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Michael Jackson's "Ultimate Collection" lies about

Mon Jul 04, 2005 12:23 pm

It is stated on the front cover of this box set. I wonder how can they say this absolute lie. Maybe he is the biggest selling LIFE solo artist.
I think Sony/Bmg or EPE should ask Jackson's label to rectify. Yes, it's difficult to talk about exact numbers in sales, but it is clear and generally recognized that Elvis is the biggest selling solo artist of all time, so they are lying and they must be asked to rectify because they are stealing an achievement that doesn't belong to Michael Jackson and as a result they are hurting Elvis' image.

Mon Jul 04, 2005 2:01 pm

Ramiro -

Your post would be better if you told us what was stated on the front cover !

Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:11 pm

hahaha yeah i was thinking that.
Im guessing that they put 'Jacko is the biggest selling artist' ever.

I wouldnt worry cause everyone knows its Elvis.
I dont think im gonna lose sleep over it.
Sean

Mon Jul 04, 2005 9:24 pm

There is a case to make for Michael Jackson having the most sales of anyone ever. There is also a case to make for Elvis Presley and Garth Brooks. I think Garth Brooks is in the world record books for having the most. Let MJ have his album cover. It doesn't demean Elvis in any way.

Mon Jul 04, 2005 9:46 pm

I reckon that the world all-time sales record must go to Elvis.

The nearest contenders are surely The Beatles.

Unfortunately, the subject is surrounded in myth and secrecy.

This suits the record companies fine, as they can all make their claims unchallenged.

Note that RCA/BMG/Sony never give any breakdown of their '1 billion records sold' claim for Elvis.

This relies on a surely fictional 600 million sales in the US !

We know the RIAA figures are on the low side, but however generously they are interpreted, and how ever many 'lost sales' are allowed for, it seems an impossible total to reach !

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:10 pm

Joeroberts,

Sorry , there isnt a case for Jackson at all.
Just cause the biggest selling album'Thriller' has worldwide sales of 50million units doesnt make him a contender for the biggest selling artist ever.

When Elvis passed away in 1977, it was estimated that his worldwide album/singles sales were at least 500miilion .
In 1984, it was confirmed that Elvis worldwide record sales had passed 1 Billion units.Over 20 years ago!!!!!!!!
Wasnt Elvis presented with an award in 1977 for having his 2 billionth record pressed?.That was before anyone had heard of the CD.
Elvis is still selling millions of CDs around the world, not just in th US.
There arent many artists around who can spread their sales to different countries like Elvis can.
His worldwide sales must have past '2Billion' by now.

Sean

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:29 pm

Sean Ryan wrote:Joeroberts,

Wasnt Elvis presented with an award in 1977 for having his 2 billionth record pressed?.That was before anyone had heard of the CD.
Elvis is still selling millions of CDs around the world, not just in th US.
There arent many artists around who can spread their sales to different countries like Elvis can.
His worldwide sales must have past '2Billion' by now.

Sean


Actually, I think Elvis was awarded a framed version of the blue vinyl pressing of the Moody Blue album that just happened to be the 2 billionth record manufactured by RCA. That is all the records ever manufactured by RCA taken a whole. Not all of them were Elvis Presley records. The presentation was done by a local record plant manager. The presentation took place in Indianopolis before Elvis's last concert. I believe it was also filmed by the CBS filmcrew.

The Beatles was reported to have sold over 1 billion records in 1984 but that does not mean that they actually had sold that many records. The figure was achieved by breaking down each album as single records. That is 6 or 7 seven singles per album. That means multipling the the number of the album sales 6 or 7 times plus the actual singles sold. In 1987 it was reported that Elvis had sold over 1,3 billion records worldwide and I believe same kind of method was used there as on the Beatles record sales.

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:35 pm

Marko,

Thanks for putting me right on the award Elvis got.I didnt realise it was for all the RCA presses.

I did think that the Beatles were given that 1billion sales news in 1987 not 1984.

I never get into the Elvis vs.The Beatles arguement but im happy to say that Elvis is the biggest selling recording artist ever and The Beatles are the biggest selling band ever.

I dont think anyone would argue with either of those two statements. :wink:

Sean

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:57 pm

Er...what does the Jackson cover say?

Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:13 am

KiwiAlan,

I think they are trying to convince the buyer that Jacko is the biggest selling artist ever.
I did hear that he is being taken to court for that accusation but its proberly likely that he will get off with it. :lol:

Sean

Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:42 am

Sean -

You wrote:
....im happy to say that Elvis is the biggest selling recording artist ever and The Beatles are the biggest selling band ever.

I dont think anyone would argue with either of those two statements.


Well, no, but it would be nice to know the totals for each act !

And the breakdown, record by record.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:47 am

Could someone please quote what is on the cover?

Not what we think it says.

We could be arguing a non happening here.

And if it is wrong then by all means Sony (elvis' label) should castigate Sony(jacksons label) :D

Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:59 am

For what it's worth, I too, have seen the MJ box set cover and, to the best of my recollection, it does state, on a big red sticker, that this collection is the First retrospective collection from the biggest selling music artist of all time!!!

The box set, released in 2004, seems to be deleted or pulled from circulation. I have not seen this set in any of the major record chains in the past year, except for 1 in Wal Mart about 6 months ago.

And, according to soundscan, this MJ collection has only only scanned 57,000 units since released!

Hell, Elvis' box sets sell that many, or more, with liitle or next to nuthin' promo from BMG!!! :lol:

I wouldn't worry too much...

Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:29 am

I find stats to be confusing and self serving. Having said that, a google search shows that RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) lists Elvis album sales at #2, with sales of 116 million.

Even if the specs are off, Jackson is way off #1. His sales show 59 million albums in 16th place.

If he's number 1 worldwide, it sure ain't coming from the USA.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 8:37 am

TCB Ted -

You wrote:
RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) lists Elvis album sales at #2, with sales of 116 million.


Actually, as of January 8th, 2004, it was 117.5 million.

It's all here:

http://www.riaa.com/news/newsletter/010804.asp

But, as we've discussed on here many times, the RIAA figures are way low.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 9:10 am

They're especially way low because for some perverse reason the RIAA doesn't count singles sales in its estimates. Actually, I guess it isn't that perverse as just using album sales jacks up the current artists the industry wants to promote.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 9:14 am

It reads on the sleeve..
"The First and only Career-spanning Box set from the Best selling solo artist of all time !"

THRILLER is the biggest selling album in the world, but that doesn't make wacko the biggest selling solo artist of all time. Only in his mind.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 9:21 am

Jove -

Well, they must have documentary evidence to back up that statement, otherwise they can be sued [in the UK] under the Trades Description Act [choke] !

Tue Jul 05, 2005 9:23 am

Jove wrote:It reads on the sleeve..
"The First and only Career-spanning Box set from the Best selling solo artist of all tune"


man, I was close! 8)

Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:43 am

It's a shame we will never have the complete sales figures for Elvis. They didn't care so much back in the fifties about statistics. Anyway Elvis has sold the most records and have the most gold records etc. And most importantly he has been the most important artist in history so far and I doubt that anyone can ever be of equal importance for the music culture. He affected what music people listened to, what clothes the wore, how the hair looked like etc. The music industry itself developed because of him. Suddenly you could buy all sorts of things with his name or image on it. TV was used as a tool to market his music. He went to Hollywood and movies were made around his person and world.

Since then people and artists have used all this in making music. Things we now take for granted didn't exist when Elvis made history. Elvis even made history with his satellite show in 1973 but today nobody thinks about that. "Satellite? So what? I watch satellite shows all the time" . It's getting harder and harder to realize and acknowledge Elvis' importance for music and culture. But nobody has ever meant so much and probably never will even if they sell 10 billion records.

Just think about how many records Elvis may have sold if today's technology and marketing channels were available back when he made it! He changed the music (not alone of course but he was the front figure) and he still has importance and inspires musicians and people in different fields. OK there was a musical revolution in the sixties too but not as big as the one in the fifties. Most of the sixties musicians (like the Stones, the Beatles) was inspired by the blues and rock music from the fifties and just added a little to that.

So Wacko Jacko can count his records anyway he want to but I will not be impressed. The Thriller album was a great achievement and he have a few good songs but I have never really been impressed by the "boy" behind the image.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 1:05 pm

ElvisAhlgren -

You wrote:
They didn't care so much back in the fifties about statistics.


Oh, it comes a lot more recent than that !

They've lost the documentation for the massive sales immediately following his death !

Mind you, RCA/BMG/Sony/Ernst/Roger know the figures all right.

They just don't have the audited documentation to prove them to the RIAA !

That's all.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 3:40 pm

Sorry to all but when I posted this thread I had some problems because (I don't know why) the system didn't allow me to put the entire subject, and then when I copied the message body from another messageboard I was not aware that what the front cover of "Ultimate Collection" was not there. I had not a good day and I even posted by error many times the same thread. Sorry to all you.
The front cover says that Michael Jackson is the biggest selling solo artist of all time. Independently of the problems that sales figures have to make them accurate, we all know and the media, records' books, etc... that Elvis is the unquestionable biggest selling solo artist in history, so we can without any fear that Michael Jackson's label is LYING and if they want to say that MJ is the biggest selling LIFE solo artist, then they must to put it and not lie making confusion and stealing achievements that does not belong to MJ. So I think it is not crazy for EPE or Sony/BMG to ask MJ's label to rectify or put a lawsuit because this policy causes hurt in Elvis' image because one of his main signatures in world's music is being the best selling artist in history and of course that includes by far being the best selling solo artist in history without discussion.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:51 pm

Could MJ and his label/managment be sued in the United States?

Did E sell more singles in the Fifties, because most teens couldn't afford albums ?

Don't you just hate the music charts today?
Platinum awards for sales that would have meant Gold back in the days. Now that's what I call upgrading and it gets to the head of certain artists and PR people. And in some cases manipuliting the charts with mass purchases.

Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:43 pm

It was more than likely Jacko's idea to put on the boxset' The biggest selling artist of all time'.
He actually believes his own hype.
Jackson is totally from another planet and not living in the real world.
He portrays himself bigger than even Jesus.He has a portrait of the last supper with him instead of Jesus. :roll:
I think the general public dont take him seriously any more.
He will never capture his greatness again.

Sean

Tue Jul 05, 2005 7:19 pm

Here is his rendition of 'The Last Supper'. His disciples include Abraham Lincoln, JFK, Thomas Edison, Albert Einstein, Walt Disney, Charlie Chaplin, Elvis and Little Richard. :evil:

Image


Dog Bite Suit

If you would like to send MJ an angry letter, he currently is in Bahrain as guest of the royal family.

And be sure not to look for his new Greatest Hits CD (8 and counting :roll: ) later this month.