Anything about Elvis
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Thu Jun 26, 2003 4:19 pm

elvis-fan wrote: ..... the colonel ..... Even when he had to start getting creative about the venues that Elvis played, smaller buildings, smaller towns to ensure a sold out crowd.



Elvis' penultimate and final performances (Cincinnati & Indy) had 16,000 .............. & ............. 18,000 fans in attendance respectively. Looks to me that the venues were getting larger ...... and still selling out.


N8
... just a fan ....

Thu Jun 26, 2003 10:33 pm

I agree with you N. This was stated without corroboration in the Goldman book and people have accepted it for years. The Colonel may have featured Elvis in smaller cities but the arenas were just as large. I don't know of any Elvis tour concert playing to a crowd of less than 10 or even 15,000.

Also Philadelphia and Indianappolis (spelling?) are not small cities.

Thu Jun 26, 2003 11:43 pm

Well- just a few audience figures from 1977:-

Feb 13 77 West Palm Beach 5,981
Feb 14 77 St. Petersburg 8,355
Feb 15 77 Orlando 8,000
Feb 17 77 Savannah 8,052
Feb 19 77 Johnson City 7,000
Mar 24 77 Amarillo 7,349
Mar 24 77 Abilene 7,500
Mar 28 77 Austin 6,000

And 12 more untill death.

Over the same time span 35 concerts gained more than 10,000 audience.

So 36% of concerts had below 10,000 and 64% above.

Figures

Thu Jun 26, 2003 11:54 pm

Good gracious Kiwi!
That is quite a list of stats you posted. You must have really felt passionate about this subject. To drudge up all of those figures and then break them down into percentages....whew.
Say, you wouldn't happen to be writing a sequel to Goldmans book would you? I believe you have just the right mindset to follow up what Goldman started.

Tony

Fri Jun 27, 2003 12:21 am

Just interested in a little accuracy - that's all :D

I get fed up with exaggerated hyperbole with Elvis.

He does not need this - his achievements are enough.

Instead of playing the same small towns over and over again to generally small udiences - a world tour or two in STADIUMS would have gained huge crowds, better record sales and a much greater monetary return.

One concert in London or Rio would attract more than a whole tour of Smallsville USA :!:

Fri Jun 27, 2003 12:31 am

One concert in London or Rio would attract more than a whole tour of Smallsville USA



Smallville is the rural town where I grew up.

CK

Fri Jun 27, 2003 1:12 am

I beg to differ Kiwi this is not exaggeration. Elvis was Billboard's #1 live money maker for 1977. The chart is reprinted in Joe Tunzi's book Elvis #1. He pretty much couldn't do that by playing small venues.

assesment

Fri Jun 27, 2003 1:40 am

I agree with your last post Kiwi. Know matter his appearance he would have ruled overseas. I think it is quite a testament to Elvis that he never appeared overseas but is as popular in Europe and other lands as he is in the US where we were spoiled with live appearances.

Tony

Fri Jun 27, 2003 1:59 am

KiwiAlan wrote:Well- just a few audience figures from 1977:-

Feb 13 77 West Palm Beach 5,981
Feb 14 77 St. Petersburg 8,355
Feb 15 77 Orlando 8,000
Feb 17 77 Savannah 8,052
Feb 19 77 Johnson City 7,000
Mar 24 77 Amarillo 7,349
Mar 24 77 Abilene 7,500
Mar 28 77 Austin 6,000

And 12 more untill death.

Over the same time span 35 concerts gained more than 10,000 audience.

So 36% of concerts had below 10,000 and 64% above.


Other venues of 10,000 + ..........

29 May 1977
12,841

30 May 1977
10,300

01 June 1977
10,242

02 June 1977
11,000

18 June 1977
17,000

19 June 1977
10,604

21 June 1977
10,000

23 June 1977
11,000

24 June 1977
10,000

In addition to Cincinnati & Indy. Smaller and smaller venues ........... hmmmm, .................. :?

Selective use of the data / facts can serve to paint a skewed portrait to suit almost any agenda.

KiwiAlan wrote:I get fed up with exaggerated hyperbole with Elvis.


As do I, .......... on both ends of the spectrum.


N8
... just a fan ....

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:11 am

I get fed up with people making statements with no basis in fact which happens with Elvis all the time. I heard Elvis was lazy. Then I find out he lavished 40 takes on an individual song and had a recording schedule that made other artists look like turtles. I heard Elvis had no sense of quality control. Then I find out that he considered a record like "One Night" only a work tape. I heard Elvis didn't make good anything good after he came home from the army. Then I heard "Elvis is Back". I heard Elvis was a racist. Yet every piece of actual evidence I've encountered has contrasted with that view.

And in this context I heard Elvis was washed up commercially in the 70s. Yet somehow this artist no one had any interest in put 38 LPs on the charts more than any artist in any decade ever. Then I hear he was a freak show taken farther away from the major markets. Then I see he played Chicago, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh and Indianappolis in the last year or so of his life. And he's the #1 live artist of 1977 according to Billboard.

The hyperbole works far more the other way. Say something disparaging about Elvis and it sticks.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:13 am

I would be remiss for not adding that 18,000+ were in attendance for Elvis's final show in Louisville on May 21.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:13 am

to N880EP

Read my post carefully - I was responding to Likeabike who couldn't recall Elvis paying to "less than 10 or even 15 thousand" - I just quoted a few examples and DID point out that 64% of concerts achieved over 10,000.

To Likeabike - who said
"""
I beg to differ Kiwi this is not exaggeration. Elvis was Billboard's #1 live money maker for 1977. The chart is reprinted in Joe Tunzi's book Elvis #1. He pretty much couldn't do that by playing small venues."""

Sorry to let the facts get in the way - but theses are the actual attandance figures, the actual dates and the actual towns. Not a guess and not conjecture.

Also I fear you must be mis-quoting Tunzi somehow. Considering his then relative appeal and the fact he only worked half of 1977 to claim that Elvis "won" the live audience stakes in 1977 beggars belief - considering that The Eagles, Elton John, Bee Gees, Rod Stewart, ABBA were at their popularity height and packing in Stadiums - not to mention the has been Stones and McCartney etc.

Let's be a little real

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:36 am

Not bothered about the figures thrown about here, but weren't all these shows sold out? One thing I remember is hearing Elvis shows were always sold out. Am I wrong.
Are you saying Elvis wouldn't get the attendance that McCarney or Elton John or Eagles would. I don't agree. He would pack the places.


8)

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:53 am

'''
Are you saying Elvis wouldn't get the attendance a McCarney or Elton John or Eagles would. I don't agree. He would pack the places
'''

No I never said that - it would be ridiculous. But he never - generally speaking - played the large stadiums.

But look at the massive audience an Elvis concert in Central Park would have attracted - if Paul Simon can grab a million - what price Elvis :!: Two million :?:

Had he toured the world or even played large stadiums in the USA then audiences of close to 100,000 would have been the norm.

Back in the 70's every headline act that played Stadia in New Zealand had an audince between 20 and 50 thousand.

Elvis could have creamed them all - anywhere in the world.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 7:58 am

OK thanks I understand now, and agree he could have pulled huge crowds if he did the stadiums. A world tour would have been awesome.
The crowds and the hype etc.


8)

Fri Jun 27, 2003 8:04 am

There's nothing to misquote it's a straight up reproduction of the chart from December 24 1977. The caption states showing Elvis as the No.1 live artist of 1977.
1. Elvis Presley
2. Fleetwood Mac
3. Yes
4. Peter Frampton
5. Emerson, Lake and Palmer
6. Boston
7. Lynyrd Skynyrd
8. Ted Nugent
9. P-Funk
10. Kiss

An accompanying chart on the next page shows Elvis drawing 19,600 in Chicago for $264,050 in total revenue the biggest draw in a stadium between 6-20,000 that week May 8 1977. An asterisk is by the the reference to denote a sell out.

The only concert that week to play to a bigger crowd was a festival featuring Fleetwood Mac, the Doobie Brothers, Gary Wright and Steve Gibbons.

Finally, the Colonel waited a long time to book a large stadium but the 1975 concert at the Silverdome set a record for a single performer that stood for 10 years drawing somewhere in the area of 60,000 fans.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 8:22 am

There is something very, very strange about this list.

Where are The Eagles? Stones? McCartney? ABBA? Rod Stewart? Elton Jhn? - all BIG in 1977.

Perhaps the answer lies in your post

"""
An accompanying chart on the next page shows Elvis drawing 19,600 in Chicago for $264,050 in total revenue the biggest draw in a stadium between 6-20,000 that week May 8 1977. An asterisk is by the the reference to denote a sell out

"""

"THE BIGGEST DRAW IN A STADIUM BETWEEN 6-20,000"

Is this chart in fact just for venues below 20,000? Is that why Indianapolis is not counted?

Then it makes sense.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 8:45 am

I have absolutely no idea what you meant by that comment. The only concert on the above 20,000 chart is the festival. Here in the states artists were still working out stadium gigs. Most shows in big stadiums over 20,000 people were generally multi-artist deals. If you look at Springsteen he only really started moving into stadiums on his 1980 tour for "The River". He was a performer at the peak of his career and most of his show were in the 6-20,000 area.

I will clarify though; the chart with the Chicago entry was a weekly not a yearly chart 5/8/77. The chart with positions 1-10 was the year end chart.

Don't quite understand the ABBA obsession. I don't know where you live they might have been bigger but here in the states, ABBA was not really an important act. From 1974 to 1982 they had a respectable 14 Top 40 Hits four of which made the Top 10. They had their biggest hit and only #1 "Dancing Queen" in 1977 but I would be stunned to see them on any kind of top live performers list.

The Stones toured in 1978 for "Some Girls". I don't know if they were on the road or not in 1977. I don't know what McCartney was doing but I do know in '76 he became the first rival artist to mount a sell out concert in a city Elvis was playing.

Also it is worth noting because somebody spends $1, $2 on a single doesn't mean that they will turn out to see that person in concert.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 8:49 am

hey kiwi, I was just checking out my Elvis #1 book by J. Tunzi and this info is there under "Elvis live" on page 240!
it states that, for arenas (6,000 - 20,000), Elvis was #1 and Bob Segar #2 followed by Boston at #3 etc...

fleetwood mac got #1 for festivals and/or staduims 20,000 or more, but on page 241, it does show a list for week ending Dec. 24, '77, Elvis as the #1 Live artist that year! amazing, if u ask me and quite impressive considering Elvis' poor appearance, there was still a demand for the KING! only makes u think if he had lived "what if...."

Fri Jun 27, 2003 9:00 am

It is amazing :!: But good news.

If only...

Fri Jun 27, 2003 10:37 am

Interesting that KISS is in 10th place :!: :!: :!: Oh well, I guess KISS wasn't as big as I thought. Still it is hard to believe. Considering it was their commercial peak. They seemed much bigger than that to me at the time.

I do know one thing, I am sending out some email in regards to Elvis. Amazing how the supposed Has been was not actually that way at all.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 12:45 pm

genesim, 10th place isn't bad. Kiss were still pretty big. But Elvis was always N0.1. :wink:



8)

Fri Jun 27, 2003 3:40 pm

ALT+CTRL+DEL
Last edited by vinyljunkie on Fri Jan 23, 2004 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Fri Jun 27, 2003 3:41 pm

likethebike wrote:
I agree with you N. This was stated without corroboration in the Goldman book and people have accepted it for years. The Colonel may have featured Elvis in smaller cities but the arenas were just as large. I don't know of any Elvis tour concert playing to a crowd of less than 10 or even 15,000.


I'm not positive but I think I read the info about Elvis playing smaller venues in Jerry Hopkins book "Elvis - The Final Years".
I never read Goldman's book.

(thanks for the information from both KiwiAlan and N880EP)

Does anyone know why Elvis didn't play New York City after 1972?

Fri Jun 27, 2003 3:49 pm

Hopkins' "Elvis - The Final Years" & "Elvis In Hawaii" both leave a lot to be desired. The latter, especially, is a sorry excuse for a "book." Hack job would be more appropriate. Hopkins and inaccuracies seem to go hand in hand.


N8
... just a fan ....