doing in a vacation boat ?


SCx.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:48 pm

rocknroll wrote:I'd caution folks not to overreact. Though not appropriate, and certainly not an excuse, it was a different time. Plus, two sides to every story. I'm 100% positive Elvis' intentions were not to glorify, or in any way, make light of the Nazi regime.


1956 is only 11 years after the Germans killed 6 million jews, the world was still in shock by then.


skatterbrane wrote:Sometimes people dress in a cape and talk like Bela Lugosi, that does not mean they are vampires, want to be vampires or agree with a vampire's culture and politics. He is just goofing around. Goofing around without fear of being over analyzed, criticized or worrying about the PC police making a deal about it, does anyone remember those days? We have constructed our own prison.

If someone were to hand me a prop of some kind, I would pantomime whatever that prop suggests, just goofing around.


I understand that you want to justify this behaviour, but that's absurd. We're not talking about vampire outfites here, we're talking about 1. buying hats of the type worn by the gestapo 2. wearing them 3. bringing the nazi salute. Do you do such things at home, imitate the atrocious police force of one of the most terrible regimes ever, just to "goof around"? Come on!

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:49 pm

Juan Luis wrote:Elvis was not that. Impossible. What is possible is that a post like this, is found by sleaze tabloid(s) and make an (potentially damaging) issue out of this.


Watch the footage ;-)

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 5:55 pm

Im going to have to disagree. Big difference between pretending to be a vampire and a Nazi. They are still going after former Nazis today.
None of us know what he truly meant. Which is why I cant defend him or accuse him.
To say it was a different time argument doesn't really hold water in this day and age.
Just ask Paula Deen

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:00 pm

Jovan wrote:
rocknroll wrote:I'd caution folks not to overreact. Though not appropriate, and certainly not an excuse, it was a different time. Plus, two sides to every story. I'm 100% positive Elvis' intentions were not to glorify, or in any way, make light of the Nazi regime.


1956 is only 11 years after the Germans killed 6 million jews, the world was still in shock by then.


skatterbrane wrote:Sometimes people dress in a cape and talk like Bela Lugosi, that does not mean they are vampires, want to be vampires or agree with a vampire's culture and politics. He is just goofing around. Goofing around without fear of being over analyzed, criticized or worrying about the PC police making a deal about it, does anyone remember those days? We have constructed our own prison.

If someone were to hand me a prop of some kind, I would pantomime whatever that prop suggests, just goofing around.


I understand that you want to justify this behaviour, but that's absurd. We're not talking about vampire outfites here, we're talking about 1. buying hats of the type worn by the gestapo 2. wearing them 3. bringing the nazi salute. Do you do such things at home, imitate the atrocious police force of one of the most terrible regimes ever, just to "goof around"? Come on!



OK, we do have to rewind a little bit here. Until recently, you could have found a Nazi outfit available for hire for a Halloween party in the UK. In the USA, you still CAN buy Nazi fancy dress costumes - and that's even with today's political correctness.

nazi.JPG


In 1990, there was a sitcom in Britain about Hitler and Eva Braun living next door to a Jewish couple, called Heil Honey, I'm Home! It only lasted one episode, but that's not the point. It's a demonstration of just how long it was before we became more sensitive about these kinds of issues. Someone as late as 1990 thought such a sitcom was OK for prime time TV. So it's little wonder, that Elvis thought what he was doing was OK back in 1956 or, rather, didn't give it a second thought.

Let's put this in context. Elvis was making this "joke" at a time when racial segregation was the norm in much of America, and lynchings were still taking place. America was hardly the land of the free and, when put into that kind of context, it's hardly surprising that such off-coloured jokes were coming from a still-naïve young man from the sticks. Ten years later, in the middle of the civil rights movement (so when people were more socially aware), he still thought it was OK to make racist jokes/use racist language in the studio and during the Wings of an Angel jam (and others). In many respects, that is more offensive and more of a damaging issue - by that point he should have (and probably did) known better.

What was acceptable in the 1950s is not acceptable to us today - but times change, thankfully for the better. Despite the millions of jews, homosexuals and Romanis sent to their deaths by the Germans in the second world war, it was still perfectly OK for entertainers to make jokes at the expense of these groups for decades. Still is, in some cases.

Times change. Many people remember the "good old days" but actually they were days when people were a lot more ignorant and prejudiced than they are now, and could dress up as Nazis and give a Nazi salute as a joke without giving it a second thought. Let's not judge a different generation for that kind of (probably innocent) idiocy, but be thankful we now live in a very different world.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by poormadpeter on Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:07 pm

...
Last edited by Juan Luis on Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:08 pm

and now in Ukraine as regular attire complete with torches.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:21 pm

poormadpeter wrote:
Jovan wrote:
rocknroll wrote:I'd caution folks not to overreact. Though not appropriate, and certainly not an excuse, it was a different time. Plus, two sides to every story. I'm 100% positive Elvis' intentions were not to glorify, or in any way, make light of the Nazi regime.


1956 is only 11 years after the Germans killed 6 million jews, the world was still in shock by then.


skatterbrane wrote:Sometimes people dress in a cape and talk like Bela Lugosi, that does not mean they are vampires, want to be vampires or agree with a vampire's culture and politics. He is just goofing around. Goofing around without fear of being over analyzed, criticized or worrying about the PC police making a deal about it, does anyone remember those days? We have constructed our own prison.

If someone were to hand me a prop of some kind, I would pantomime whatever that prop suggests, just goofing around.


I understand that you want to justify this behaviour, but that's absurd. We're not talking about vampire outfites here, we're talking about 1. buying hats of the type worn by the gestapo 2. wearing them 3. bringing the nazi salute. Do you do such things at home, imitate the atrocious police force of one of the most terrible regimes ever, just to "goof around"? Come on!



OK, we do have to rewind a little bit here. Until recently, you could have found a Nazi outfit available for hire for a Halloween party in the UK. In the USA, you still CAN buy Nazi fancy dress costumes - and that's even with today's political correctness.

nazi.JPG


In 1990, there was a sitcom in Britain about Hitler and Eva Braun living next door to a Jewish couple, called Heil Honey, I'm Home! It only lasted one episode, but that's not the point. It's a demonstration of just how long it was before we became more sensitive about these kinds of issues. Someone as late as 1990 thought such a sitcom was OK for prime time TV. So it's little wonder, that Elvis thought what he was doing was OK back in 1956 or, rather, didn't give it a second thought.

Let's put this in context. Elvis was making this "joke" at a time when racial segregation was the norm in much of America, and lynchings were still taking place. America was hardly the land of the free and, when put into that kind of context, it's hardly surprising that such off-coloured jokes were coming from a still-naïve young man from the sticks. Ten years later, in the middle of the civil rights movement (so when people were more socially aware), he still thought it was OK to make racist jokes/use racist language in the studio and during the Wings of an Angel jam (and others). In many respects, that is more offensive and more of a damaging issue - by that point he should have (and probably did) known better.

What was acceptable in the 1950s is not acceptable to us today - but times change, thankfully for the better. Despite the millions of jews, homosexuals and Romanis sent to their deaths by the Germans in the second world war, it was still perfectly OK for entertainers to make jokes at the expense of these groups for decades. Still is, in some cases.

Times change. Many people remember the "good old days" but actually they were days when people were a lot more ignorant and prejudiced than they are now, and could dress up as Nazis and give a Nazi salute as a joke without giving it a second thought. Let's not judge a different generation for that kind of (probably innocent) idiocy, but be thankful we now live in a very different world.


Maybe it was normal where you come from, where i'm from it wasn't and it still isnt. Certainly not in the 1950's.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:24 pm

Where do you come fron Jovan?

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:36 pm

I dont know and we will never know whats behind this. Perhaps June Juanico can explain. All I know is, I could never ever put such a hat on my head and I would not be friends with anyone who would. Im very upset at this footage. There has been some recent news buzz about Elvis having Nazi artifacts in his home collection and its been disputed by Ginger or someone. Now, I am not so sure.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:38 pm

If I was part of the KKK back in the 60's it doesn't make it ok because it was a "different time".
Even if I just dressed up as one and "pretended".
Im not jewish so this does not offend me the way it would offend someone who is. I still find it appauling though.
1950's or not if I brought this video to my local temple Im sure no one would say "Oh its ok. It was the 1950's"

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:38 pm

Gitchops83 wrote:Where do you come fron Jovan?


I'm dutch, grew up in the Netherlands and in Germany (yes).. In both countries you can get arrested for this.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:41 pm

It's included on DVD Elvis & June (A love story) and circulating for years. Old stuff.

The story goes that an uncle of June served in the US army during ww2 and found these caps; as a kind of trophy he took these caps to his boat. He used the caps to protect yourself against the hot sun during fishing. It has nothing to do with nazisme.

colonel snow
Last edited by colonel snow on Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:42 pm

Its ok in Kiev infact it's encouraged.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:49 pm

I'm not saying this was right - I'm saying that it was a different time, and people weren't politically correct in the way they are today. I'm not saying blackface in 1920s movies was right either but, again, we've now learned from our mistakes, and that's the main thing.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:52 pm

"we've now learned from our mistakes" :smt003

Humans.

Re: Controversial footage June 1956 Biloxi vacation

Sat Jan 31, 2015 7:12 pm

What I find offensive is when people have a contest on who can be offended the most the quickest. It is as if there is a "who is offended" roll call, and whoever does not say "here" is the loser. The swastika was not even of Nazi origin, yet is has been hijacked to obscure all its original connotations. It has been used in MANY cultures, including some Jewish ones!

I am sure Elvis and crew were not secretly Nazis who had to go out to sea to express themselves as such. They got some hats that they enjoyed wearing in private and were goofing around. And I am not defending it because it was Elvis, heck I would defend it even if it were Tom Jones or Tiny Tim.

There are people who collect Nazi paraphernalia, and do not subscribe to their ethos. As a kid I remember doing the Nazi salute, and the Russian salute and just about every salute I knew playing around, role playing, playing Army etc. If I were to dress up as a Nazi for Halloween (which I never have), I would use the Nazi salute as part of the act. Many Jewish comedians have dressed as Hitler for satirical performances, such as Mel Brooks.

I would never refrain from trying on a hat IF I WANTED TO, regardless of what it may have stood for, or who may have worn it (as long as they did not have lice).