Anything about Elvis
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Mon Jul 07, 2003 2:39 pm

N880EP wrote:BTW, ...... are those 5 (five) titles above enough to keep you busy or shall I recommend some more? On second thought, I'll just wait until you are done reading them and then get back to you with some more in a couple of years.


Well, since I made some unpleasant experiences regarding personal "wars" and things like that - mainly on Elvis messageboards BTW - I usually try to keep away from them. Things like that do not help anybody. The do not help the casual fan who's looking for discussion or information, they do not help the more regular users, they do not help the messageboard at all and last but not least they do not add any good to the reputation Elvis fans have in the broad public. These are the reason I try not to get involved.

On the other hand I'm getting mad when I read comments like the ones above. Especially when they concern friends. You have no idea what you're talking about. Your attempt to bash a user like likethebike by suggesting he wasn't able to comprehend more than what you might think is trash is platitudinous and poor. Either you haven't read any of his postings (of which 95% are better than most of what I've read on this board by people like you) or it is you who can't follow "one coherent thought". So I suggest you better think twice before you post stuff like this again.

Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:47 pm

see-see-rider wrote: ........ I'm getting mad when I read comments like the ones above. Especially when they concern friends. You have no idea what you're talking about.


To dismiss a book such as "The Death of Elvis" and recommend other books such as "Elvis and Me (Priscilla)" & "A-Z" (the notoriously inaccurate "encylopedia") as "essentials" is a very clear demonstration of somebody not knowing what they are talking about. If you are defending such choices, then the same applies to you too.

You are getting mad because your emotions are clouding your judgement. Take a chill-pill, mellow-out, for you are wound-up way too tight. How about breaking out one of "likethebike's" genius recommendations?

see-see-rider wrote:Either you haven't read any of his postings (of which 95% are better than most of what I've read on this board by people like you)or it is you who can't follow "one coherent thought".


Nope, sorry, but it is "likethebike" that cannot follow a coherent thought - especially on this thread. Numerous examples of this have already been pointed out; perhaps you missed them .......... but don't fret - for there is yet another lame-brained recommendation from our resident savant:

"The Rough Guide To Elvis" an essential book? ..... well, nice, but hardly "essential." How about "The Girls Guide To Elvis" too?

("The Rough Guide To Elvis" - the all-time GREATEST Elvis book!" ....... BLAH-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!)


N8
... just a fan .... (not an expert, although much to my chagrin, some still persist in labelling me as such) :wink:

Mon Jul 07, 2003 4:06 pm

I'm not classing the Rough Guide to Elvis as essential, but it's a great "primer". I haven't found it to be inaccurate, merely what it states itself to be, a rough guide.

If you hadn't read anything else other than the papers over the last twenty-five years I'd have to give it points for being a good starting place. (And it feels like it was written by an unbiased/non-rose coloured glasses fan)

It's a slightly more sophisticated version of the "Ladybird" books we had as kids which introduced us to all sorts of stuff, but were by no means the definitive works.

Mon Jul 07, 2003 4:19 pm

N880EP - Like I said I'm not interested in personal "wars" or stuff like that. I don't care if somebody has another opinion that's okay that is what messageboards are there for. I just wanted to let you know that I didn't like the way you're attacking a person that I'm sure I know a little longer and better than you. There's a life outside this MB and on this outside world likethebike has pretty much proven that he doesn't deserve a treatment like yours believe me. Maybe he overracted a little bit, too. He usually doesn't.

Well, "The Rough Guide To Elvis" is INDEED an essential Elvis book IMO because it sheds its light on Elvis' career in a new way. Next to Gurlanick and Jorgensen I have never read anything as good as this. You should read it. :) If afterwards you can't agree that's okay. But don't make it a personal statement against somebody you obviously feel is a little more of an "expert" than you are. I can't remember a single posting by you but I can remember 100 by likethebike. Probably not on this board - but this board isn't the end of the world either ...

I would also be careful with comments like "lame-brained". You usually don't make friends this way. And it really looks like you could need some.

Mon Jul 07, 2003 6:32 pm

see-see-rider wrote:I don't care if somebody has another opinion that's okay that is what messageboards are there for.


Very much agreed.

see-see-rider wrote:Well, "The Rough Guide To Elvis" is INDEED an essential Elvis book IMO because it sheds its light on Elvis' career in a new way. I can't remember a single posting by you but I can remember 100 by likethebike.


As I've stated previously, "Rough Guide" is nice, but not essential, IMO. We can most definitely agree to disagree.

BTW, "see-see-rider", you are not on my list of preferred posters that I'm interested in reading either.

see-see-rider wrote:You usually don't make friends this way. And it really looks like you could need some.So I suggest you better think twice before you post stuff like this again.


You really do crack me up, you know that?

see-see-rider wrote:I would also be careful with comments like "lame-brained". So I suggest you better think twice before you post stuff like this again.


Um, "see-see", .......... just tell me when I should begin quaking in my boots OK?


N8
... just a fan ....

Mon Jul 07, 2003 6:58 pm

N880EP wrote:As I've stated previously, "Rough Guide" is nice, but not essential, IMO. We can most definitely agree to disagree.

BTW, "see-see-rider", you are not on my list of preferred posters that I'm interested in reading either.


Like Elvis said: "You can win 'em all ...!" So to be honest: I don't care. :D That's what I do, that's what you do, you had your five minutes of attention you can't get in real life and that's how we should leave it. At least that is what I'll do.

The way you're editing quotes and how you answer on them to suggest I'd threaten you shows pretty much what your real intenion is. "Lame-brained" is an insult and that's what you did. Not I. - I only referenced to the rules of this messageboard ...

Mon Jul 07, 2003 11:40 pm

You can't get over the value of your own opinion.

Make a compelling argument in favor of "The Death of Elvis" and maybe you'll get the affirmation you desperately crave. You never answered any questions regarding how the specifics of knowing what drugs were in Elvis' body conveys any insight into Elvis' music.

This is my last word on this. You are not worth the effort.

Tue Jul 08, 2003 12:37 am

They're not Elvis books but if Guralnick and Jorgensen and some of the others pique your interest, check out Nik Cohn's Elvis chapter in "Rock From the Beginning" later reprinted as "AWOPBOPLOOPBOWAWOPBAMBOOM" and Michael Grey's chapter on Elvis in his "Song and Dance Man: the Life and Music of Bob Dylan." Both really capture the essence of Elvis' breakthrough and what it meant to adolescents like Dylan all over the world.

Cohn is an especially great read. The Elvis chapter is not exactly what you would call a factually portrait but it's a wonderful interpretation. This is one of the most direct and funniest rock histories ever written. It also had a large share of influence particularly on writers like Marcus and Marsh. When the book was written in 1968 there really were no other books on rock.

Tue Jul 08, 2003 2:13 am

likethebike wrote:You can't get over the value of your own opinion.


Actually, it would appear that you are the one that can't "get over", nor comprehend my opinion.

likethebike wrote:Make a compelling argument in favor of "The Death of Elvis" and maybe you'll get the affirmation you desperately crave. You never answered any questions regarding how the specifics of knowing what drugs were in Elvis' body conveys any insight into Elvis' music.


Again, you are making some gross oversimplifications of the issues. The book, although grisly in detail, documents Elvis' myraid of health problems, psychological problems (depression, difficult interpersonal relationships on many levels with others, especially women) and the resultant addiction to prescription drugs (obviously aided by willing licensed physicians) in an attempt to quell the very real physical and psychological cravings his body & mind both desired to continue existing in a real and alternate reality (ie: escapism).

Harcore fans, such as myself, will read just about anything on Elvis ......... as your recommendations also point out ............ but, anyway you slice it "The Death of......" is unqualifyingly an "essential" volume to gain a complete understanding of Elvis, the human being. If you find the contents disagreeable, then that is your problem. It is also why you so readily dismiss this book as merely a "curiosity." You are wrong. The book is the only one of its kind ever published to responsibily and factually dismiss the rumors / myths of the other causes of Elvis' death: suicide, cancer, and murder (all of which continue to persist to this very day and believed by a very gullible public) ....... and ............ expose the transparency of the "official" cause of death from an aberrant cardiac rhythm for what it ultimately is - a meaningless play on words.

In case you've also missed another obvious point, we no longer have anymore music from Elvis because of the events that occured on August 16, 1977; for this reason alone, the book is pertinent and essential. I also find it fascinating to understand Elvis' choices in music, especially in his final two albums (From EP Blvd. & Moody Blue) and how the song selections mirrored Elvis own life and state of mind at the time. JMO, mind you.

You say you read the book. If so, then you did not process the information. This is glaringly evident from your earlier words (already pointed out in a previous post, but I will do so again since you seem to require the repetition of information to comprehend it properly....) :

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"likethebike wrote:
..... As for the coverup, it was unveiled 10 years before. There was nothing sinister about it. God, forbid someone try to protect Elvis' reputation. It was uncovered. Oh boy. . "

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The book was the result of almost a decade of investigations that picked up where the 20/20 investigations ended. To spell it out in simpler terms for you - Elvis died in 1977, the 20/20 investigations were carried out the following two years or so, ............. the book was published approx. a decade (10 years) later. A very simple, yet critical point ........ you missed. Apparently, it is not the only critical information that eludes you.

The book is also essential in the lessons it serves up as to the consequences of "star-struck" physicians too willing to accomodate their patients (even to their ultimate detriment) and in the dangers of unchecked power by officials in office (Memphis City officials) in that they can successfully whitewash the public and cover-up events simply because they not do suit a "reality" that the public wishes to see (or, ..in your own words "to protect Elvis' reputation"). If they can do it and get away with it with somebody as famous as Elvis Presley ............ it can easily be done with your average "Joe Citizen" (which takes the relevance of the contents of the Thompson & Cole book to an entirely different level of jurisprudence).

likethebike wrote:This is my last word on this. You are not worth the effort.


It would seem that I have heard these words from you before.


It is always about the music, but also .............. so much more.


N8
... just a fan ....

Tue Jul 08, 2003 3:07 am

I haven't read the book so can't really contribute to the discussion - appreciate the elaboration of the books contents though N8.

For the record I would say N8 contributes many useful, balanced and informative postings on this board - not taking sides but that's just my opinion.

It is possible to disagree without falling out people ;)

Tue Jul 08, 2003 3:38 am

Another fine non-Elvis book to check out if you can find it is Dave Marsh's overview of Elvis' canon in the original Rolling Stone Record Guide. Marsh, while writing the book, was asked who he thought was the most underrated rocker. Marsh's answer was Elvis. His essay in the book did a lot to redeem Elvis' reputation with the rock elite. Further, he laid the groundwork for his later in work in his own Elvis book where he put Elvis' music of the 60s and the 70s into an appreciative context.

Also again if you can find it is Jon Landau's great essay "In Praise of Elvis Presley". Originally, printed in Rolling Stone, this review of a Boston show in 1971 is the first time any writer attempted to see the 70s Elvis as the artist he was and not the artist they wanted him to be. It can be found in the out of print Landau anthology "Too Late to Stop Now" also it is reprinted in Martin Torgoff's "The Complete Elvis". You may also be able to find it on the RS website.

Though not complete books along with Greil Marcus' essay in "Mystery Train", Guralnick's reviews of "Elvis Country" and "From Elvis in Memphis", and the Cohn essay they formulated the first attempts to address Elvis as an artist. And the views they espoused sat at the center of the argument for the next 20 years.

Tue Jul 08, 2003 4:05 am

Would this discussion be helped if we set some criteria for evaluating what is essential: eg. historical value/content; level of detail; rarity of photos in book; investigative rigor; depth of analysis, etc :lol: