SoundScan (US) sales-figures

HEY bRIAN!! GREAT NEWS ABOUT THE RIAA. I'LL BE CHECKING THEIR WEBSITE, SINCE THEY HAVE APPARENTLY AGREED WITH EPE TO JUST INFORM THE PUBLIC BEFORE THE OFFICAL GRACELAND ANNOUNCEMENT IS MADE, ALTHIUGH PERHAPS FOR THIS TIME THEY'LL WAIT,M AS THEY USED TO DO ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO.

Hi Jaime,

Yes, great news indeed. I check the RIAA website daily for any new additions.

I think our predictions will be pretty much on the button but it would be great if there were some we were not expecting.

Brian

Hi Brian!! Last night I read a through listing of his still uncertified albums, and it dawned upon me that perhaps they'll have a nice surprise for us, like one of the ones from the fifties, say, my favourite from that era, and the first Presley album I actually bought, the "For LP fans only" (I did so in 1966, having heard others before, naturally), That it hasn't racked sales of 500,000 in 42 years is puzzling to me, but so far the RIAA has not certified it.

From the sixties, I would be happy if some of the ones I heard in special circumstances, like "Fun in Acapulco", which I heard countless times in Brazil, circa 1964/66, but could not get a copy of because it sold out, and take this, after living in Mexico the previous two and a half years but being unable, as well, to even hear of it, let alone buy it, because he was banned there.

I remember as a 13 year old kid going to Acapulco, with my parents and sister, on my last month in Mexico, in March of 1964 as I recall. We'd arrived at the country's capital in January of 1962 but could hear no Elvis, anywhere, from the moment we arrived there. No airplay, no record stores, no movies. And I'd been a fan since 1957, mind you. Anyways, as we 4 watched the guys who jump from that huge cliff to the water, in that same restaurant you see in that movie and at the exact place where Presley is supposedly seated with Ursula Andress before he sings "Margarita", my mother asked a waiter about celebrities whom may have been there, recently ( she knew the place from 1947, had seen it with my dad, whose first overseas post had been Mexico (1947-49), and spoke with many of them countless of times before even my sister and I, both "made" but not born there, had been even born), so she knew it attracted nothing but celebrities. The waiter proudly replied ( LOL) that the restaurant was so famous, "so famous indeed, that we've even hosted, less than a couple of years ago, not just celebrities, but a big Hollywood crew here for the location shoot of an Elvis Presley film, but without his presence".

That blew my mind. I didn't know what he was talking about, "a Presley movie filmed in Mexico??", I wondered, but when on the next week, April 1, 1964 to be precise (on the same exact day a world famous military coup took place there, coinciding with my entire family moving to Brazil), one of the first Elvis-related things I saw, at a teenage party I attended a couple of weeks later, was the "Fun in Acapulco" LP, whose liner notes, nothing really, I instantly devoured. And that's when I asked our hostess to play it, and thus first heard "Bossa Nova, baby", probably the most important reason for the album's brazilian sucess, albeit its total lack of similarity with brazilian music, of any kind, pop, or whatever.

And it was then, and only then, that I knew what the waiter meant...

I just find it odd that albums like "Pot Luck", "Spinout", "Promised Land", "Elvis Today", still havent, at least reached "Gold".

These records are confirmed by Ernst that they at least reached 300,000 units sold in their original chart runs, but they were still available at the time of Elvis' death, then again in the early 80's when RCA began their "Best Buy" series.

Look at "Pot Luck". peaked at #4, charted for 32 weeks on the Billboard chart. That's a respectable showing and eight months on Billboard, considering it was a direct competition with the still selling strong, "Blue Hawaii".

In 1965, at least 4 songs included in the 1962 album were re-introduced to a wide audience, via, the film, "Tickle Me". The movie was successful and 2 of it's songs were strong sellers as 45rpm singles, at 500,000 units each, both peaking at #11.

I can assume that fraction of people who became Elvis fans, or wanting to own the songs in album form, reached for the "POT LUCK album easily.

Let's not forget, just because an album is not charting, doesn't automatically mean it's not quietly selling.

Even if you observe closely, in the booklet of FTD's, "Promised Land", you see original marketing sheets, or paper work, on new and recent Elvis albums sales excpectations and 1973's, "Elvis" had sales of 281,000, when Ernst has claimed in the past that this release sold under 200,000.

I mean , c'mon, that's almost discrediting 100,000 in sales. Maybe Ernst believes tapes don't count ?

Interesting to see that by December of 1974, "Aloha From Hawaii" had sold 1,400,000 up until that point.

I still personally believe that "Aloha" could possibly be Elvis' most successful album released in his lifetime, but that honor goes to "Blue Hawaii".

I think alot of these albums sold alot better than actually thought or believed due to sloppy record keeping.

Hopefully, after all these years, this can be rectified.

Last edited by minkahed on Sun Jul 15, 2012 3:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I just find it odd that albums like "Pot Luck", "Spinout", "Promised Land", "Elvis Today", still havent, at least reached "Gold".

These records are confirmed by Ernst that they at least reached 300,000 units sold in their original chart runs, but they were still available at the time of Elvis' death, then again in the early 80's when RCA began their "Best Buy" series.

Look at "Pot Luck". peaked at #4, charted for 28 weeks on the Billboard chart. That's a respectable showing and four months, considering it was a direct competition with the still selling strong, "Blue Hawaii".

In 1965, at least 4 songs included in the 1962 album were re-introduced to a wide audience, via, the film, "Tickle Me". The movie was successful and 2 of it's songs were strong sellers as 45rpm singles, at 500,000 units each, both peaking at #11.

I can assume that fraction of people who became Elvis fans, or wanting to own the songs in album form, reached for the "POT LUCK album easily.

Let's not forget, just because an album is not charting, doesn't automatically mean it's not quietly selling.

Even if you observe closely, in the booklet of FTD's, "Promised Land", you see original marketing sheets, or paper work, on new and recent Elvis albums sales excpectations and 1973's, "Elvis" had sales of 281,000, when Ernst has claimed in the past that this release sold under 200,000.

I mean , c'mon, that's almost discrediting 100,000 in sales. Maybe Ernst believes tapes don't count ?

Interesting to see that by December of 1974, "Aloha From Hawaii" had sold 1,400,000 up until that point.

I still personally believe that "Aloha" could possibly be Elvis' most successful album released in his lifetime, but that honor goes to "Blue Hawaii".

I think alot of these albums sold alot better than actually thought or believed due to sloppy record keeping.

Hopefully, after all these years, this can be rectified.

One of the main stumbling blocks for many of Elvis' albums not achieving GOLD status is due to the fact that SONY have deleted them from the current calalog. For example:

'Pot Luck' is only available from Amazon as an 'Import' or on vinyl/cassette and therefore any sales do not count towards his RIAA total. Further, this album originally had 12 tracks but the re-issue had 17. The RIAA only allow an additional 4 tracks in addition to the original ones and therefore this was one track too many to count towards the original album sales and will be treated as a separate album.

'Promised Land' is not available for sale at Amazon other than for $33.89 dollars and on vinyl. The original album had ten tracks but the re-issue had 18 and like 'Pot Luck' was ineligible for its sales to be added to the original release.

These are just two examples of which there are many. BMG and SONY did not get their act together with RIAA rules and therefore we are now suffering the consequence. Of course, the Legacy releases of several of Elvis' albums have made matters worse in RIAA Award terms all being treated as separate albums.

Brian

... "For LP Fans Only"... That it hasn't racked sales of 500,000 in 42 years is puzzling to me, but so far the RIAA has not certified it.

53 years (1959 - 2012)

I just find it odd that albums like "Pot Luck", "Spinout", "Promised Land", "Elvis Today", still havent, at least reached "Gold".
These records are confirmed by Ernst that they at least reached 300,000 units sold in their original chart runs, but they were still available at the time of Elvis' death, then again in the early 80's when RCA began their "Best Buy" series.

I agree, and not to mention the 1974 single "I've Got A Thing About You Baby".

You're absolutely right Blue River, I must have been unconsciously thinking of when I bought it (1966, which would have made it actually 46 years, and that is closer to 42 years that 53, but I think you get the point of why I made the mistake)

The 'For LP Fans Only' album only had ten tracks. Having said that it is indeed difficult to comprehend that it has not sold enough copies to go GOLD, especially as it is still on the current catalog and stocked by such major outlets as Amazon.

Brian

...'Pot Luck' is only available from Amazon as an 'Import' or on vinyl/cassette and therefore any sales do not count towards his RIAA total.
Further, this album originally had 12 tracks but the re-issue had 17.
The RIAA only allow an additional 4 tracks in addition to the original ones and therefore this was one track too many to count towards the original album sales and will be treated as a separate album.

I understand the above, but a 10 or 12-track vinyl album would be poor value on a CD, even with the 'allowable' extra 4 tracks.

How would the RIAA treat a 'two-for-one' release ?

Like the original Pot Luck tracks together with Something For Everybody on a single CD ?

Would that count toward the vinyl sales of both albums, one of them, or neither ?

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?

According to Ernst, Elvis wasn't a big album seller, mostly 45rpm's and Ep's are what Elvis sold in huge amounts.

The "King Creole" Lp had just been released in September, so let's automatically exclude this one.

"Elvis' Golden Records" was released in March '58, charted for 40 weeks, peaked at #3, but Ernst claims it moved 150,000 units. Nevermind the fact that most of the cuts had never appeard on Lp before and contained 14 million sellers.

This leaves us with:

1)Elvis Presley #1 for 10 weeks-49 weeks on the chart
2)Elvis #1 for 5 weeks, (#2-17 weeks), -32 weeks on the chart
3)Loving You #1 for 10 weeks-25 weeks on chart
4)Elvis' Christmas Album #1 for 4 weeks-7 weeks on chart

These albums, even in today's standards, would be considered very successful, but according to Ernst, they didn't sell all that much, apparently the Lp market was still growing.

Here are the sales figures he lists in his mammouth 1999 book, "Elvis:Day By Day".

1) 300,000
2) 500,000
3) 375,000
4) 200,000

Another weird thing I observed, in the booklet for the 1996 BMG, "Elvis '56", Ernst states that the first Lp sells 362,000 in it's first month out. WTF ?

So what did that p sell for the remainder of it's chart run, next to nothing ?

What happened to the 62,000 copies after 1996 ?

In 1997 and 1999, respectively, Ernst starts claiming, (in books and interviews), the first album sold 300,000 compared to the singles success, "Hearbreak Hotel", which, sold 2 million.

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?...

The RIAA [& Ernst too] only give figures for US sales.

Other figures quoted may be for worldwide sales, hence the discrepancies.

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?...

The RIAA [& Ernst too] only give figures for US sales.

Other figures quoted may be for worldwide sales, hence the discrepancies.

I know this Colin, but what discrepancies are you talking about ?

Be specific please.

Album sales for all artists were not really big until the mid 6o's in the U.S. My parents had a record player that played 45's only. I bought my 1st Turntable that played 45's, and LP's in 1961. It took awhile for people to catch on before they bought turntables that played LP's. You have to remember Elvis Knocked out a whole genre of music that was not mainstream anymore and believe me Elvis was the One. Parents were not buying Rock 'n Roll at that time, it was a teenage market. The teenagers that became adults were now listening to Rock and Soul music. Elvis made it easier for everybody that came after him. The reason why superstars after Elvis have idolized him for his unique talent & opened the doors for them to be successful.

The following appeared on the Billboard Catalog Album Charts (w/e 14th July, 2012):

'Heart And Soul' selling some 1614 copies. Total sales to date: 567,860 copies.

'Elvis: The Very Best Of Love' selling some 1556 copies. Total sales to date: 279,068 copies.

'The Essential Elvis' selling some 1545 copies. Total sales to date: 453,538 copies. It is a double album and therefore under RIAA rules qualifies for double sales - so for their purposes it has sold 907,076 copies.

'An Afternoon In The Garden' selling some 1321 copies. Total sales to date: 475,689 copies.

'Elvis Country' (Compilation) selling some 1224 copies. Total sales to date: 117,333 copies.

'Elvis Christmas' selling some 11 copies. Total sales to date: 599,565 copies.

Brian

Thanks Brian, as usual in the last weeks, you beat me to the punch!!

The following appeared on the Billboard Catalog Album Charts (w/e 14th July, 2012):

'Heart And Soul' selling some 1614 copies. Total sales to date: 567,860 copies.

'Elvis: The Very Best Of Love' selling some 1556 copies. Total sales to date: 279,068 copies.

'The Essential Elvis' selling some 1545 copies. Total sales to date: 453,538 copies. It is a double album and therefore under RIAA rules qualifies for double sales - so for their purposes it has sold 907,076 copies.

'An Afternoon In The Garden' selling some 1321 copies. Total sales to date: 475,689 copies.

'Elvis Country' (Compilation) selling some 1224 copies. Total sales to date: 117,333 copies.

'Elvis Christmas' selling some 11 copies. Total sales to date: 599,565 copies.

Brian

So, if the "Essential Elvis" double disc sells 1 million copies, this would make it eligible for "Double" Platinum, correct ? (1,000,000 x 2 = 2,000,000)

I would expect some of these titles would sell a fraction more in a few weeks around August.

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?...

The RIAA [& Ernst too] only give figures for US sales.

Other figures quoted may be for worldwide sales, hence the discrepancies.

I know this Colin, but what discrepancies are you talking about ?

Be specific please.

Well, like the two 50s albums you mention above.

The following appeared on the Billboard Catalog Album Charts (w/e 14th July, 2012):

'Heart And Soul' selling some 1614 copies. Total sales to date: 567,860 copies.

'Elvis: The Very Best Of Love' selling some 1556 copies. Total sales to date: 279,068 copies.

'The Essential Elvis' selling some 1545 copies. Total sales to date: 453,538 copies. It is a double album and therefore under RIAA rules qualifies for double sales - so for their purposes it has sold 907,076 copies.

'An Afternoon In The Garden' selling some 1321 copies. Total sales to date: 475,689 copies.

'Elvis Country' (Compilation) selling some 1224 copies. Total sales to date: 117,333 copies.

'Elvis Christmas' selling some 11 copies. Total sales to date: 599,565 copies.

Brian

So, if the "Essential Elvis" double disc sells 1 million copies, this would make it eligible for "Double" Platinum, correct ? (1,000,000 x 2 = 2,000,000)

I would expect some of these titles would sell a fraction more in a few weeks around August.

Correct.

Brian

Brian do you know if the sales from the various 'mail order' releases over the years (I'm thinking those issued by Readers Digest, Time Life etc.) have ever been taken into account? They must amount to millions worldwide.

I'm not Brian but yes many of those releases have been counted in Elvis' tally. Off the top of the head I know Time Life's Rock N' Roll Era Elvis album has been certified, as has one of their gospel collections. Also the two Brookville albums have been certified. So has the 1985 TV release 50 Years, 50 Hits which was also sold in magazines. At least two Reader's Digest releases The Elvis Presley Story and I think one called Elvis' Greatest Hits have also been certified. There are more but those are the ones I know right away.

There has been no mention of "Elvis Uncovered". I guess that means it was a big non-success.

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?

According to Ernst, Elvis wasn't a big album seller, mostly 45rpm's and Ep's are what Elvis sold in huge amounts.

Maybe Elvis could have been referring to his two EP albums Elvis Vol. 1 and Jailhouse Rock, both had sold a million copies in the states by the time of the interview. Or maybe he was referring to worldwide sales, as was already stated in an earlier post. Or his statement "a million each" could have meant in the term of dollars, as LPs back then were credited based on the amount of money earned instead of the amount of sales. There wasn't much in awards for the LP format in those times; and Elvis' first two LPs easily earned a million dollars.

...'Pot Luck' is only available from Amazon as an 'Import' or on vinyl/cassette and therefore any sales do not count towards his RIAA total.
Further, this album originally had 12 tracks but the re-issue had 17.
The RIAA only allow an additional 4 tracks in addition to the original ones and therefore this was one track too many to count towards the original album sales and will be treated as a separate album.

I understand the above, but a 10 or 12-track vinyl album would be poor value on a CD, even with the 'allowable' extra 4 tracks.

How would the RIAA treat a 'two-for-one' release ?

Like the original Pot Luck tracks together with Something For Everybody on a single CD ?

Would that count toward the vinyl sales of both albums, one of them, or neither ?

Colin,

The RIAA treat 'two for ones' as a new release and only as one unit per sale. Therefore neither original album would gain additional sales.

Brian

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?

According to Ernst, Elvis wasn't a big album seller, mostly 45rpm's and Ep's are what Elvis sold in huge amounts.

Maybe Elvis could have been referring to his two EP albums Elvis Vol. 1 and Jailhouse Rock, both had sold a million copies in the states by the time of the interview. Or maybe he was referring to worldwide sales, as was already stated in an earlier post. Or his statement "a million each" could have meant in the term of dollars, as LPs back then were credited based on the amount of money earned instead of the amount of sales. There wasn't much in awards for the LP format in those times; and Elvis' first two LPs easily earned a million dollars.

Well, that's all assumption and speculation, did Elvis have no clue as to what he was talking about, or the issue he was addressing ?

I just played the interview back, and again, Elvis clearly states that he has 2 Albums that have both sold a million each !

In my estimation, Elvis knew the difference between and Lp and an Extended Play Ep.

Maybe we'll never know ...

...'Pot Luck' is only available from Amazon as an 'Import' or on vinyl/cassette and therefore any sales do not count towards his RIAA total.
Further, this album originally had 12 tracks but the re-issue had 17.
The RIAA only allow an additional 4 tracks in addition to the original ones and therefore this was one track too many to count towards the original album sales and will be treated as a separate album.

I understand the above, but a 10 or 12-track vinyl album would be poor value on a CD, even with the 'allowable' extra 4 tracks.

How would the RIAA treat a 'two-for-one' release ?

Like the original Pot Luck tracks together with Something For Everybody on a single CD ?

Would that count toward the vinyl sales of both albums, one of them, or neither ?

Colin,

The RIAA treat 'two for ones' as a new release and only as one unit per sale. Therefore neither original album would gain additional sales.

Brian

Thanks, Brian.

I might have guessed !

Life is so unfair sometimes....................

.

Last edited by ColinB on Wed Jul 18, 2012 1:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

Not to be pedantic, but another baffling argument is, on the 50's box, there is an interview, possibly an excerpt from the 1958 EP, "Elvis Sails", and in the interview Elvis himself states that he, up until that point had 25 "GOLD" records and has had 2 Albums that had sold a Million each, even reaching out to Steve Sholes to help confirm this.

Either Elvis was mislead or couldn't count or whatever, but what two 1950's albums from Elvis Presley sold over a million up until September, 1958 ?

According to Ernst, Elvis wasn't a big album seller, mostly 45rpm's and Ep's are what Elvis sold in huge amounts.

Maybe Elvis could have been referring to his two EP albums Elvis Vol. 1 and Jailhouse Rock, both had sold a million copies in the states by the time of the interview. Or maybe he was referring to worldwide sales, as was already stated in an earlier post. Or his statement "a million each" could have meant in the term of dollars, as LPs back then were credited based on the amount of money earned instead of the amount of sales. There wasn't much in awards for the LP format in those times; and Elvis' first two LPs easily earned a million dollars.

Well, that's all assumption and speculation, did Elvis have no clue as to what he was talking about, or the issue he was addressing ?

I just played the interview back, and again, Elvis clearly states that he has 2 Albums that have both sold a million each !

In my estimation, Elvis knew the difference between and Lp and an Extended Play Ep.

Maybe we'll never know ...

You're right. It is speculation because Elvis did not elaborate. My best guess is that I can only assume that he was talking about his first two LPs. If so, did "a million each" mean domestic sales or worldwide sales? Is there any evidence that might prove that the two LPs reached a million in the states by the time of the interview. I read somewhere that in 1957 RCA awarded Harry Belefonte a gold record for his album Calypso(released in 1956) claiming that it was the first LP to sell a million copies. Therefore, it could have been possible that Elvis' first two LPs reached a million copies each by mid 1958.