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Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:01 pm
Having finally been able to listen to the Paul Okenfold remix from Elvis Japan (not in stereo), I can only say I think it is a disaster.
The main melody of Rubberneckin’ is fairly limited and monotonous. It needs colour and this is what the original recording achieved with imaginative backing, vocal chanting and hand clapping, and good orchestration. The PO version is about as subtle as a steamroller and seems to emphasise the monotony. It’s a noisy mess, with a strange sort of echo on Elvis’ voice.
My son has downloaded two other remixes for me. The 2003 Groove Remix (3.28) is excellent and though there is lots going on, it’s all crystal clear. The 2002 Remix I have is longer (4.35) and quite imaginative too, with repeated “First Thing In The Morning” , “That’s My Philosophy” and “It’s called Rubberneckin’ ” sections.
It’s been a long time since “Conversation” and I think the tactic of waiting a while was the right one. However, I am so disappointed that, after what I understood to have been a careful process of listening to various remixes, the key artistic personnel at EPE (presumably) have sanctioned the PO disaster. I agree that a “remix” tag is needed to arouse the interest of the DJs and general public, but even the original Memphis 1969 recording is not a million miles away from a sound that is right for 2003 and is much better than the new release.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:10 pm
I agree with you 100%,Steve.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:23 pm
Remember, the first versions of ALLC [from radio broadcasts] that we heard were not as good as the final product.
Let's at least wait until we have heard a proper stereo version of 'Rubberneckin' before we condemn it outright !
I agree it doesn't sound as punchy or as catchy as ALLC in its present form.
Don't forget there is a long dance-mix we have yet to hear !
Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:30 pm
I like your optimism,Colin,but a poster on this board has the promo already,and has said the the longer version is even worse!
Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:13 pm
I'm forever the optimist !
I guess if you didn't like 'ALLC', the longer version would have sounded worse, wouldn't it ?
It seems to me that where 'ALLC' was mixed with air-play & the dance floor in mind, 'Rubberneckin' seems to have been mixed primarily to sound good on the dance floor !
At high volumes [through a half-decent amp] there is a thumping dance beat; listened to at low volume, it is less impressive !
Mon Jul 21, 2003 5:59 pm
I am a fan of all remixes, anything that can get Elvis enjoyed by the youngsters of today, and keep him in the charts etc. But with ALLC are we all forgetting the fantastic publicity boost it got with the Nike advert on the tv. I have downloaded the groove remix and the #4 Oakenfold remix from Japan, and after constantly playing them back to back I tend to think the groove is the better of the two. Its excellent when you turn the sub on and let the bass run wild so to speak.
I had never heard of Paul Oakenfold until this recent remix, come to that I hadn't heard of jxl either, but credit to him for getting Elvis back where he belongs, I hope P.O. does the same job and like the dj says, lets hope lightening does strike twice. But my point is I don't think it will without another Nike or similar get hold of it and bring it to the fore of the general public. ALLC is still heard on adverts, in tv shows, and in the recent film Bruce Almighty etc. I hope P.O. Rubberneckin' can do the same, but something serious is lacking.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:10 pm
I think the Oakenfold remix is awful! The JXL remix was fresh, new, original and very well crafted. This mix just pust a hideous booming dance beat and ruins and already funky song.
If these remixes are to keep Elvis in the public eye and keep generating hits then i think they need to be special and rare. Oakenfold is just jumping on the bandwagon with his bland treatment of Rubberneckin'.
This will ruin all the new found interest in all things Elvis. I think releasing the unadulterated 1969 recording would gain more interest than this rubbish. It may be popular in dance clubs but it will bomb on the charts.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 7:09 pm
the groovy mix is way better than the "PO complete mess mix" !!!!
the groovy mix : imaginative respect of the original performer
very atractive and catchy beat
the PO stuff : boring wall of sound no respect for the original music
Mon Jul 21, 2003 7:46 pm
I'm with ColinB on this one. You can hardly condemn a song after listening to a poor quality MP3 sample.
I think the song will do well (especially with the younger crowd - who will be the main people buying the song).
I like it as it is; although being an Elvis fan, I much prefer to hear Elvis as clear as possible. Being a fan, I would have chosen the 1969 standard mix - but this is for the young record buying public, who, I think will love it.
It's got a good beat and is ideally suited for the dance floor.
I hope it does well.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 8:14 pm
I try to remain optimistic, but I think in order for it to do anything remotely close to the success of ALLC, then it has to be a much better song. Not to say last year's remix was lacking in any way, but the idea of an Elvis remix is not exactly fresh anymore, so it just kind of feels like a sequel. And sequels don't very often do as well as the originals. That's just another built-in hurdle this release is facing, as I see it.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 8:43 pm
It’s very difficult to judge the Oakenfold remix from the available MP3 sample. I don’t personally like what he has done with the vocals, judging by this sample, but I expect a high quality version of the same mix will sound better. The added beats work well though, and I can see certain similarities here with what JXL did with “ALLC”.
What is worth considering here though, is the purpose of this remix is to promote an album of original master recordings, and hopefully attract more new fans to the Elvis Presley catalogue. Therefore, if the record is successful RCA/BMG will have achieved what they set out to do, and I don’t think it’s that important whether the mix appeals to us long term fans or not. The broader appeal is the key here.
I think there have been some reasonable arguments in comparing the other mixes, and particularly for the ‘groove mix’, but Paul Oakenfold is a huge name in the field of dance/music and remix production, and I’m sure this fact wasn’t lost on RCA/BMG when they were deciding which remix to approve. The combined appeal of Elvis and Oakenfold over different generations should guarantee both airplay and a hit record.
Mon Jul 21, 2003 9:58 pm
Anyone know the credit on this single ?
"Elvis vs Paul Oakenfold" ?
Tue Jul 22, 2003 1:28 am
To Rockinrebel :
Some good points, well-made. Thanks.
Tue Jul 22, 2003 1:28 am
Oh my god!! A big twist. Dont beleive what happened. I tuned into London's Premium Rock station XFM on the internet and they completely gave Oakenfold the brush. They blamed BMG for stealing "stole" an idea from a fan and refused to play the new PO mix.
They blamed BMG for going with the money and not staying true to Elvis.
Personally I hear what they are saying, the PO mix is only true to PO not Elvis.
But as a House DJ myself, what I can tell you about PO is that no one in the UK likes him, its been that way for at least a year now as his last album flopped. He got the BBC job for Big Brother recently because he was cheap. His record label (distributed by BMG) are tryin to revive him.
They then in turn played the Groove mix at the start of the show as the preferred track and indicated that they intend to start a campaign to stop playing the Oakenfold and only play the Groove mix. They also said loud and clear that the Groove mix was the best ever mix, even better than JXL and mentioned Joseph by name calling him "we are backing the under dog"!
I hear now that other independant radio stations in the UK are jumping on the bandwagon on the Groove mix. This is going to be a nightmare for BMG as DJ's have written off PO and are going for the Groove mix as their preferred version! The Groove mix is not even on the single.
Also tuned into the Chicago radio station on the website as mentioned in a previous thread, they opened the show with the Groove mix and he (Bryan I think) said he "prefer this version to the official version" and gave Joseph 100% credit.
I think BMG have a problem, they should just do a double A side, they cant loose, then everyones happy.
But for the time being, the story is only just starting so it appears. eXCITING!!!!
Tue Jul 22, 2003 2:30 pm
how can breathing life into a song (such as ALLC and now rubberneckin), that will enrich its appeal to the general public and so further the name of elvis be called a disaster!!
i am all for the remixes (as long as they do not touch the classics). ALLC and rubberneckin were just known to elvis fans, but now ALLC will become a classic and so hopefully rubberneckin!!!
keep the remixes coming!!!!
Tue Jul 22, 2003 2:35 pm
release the original remastered and sell it to some purfume company for an add then get loads of sexy babes having there necks kissed and rubbed !
Tue Jul 22, 2003 5:23 pm
well Richard my point exactly, although I dont dislike remixes it needs another media outlet besides radio to get the people to sit up and take notice, whether you like ALLC or not, it was Nike that sold that release not the radio airplay.
by getting the right company to use any Elvis track would virtually guarantee it getting in the charts. I would prefer the younger generation to listen to the classic Elvis and let them understand the magic for themselves as we have done, and still do when a new import is released etc
If it has to be remixes to get across, fine, but its a pity that music has evolved to the jungle-bob-rap-crap-hip-hop-shit- bollocks of today. The young generation dont know what they are missing
but lets face it remixes or not, Elvis belongs in the charts one way shape form or another and if its got to be remixes of this magnitude then TTWII
Tue Jul 22, 2003 10:25 pm
It is great being an Elvis fan today with all the new releases and projects that are being planned.
Many of you know that I never have posted messages on this board or any other board before. Although over the years, I have always looked through to see what interesting subjects us fans are talking about. But over the past month I keep seeing the subject about Rubberneckin remix come up which now, I have been watching closely.
This being my first time on the message board was sparked by the topic of "Rubberneckin" which I believed was a great song not only in the film "Change of Habit" but the live version as well, they both really kick! Like I said, I don't do message boards but I really do feel strongly about the Rubberneckin remix situation and would like to share my opinion with you all.
Having listened to both the Oakenfold and "Groove Mix" versions I opt for the latter. It is true to the original release and shows more of a creative aspect by using the same musical tracks, an unbelievable idea and one that I think works. I would like to see more releases such as this!
I listened to the Oakenfold mix a few times. He seems to have thrown everything into this mix. We in the States say "you've thrown everything into it except the kitchen sink." Meaning, what a mess! Although I think this would appeal to a more less than 20 years age group with all those unnecessary whirling noises, the Groove mix would definitely satisfy a wider audience.
This single is also intended to promote the CD 2nd to none that will be released. So why not use the "Groove Mix" which is a compliment to the CD. Oakenfold's mix doesn't fall within the mix of the soon to be released CD. I know BMG though process, would sell as many CDs based on the sampling of "Rubberneckin".
What happens when they purchase the CD and all the material is original, not the mixed versions. Remember "A Little Less Conversation" had the promotional push of a major ad campaign to help sales. I would love to see the "Groove Mix" added to the release of the single and CD album release.
It is us the Elvis fans who have driven sales through the years and it seems we have been neglected on this release. I agree with bringing new fans on board, but don't forget your base.
Now we all have to accept the fact that the Oakenfold version is being released. After all the money spent on it, they can't back away now. We would just have to accept it and I believe this is a major blunder of BMG, but if they had sense they would include the Groove mix as an additional track on the CD and all will be OK again.
The benefits of this I believe first and foremost, BMG cant loose. Also it makes a more exciting single (that I would buy) and would I believe, get to No 1.
Also everyone is happy and all the benefits are for BMG. I would love a version of a remastered (I believe has not happened yet) copy of the Groove mix on a CD. Not the MP3 version I have here. It's exciting and it's still an Elvis track. Oakenfold has stayed true to himself and not Elvis at all. It's like he just put a record over his stuff. It has too much over sampling that has destroyed the original completely. At least with the JXL remix, that did not happen.
Imagine 2 Elvis No. 1s at the same time. That would be a first! Come on BMG, get your heads together, this is a unique opportunity!
I have spoken to many people regarding this and after hearing that the radios prefer the Groove mix; we must try and push this forward. Also now I believe fan clubs are joining in the debate. I don't blame them at all!
I would like to see BMG release the Oakenfold version for the clubs; "Groove Mix" for us loyalist and new comers into the Elvis world.
NOW that CD single would be worth buying if the 2 versions were included and you can reserve me the first copy.
Is not amazing we have 2 English guys one mixes it in north London another in south London, sheer coincidence.
As for the video, if one will be made, use the version in the film "Change of Habit". With today’s technology they can cut Elvis from the movie and paste him to a different environment. This is where they can include different footage to update the look and feel. Elvis looks so cool and fits in today as he did back then.
I am placing this message on all the relevant boards relating to Rubberneckin. As far as I believe BMG have not yet started pressing the CD for the September release which means if we all shout can scream about it, they will see sense to include the Groove mix on the single.
So, I wish to start a campaign, not to scrap the Oakenfold version because that is too late, but to include the Groove mix to satisfy everybody with the biggest benefits going to BMG and Elvis with 2 hits at the same time. NO one can loose and it's great for Elvis!
Please share your support on this. I know radio stations in the UK and some here in the States have and fans are starting but we have got to be heard and be heard quick before it's too late.
I will continue to support the King! Thank you for allowing me to offer my opinions and look forward to healthier dialog presented on this board.
Wed Jul 23, 2003 2:32 am
from a technical point of view the final groove mix and the Oakenfield mix are both a disaster. However credits should be given to the Groove Mix as this is not made on pro- equipment.
Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:33 pm
From a technical point of view the final groove mix and the Oakenfield mix are both a disaster. However credits should be given to the Groove mix as this is not made on pro-equipment.]
Well hold on a second there, as I have stated on a previous thread...the Groove mix WAS recorded on pro-equipment.
The Groove mix was remixed at a professional recording studio: The LMC sound studio's, Brixton, South London, UK, and is a most deffinet pro-mix.
Wed Jul 23, 2003 2:32 pm
Yes, you are right. I have read on past threads that it was done on a windows 98 pc or whatever. I just checked my DJ listings book LMC is listed. And as a DJ Brixton is well known for the music produced there by DJ's. Brixton has the largest underground clubs in London and that is well known.