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Re: Elvis, King and X

Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:28 pm

To Mr. Or Ms. "US":

MY prejudices?

There are those who do or CAN pay taxes. "US" is not all Americans. That would be swell. {I am not a commie; I believe in God and in people owning what is self-evident- I do not want your record collection! Got my own. And aim to keep it.} There are those who struggle to live: the very young, the sick, the old and sick, veterans . . .

You got any room at your Inn? Or is there room just for US.

Yeah. I AM "prejudiced." On behalf of the latter. I am glad to pay whatever taxes I owe and give more than is sensible. Not for deductions!

Best,
rjm

Re: Elvis, King and X

Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:47 pm

Much obliged to rickeap {sp?} This is a tiny browser.

rjm

Re: Elvis, King and X

Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:49 pm

drjohncarpenter wrote:
vbgt wrote:Maybe he doesn't support him because he's spending us into oblivion? Ever think of that?

That was the previous administration. Thanks for stopping by!


Obama has spent more in 2 years then Bush did in 8, and I agree that Bush spent way too much.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:04 am

Bush was in 4th gear with his spending, Obama is in 5th gear. It is completely out of control. Even with reasonable tax increases and the ending of two wars, not enough revenue can be generated to cover excessive spending. The budgets over the past eight years have been completely inflated -- both the executive and legislative branches have been spending way too much for far too long. This of course is getting way off topic....

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:23 am

Oh, I think Martin Luther King would be VERY interested.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:41 am

rjm wrote:To Mr. Or Ms. "US":

MY prejudices?

There are those who do or CAN pay taxes. "US" is not all Americans. That would be swell. {I am not a commie; I believe in God and in people owning what is self-evident- I do not want your record collection! Got my own. And aim to keep it.} There are those who struggle to live: the very young, the sick, the old and sick, veterans . . .

You got any room at your Inn? Or is there room just for US.

Yeah. I AM "prejudiced." On behalf of the latter. I am glad to pay whatever taxes I owe and give more than is sensible. Not for deductions!

Best,
rjm


You're simply not making any sense at all. As to your prejudices, you posted:

Facts aside; let's say that "he" is spending "us" into . . .
WHO IS "US"?
"The same God who made you made {them} too."
there but for the grace of God go you and I


I simply said the Obama administration is spending us into oblivion,you tried to turn it into a racial issue. I don't care what color he is,I want him and the Democrats to reign in the spending. Is that too hard for you to understand?
All criticism of Obama is not because he is black, it just might be because people don't think he's doing a great job. Yet you tried (ridiculously,I might add) to bring race and income level into it. It's not about class warfare,it's about totally unsustainable federal spending,which will soon bankrupt this country.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Apr 26, 2011 2:00 am

Stay on topic, please.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Apr 26, 2011 9:31 pm

Sorry folks for getting drawn into some posts that functioned as troll posts.
rjm

Re: Elvis, King and X

Fri Apr 29, 2011 6:37 am

drjohncarpenter wrote:Presley took a date (Barbara Hearn) to the Fairgrounds for a night of fun. It was "colored night" -- unlike the racist ideology that mandated such an evening, Elvis didn't care. He was comfortable attending and bringing his girlfriend. A huge statement.

Hope this clears things up for you.


A nice interview the other day with Mavis Staples shows what Elvis was exposed to, was in to, what helped shape him whilst growing up and why he was anything but a racist.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b010gbs9

Re: Elvis, King and X

Fri Apr 29, 2011 7:29 pm

Julian Grant wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:Presley took a date (Barbara Hearn) to the Fairgrounds for a night of fun. It was "colored night" -- unlike the racist ideology that mandated such an evening, Elvis didn't care. He was comfortable attending and bringing his girlfriend. A huge statement.

Hope this clears things up for you.


A nice interview the other day with Mavis Staples shows what Elvis was exposed to, was in to, what helped shape him whilst growing up and why he was anything but a racist.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/console/b010gbs9

Great interview! I recently learned that Bob Dylan asked Mavis to marry him at one point -- how wild is that?

Re: Elvis, King and X

Sat Apr 30, 2011 5:43 am

Anybody gotta transcript? I cannot do FlashPlayer right now.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Mon Dec 31, 2012 1:50 pm

rjm wrote:Elvis looks like he is running from the cop! He is not staying with him as in concert type photos of the time.
No one looks "dissapointed" except Elvis when he looks all mussed up. The people look calm. The cop looks content but I cannot read the expression. But he is not distressed by a mobbing.
Did Elvis sneak in, try to "blend," and then get tossed out? I mean, he is alone. Like the others took off. Looks on the run and mussed up. There's a cop but Elvis is NOT having fun. Some faces look a little stunned or in comprehending. Mostly they look curious.
I have rarely seen such a look on his face when NOT being mobbed.


if you look closely you'll notice that elvis holds a ball in his left hand. looks like he's in the middle of throwing a ball at a show booth not running away or anything.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Jan 01, 2013 4:30 am

michael grasberger wrote:
rjm wrote:Elvis looks like he is running from the cop! He is not staying with him as in concert type photos of the time.
No one looks "dissapointed" except Elvis when he looks all mussed up. The people look calm. The cop looks content but I cannot read the expression. But he is not distressed by a mobbing.
Did Elvis sneak in, try to "blend," and then get tossed out? I mean, he is alone. Like the others took off. Looks on the run and mussed up. There's a cop but Elvis is NOT having fun. Some faces look a little stunned or in comprehending. Mostly they look curious.
I have rarely seen such a look on his face when NOT being mobbed.


if you look closely you'll notice that elvis holds a ball in his left hand. looks like he's in the middle of throwing a ball at a show booth not running away or anything.


Anything is possible. Hope he had a ball! ;)

Happy New Year! !

rjm

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Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:23 am

Elvis wasn't a racist, but the MM guys also said that he would never date a black woman, and that he wouldn't have liked that Lisa Marie married Michael Jackson since he was black. He thought it was more natural for white men to date white women. He treated all people nice and with respect, to me that's not a racist. Sometimes it seems like black people try to put Elvis in two different categories: either as a racist or as one who fought for the rights of the black people. Neither of them is correct imo.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Tue Jan 01, 2013 7:46 am

Xaykev wrote:Elvis wasn't a racist, but the MM guys also said that he would never date a black woman, and that he wouldn't have liked that Lisa Marie married Michael Jackson since he was black. He thought it was more natural for white men to date white women. He treated all people nice and with respect, to me that's not a racist. Sometimes it seems like black people try to put Elvis in two different categories: either as a racist or as one who fought for the rights of the black people. Neither of them is correct imo.


Would you want anyone to say what you "thought" about your daughter's relationship(s) 17 years after you died? (I wouldn't want anyone to say what they thought I "thought" right now, actually.) It's one thing to share your own memories, another to speculate what another person "would think" or what they thought . . . (about something so personal). We have absolutely no way of knowing. By his actions toward them, he certainly didn't think that Jerry and Myrna were "unnatural." Not at all.

rjm

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:00 am

Great stuff! I've been interested in this picture since I first saw it a while back. On this thread there is some speculation as to what Exactly is going on in the Juneteenth Fairgrounds picture.

I have some info on it that might help.

I just showed this pic to lovely Barbara Hearn Smith just the other day to ask her. Here is what she told me as she sat right next to me staring at it....

Bob Williams (Memphis Newspaper) was the photographer and he took not only this picture from the Fairgrounds, but also the one from earlier (not later) in the evening at the house on Audubon Drive. She said Mr. Williams asked them to pick up a couple stuffed animals for the picture before they walked out the door to head there.

She said they walked right up to the gate at the Fairgrounds with an officer accompanying them (the same officer you see in the picture) and asked to go in and they happily obliged her and Elvis. They rode a few rides and played some games. In the pic it is indeed a ball he is holding and 'it's a game where you try to knock down these little upright dolls' ... as she explained it to me. The folks standing behind him were just spectating, (someone earlier on the thread I think mentioned the folks in pic didn't look necessarily happy) but I think they may be just misinterpreting pic, you can see a smile on a couple of their faces.

In the picture off to the right in the crowd you will see a taller white man, that is Bob Johnson The Commercial Appeal in 1956 (Same guy that reported the story of Million Dollar Quartet in Dec. later that year) and of course the photographer is Bob Williams, he followed them.

Oh and she said the officer (she could not remember his name...but bless her heart she tried) was the same officer that accompanied Elvis at other venues around town. She remembered him as a happy guy (regardless his appearance here) that enjoyed those assignments tailing Elvis.

Hope that helps.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:48 am

Thanks a million! Any first-hand info about that day is priceless!

So, he took his own security (not his usual fellas, either) and clearly took a friendly photographer.

Two newspapermen, yet it didn't make the local papers. (Well, it did make the Memphis World, in December.) Which suggests the lines of communication between the dual newspaper systems (black and white), were open! That IS significant, historically.

And it seemed well-planned. He knew to bring press. And an officer he knew. Intriguing.

What a mysterious young man that Elvis. :D

If only he, Elvis, were around to tell us the rest!

Thanks again!

rjm
P.S. -- The interview with Mavis Staples that Julian posted a couple years ago is no longer a valid link. I never got to see it then, because I didn't have a real browser - just a keyboard Kindle. If anyone has it somewhere . . . I would be most grateful.

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Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 5:41 pm

No problem rjm. Glad to be able to shed a little more light.
I'm a stickler for as much detail information as we can get whenever I see a picture, so I am glad I remembered this picture when we were sitting there talking with her.

She said it was nothing more than Elvis being home for a few days before having to leave town again soon and just wanted to go out and have some fun. Bob Williams had been over there earlier that afternoon taking pictures while Elvis was in the yard with friends/ fans. When he started talking to her about going to the fair grounds that night Bob Williams ears perked up and asked if he could tag along. You know how Elvis was especially back then? She said he didn't bat an eye and told Bob "if you want to follow us along feel free", but it wasn't necessarily an invite.
Of course Bob Williams must have called his other friend with Commercial Appeal Bob Johnson, I guess that's how he ended up standing there in the background of the picture.

Barb said she is in the picture you just can't see her because Elvis is standing right in front of her :-) It just struck me as funny when she said that. She pointed to Elvis' left shoulder in the picture and said if you look real close you can see the corner of her forehead poking over his shoulder.

Oh I feel it is also important and relevant to add that she said Elvis was color blind. Absolutely, They both were. She said he went there for no reason other than to have some fun and didn't give a second thought to the night being for anybody of any specific color.
It was nice to hear her verify that but it was just as we already suspected.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:51 pm

1Sixstring wrote:Great stuff! I've been interested in this picture since I first saw it a while back. On this thread there is some speculation as to what Exactly is going on in the Juneteenth Fairgrounds picture.

I have some info on it that might help.

I just showed this pic to lovely Barbara Hearn Smith just the other day to ask her. Here is what she told me as she sat right next to me staring at it....

Bob Williams (Memphis Newspaper) was the photographer and he took not only this picture from the Fairgrounds, but also the one from earlier (not later) in the evening at the house on Audubon Drive. She said Mr. Williams asked them to pick up a couple stuffed animals for the picture before they walked out the door to head there.

She said they walked right up to the gate at the Fairgrounds with an officer accompanying them (the same officer you see in the picture) and asked to go in and they happily obliged her and Elvis. They rode a few rides and played some games. In the pic it is indeed a ball he is holding and 'it's a game where you try to knock down these little upright dolls' ... as she explained it to me. The folks standing behind him were just spectating, (someone earlier on the thread I think mentioned the folks in pic didn't look necessarily happy) but I think they may be just misinterpreting pic, you can see a smile on a couple of their faces.

In the picture off to the right in the crowd you will see a taller white man, that is Bob Johnson The Commercial Appeal in 1956 (Same guy that reported the story of Million Dollar Quartet in Dec. later that year) and of course the photographer is Bob Williams, he followed them.

Oh and she said the officer (she could not remember his name...but bless her heart she tried) was the same officer that accompanied Elvis at other venues around town. She remembered him as a happy guy (regardless his appearance here) that enjoyed those assignments tailing Elvis.

Hope that helps.

1Sixstring wrote:No problem rjm. Glad to be able to shed a little more light.
I'm a stickler for as much detail information as we can get whenever I see a picture, so I am glad I remembered this picture when we were sitting there talking with her.

She said it was nothing more than Elvis being home for a few days before having to leave town again soon and just wanted to go out and have some fun. Bob Williams had been over there earlier that afternoon taking pictures while Elvis was in the yard with friends/ fans. When he started talking to her about going to the fair grounds that night Bob Williams ears perked up and asked if he could tag along. You know how Elvis was especially back then? She said he didn't bat an eye and told Bob "if you want to follow us along feel free", but it wasn't necessarily an invite.
Of course Bob Williams must have called his other friend with Commercial Appeal Bob Johnson, I guess that's how he ended up standing there in the background of the picture.

Barb said she is in the picture you just can't see her because Elvis is standing right in front of her :-) It just struck me as funny when she said that. She pointed to Elvis' left shoulder in the picture and said if you look real close you can see the corner of her forehead poking over his shoulder.

Oh I feel it is also important and relevant to add that she said Elvis was color blind. Absolutely, They both were. She said he went there for no reason other than to have some fun and didn't give a second thought to the night being for anybody of any specific color.
It was nice to hear her verify that but it was just as we already suspected.


This is all very neat information. Does Barbara Hearn Smith still reside in Trenton? Her site mentions a bed & breakfast business there.

Home - Barbara Hearn - Girlfriend of Elvis - Official Site
http://www.barbarahearn.com/

I agree that we see Memphis newspaperman Bob Johnson in the background of the photo being discussed, but there does not appear to be anyone behind Elvis. Note that Barbara was wearing a very prominent, light-colored dress that evening, and there is no trace of it in the photo.


560619_Barbara Hearn and Elvis en route to fair.JPG


I have some more on Juneteenth I will add next.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:55 pm

Of the many known photos from his evening out with Barbara, the one we are discussing is most significant. The crowd is there to check out the local boy who gave an explosive performance of Big Mama Thornton's #1 R&B hit, "Hound Dog," on the Milton Berle TV show exactly two weeks before.

And he is also the singer whose song "Heartbreak Hotel" is #7 on Billboard's R&B chart this week, along with "I Want You, I Need You, I Love You" and "My Baby Left Me" at #10, an "unprecedented stunt, for an essentially c.&w. artist" according to the magazine's R&B guru, Bill Simon.


Billboard Jun 16 1956 p43.JPG
Billboard, June 16, 1956


This less-cropped version shows the afore-mentioned policeman nearby while Elvis joins in the celebration of "Juneteenth."


Image

Elvis at Memphis Fairgrounds, Tuesday, June 19, 1956


What is "Juneteenth"?


Juneteenth

Juneteenth, also known as Freedom Day or Emancipation Day, is a holiday in the United States honoring African American heritage by commemorating the announcement of the abolition of slavery in the U.S. State of Texas in 1865. Celebrated on June 19, the term is a portmanteau of June and nineteenth, and is recognized as a state holiday in 37 states of the United States.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juneteenth


Juneteenth Celebration | The History of the Juneteenth Celebration

Perhaps the three most significant documents in U.S. history that exemplify America’s passion for freedom are the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and the Emancipation Proclamation. Although each has maintained its rightful place in the annals of American history, only the Bill of Rights and the Constitution have identifiable dates and cultural festivities. Each year, America celebrates the Fourth of July, Constitution Day and Flag Day, all of which have developed into an expression and ceremony of appreciation by the American People with special events emphasizing the historical importance of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.

The Emancipation Proclamation, which is particularly significant to African Americans, has not until recently received its rightful day of national appreciation. With the resurgence of the African American community’s celebration of Juneteenth, America is growing in its awareness and appreciation of this highly meaningful document.

The celebration of Juneteenth is not only a showcase event of the African American community’s positive contributions to the American way of life, but it also makes a statement for all Americans that the United States is truly the “Land of the Free.” Juneteenth is an expression and extension of American freedom and, like the Fourth of July, a time for all Americans to celebrate our independence, human rights, civil rights and freedom.

http://juneteenth.azurewebsites.net/?p=81



Did coincidence play a part in Elvis and Barbara going to the Fairgrounds that Tuesday evening?

No way.
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Last edited by drjohncarpenter on Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:07 pm

stan from tintane wrote:Yes, Barbara is still in Trenton.
She had a reunion last year (after many years) with photographer Bob Williams.


Is "1Sixstring" another account for you? If so, that is a forum violation.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:13 pm

stan from tintane wrote:
drjohncarpenter wrote:
stan from tintane wrote:Yes, Barbara is still in Trenton.
She had a reunion last year (after many years) with photographer Bob Williams.


Is "1Sixstring" another account for you? If so, that is a forum violation.


Hand on heart, being totally honest,absolutely not.
My ONLY account here is this one, why do you ask ?


My direct question was put to 1Sixstring, not you.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Thu Jun 27, 2013 3:28 am

Sorry Doc,
I was at work all day just now saw this.

Great observation about the outfit she had on, I made note of that myself.
When I asked her if she was in the area when this picture was taken she laughed and said "I'm in the picture of course I was there" then she put her finger on Elvis' left shoulder and pointed at the little bit of forehead that can be seen. She swears that was her.

But we're talking what, a moment in time 57 years ago? I can barely remember specifics about my early 20's some twenty years ago, so it's possible she's in the crowd but not standing where she thinks she was. But because she certainly seemed to have a thorough instant recall of the other folks in the picture, I didn't want to contradict or challenge her. But if that's not her I'd be willing to bet she's standing darn close to that person.

Thanks for posting the Billboard magazine page from June 16th of that year. Very interesting.

And yes they are still at Holly Tree Manor. My wife is a huge fan of Bed & Breakfasts So when we met her and her husband sometime last year they struck up a conversation and Barb and Jim invited us to stay there sometime. So we went out there this past weekend. Both of them just fascinating sweet people. Aside from any Elvis talk, just about anything else we talked about was a real treat.

Stan, She also mentioned that reunion that happened last year. Just briefly though.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Thu Jun 27, 2013 3:30 am

1Sixstring wrote:Sorry Doc,
I was at work all day just now saw this.

Great observation about the outfit she had on, I made note of that myself.
When I asked her if she was in the area when this picture was taken she laughed and said "I'm in the picture of course I was there" then she put her finger on Elvis' left shoulder and pointed at the little bit of forehead that can be seen. She swears that was her.

But we're talking what, a moment in time 57 years ago? I can barely remember specifics about my early 20's some twenty years ago, so it's possible she's in the crowd but not standing where she thinks she was. But because she certainly seemed to have a thorough instant recall of the other folks in the picture, I didn't want to contradict or challenge her. But if that's not her I'd be willing to bet she's standing darn close to that person.

Thanks for posting the Billboard magazine page from June 16th of that year. Very interesting.

And yes they are still at Holly Tree Manor. My wife is a huge fan of Bed & Breakfasts So when we met her and her husband sometime last year they struck up a conversation and Barb and Jim invited us to stay there sometime. So we went out there this past weekend. Both of them just fascinating sweet people. Aside from any Elvis talk, just about anything else we talked about was a real treat.

Stan, She also mentioned that reunion that happened last year. Just briefly though.


Thank you for your kind reply.

Re: Elvis, King and X

Thu Jun 27, 2013 3:32 am

Sorry by the way. I've done some trolling and reading but this is my first foray at posting.
I will get my profile with a picture updated to help eliminate confusion in the future :-)